California's political prisoners.... (San Francisco, Berkeley, Maricopa: insurance, crime rates, employment)

[mother of a 3-striker...]

His crimes happened 12 years ago when he was immature and needed drug and alcohol rehab. He has been incarcerated since then and has seen the errors of his ways. He is now 37. He has been paying his debt back to society for his crimes. Staying in prison another 13 years is excessive punishment that doesn't fit the crime.

[FunkyMonk]

I agree that these laws are too harsh, and pointless.

For one thing, it costs tax payers a lot of money.

Prison also makes these criminals much, much more hardcore. If you send a petty robber to prison for a while. He will often come out with a murderers mindset, which he learned inside prison. In this way, prison creates a more violent society. Prison is basically like criminal college, they learn the tricks, make connections, learn new crimes, etc. And these days there are a LOT of people getting this kind of education.

For 2 robbery charges and evading arrest, I can understand maybe 5-7 years, but 25? That is a looooong time for that. by about the 10th year I think the lesson has been learned.

There does need to be a distinction between violent and non-violent crimes. You can be young, immature and wreckless, like lots of us were, and go away for life for petty reasons.

I also think we need to change the way our prisons operate so people stay out of them in the first place and don't come out even worse. But that's another topic.

Brutal, long, strict punishment isn't the answer and it is obviously not working. We need a new approach.

[sheri257]

I work for the state prison system ...

Big Picture: we release these guys. In this economy, who's going to hire them? With thousands of people with NO criminal record out of work ... who's going to hire criminals over legitimate applicants?

No one.

Believe me ... the druggies are going to do everything they can to get their drugs so ... the crime rate WILL go up. The only time these guys get off of drugs (at least for awhile) is when they are in prison.

As for supposedly non-violent offenders ... we just had to ship one out for ... guess what? Violent behavior. Some of the worst incidents we've had is with inmates with the lowest points (meaning, lowest risk) in the system. Why? They get more privileges and have more opportunities.

You don't know everything an inmate has actually done ... just what they've been convicted of. An inmate may have a supposedly "non-violent" history but if that history includes weapons possession (which it did in this case) ... what's he using the weapons for? Violence.

[sheri257]

Originally Posted by FunkyMonk

Prison also makes these criminals much, much more hardcore. If you send a petty robber to prison for a while. He will often come out with a murderers mindset, which he learned inside prison. In this way, prison creates a more violent society. Prison is basically like criminal college, they learn the tricks, make connections, learn new crimes, etc. And these days there are a LOT of people getting this kind of education.

Nah ... not really. For all you know, the inmate has already committed murder but ... we just don't know about it. 70 percent of inmates come back either due to parole violations or new crimes. Don't fool yourself into thinking that these are generally good people.

However ... there are inmates who truly rehabilitate ... the real success stories. They are typically the inmate firefighters that you read about in the paper.

They are the inmates who stay out of trouble, follow the rules, do their time and they do succeed.

By your account ... they would also become murderers just because of the system but, in fact, they don't.

[Lovehound]

Originally Posted by mother of a 3-striker...

Did you know that there are still thousands of non-violent men and women serving 25-years –to-life sentences in California’s prison system. It’s the only state that warehouses criminals for crimes like joyriding, petty theft, attempted burglary, receiving stolen property, making criminal threats and petty drug possession.

No, I didn't know that, but I'm glad to see that we've jailed thousands of human pieces of crap and locked them away from preying on the innocent public.

Now if we could add just another 10- to 20-thousand, particularly if they could all be gang bangers, we just might have a good start on solving the problem of the the most worthless part of our society victimizing decent, honest, working people.

Good job California! I'd be willing to pay a bit more taxes if we could put some more of these worthless people in jail for life. Is executing them too much to hope for?

[happ]

3 strikes was a reactionary attempt to curtail crime. Putting people away in a violent\ boredom prison environment is pointless if they return to a state in depression. Parolees get $200 & a bus ticket home. Crime is nothing more than dollars & common sense. When people are well-cared for [universal health insurance\ affordable housing\ employment protection-unions\ extensive school programs-youth sports-tutoring-counseling] the crime will be comparable to Europe.

Simple solution!

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by happ

3 strikes was a reactionary attempt to curtail crime. Putting people away in a violent\ boredom prison environment is pointless if they return to a state in depression. Parolees get $200 & a bus ticket home. Crime is nothing more than dollars & common sense. When people are well-cared for [universal health insurance\ affordable housing\ employment protection-unions\ extensive school programs-youth sports-tutoring-counseling] the crime will be comparable to Europe.

Simple solution!

Crime is on the increase in Europe... Shop keepers that NEVER had to worry about theft now do...

Violent Riots and torching cars make the news...

If it's true that crime is nothing more than dollars and common sense... how do so many in similar circumstances rise above it

[humboldtrat]

Originally Posted by happ

When people are well-cared for [universal health insurance\ affordable housing\ employment protection-unions\ extensive school programs-youth sports-tutoring-counseling] the crime will be comparable to Europe.

Are you going to pay for this?? Maybe people should stop waiting for the government to come to the rescue and be responsible and take care of themselves.

I say let the "political" prisoner stay in the slammer and maybe he'll figure out that there are consequences for his actions.

[mother of a 3-striker...]

Criminal college is right. Non-violent 3-strikers are considered lifers and thrown in with murders and gangbangers. It becomes survival of the fittist. Only the ones with a strong inner spirit can survive the evil. Racism is the worst. They all join their racial groups and if one doesn't cooperate with his/her group they are ostracized by the group. The smart ones stay away from the groups and keep to themselves. They become paranoid, always having to watch their own backs. Some of them can be productive and positive with jobs and duties that help them stay out of the mainstream and out of trouble. Many of these 3-strikers have good families, wives, children and friends at home who have been waiting years to help their person get back to legitimate society. 10 to 15 years is long enough for non-violent offenders to stay put away. Even they deserve to have the chance to try again.

[BennyPhoenix]

To be caught 3 times means that he probably committed at least a few dozen crimes, but was only convicted 3 times.
Burglary is extremely serious. Let's say while committing a burglary that he encountered an armed homeowner and he fought the homeowner and then the homeowner was shot and killed? He becomes a murderer, even if only burglary was his intention.

I am for 3 strikes. You have to be very foolish to commit and keep commiting crimes after you have 2 strikes.