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When the President of the United States chooses to insert himself into the discussion, and the AG chooses to gin up the rhetoric, and the NAACP is encouraging protests . . . I believe it is, indeed, a national outcry, at least by part of society.
A pandering president looking for distractions and the NAACP don't hold much interest for me and IMO, most people in the USA. They are more concerned about losing their job, paying their bills, education for their children, caring for aging parents, whatever. The sensalization of a self defense trial taking place in a small town in Florida, is irrelevant to the vast majority of the people in America.
It's not widespread based on the numbers because most people believe in what they see and not what the media and the President tells them to believe. I feel sorry for the ones that do succumb. On those lines, I recommend you watch what this NYC Black Pastor and native of NC has to say on this issue.
I don't know that GZ was "emboldened by law," b/c Stand Your Ground had nothing to do with this, and I am assuming that is what you are referring to.
If you believe witnesses that TM was on top of GZ beating his head on the cement, then what occurred was self-defense, which has nada to do with "stand your ground."
Eric Holder has entered the strawman argument of "stand your ground" as a tactic to keep discussion going and to cover that he doesn't have grounds for a federal civil rights case.
I have a hard time believing Trayvon was on top of GZ bashing his head in the concrete. I know GZ is the only witness but it sure seems like everyone believes a guy who ignored 91` instructions to stay in his car, a guy who was arrested for domestic violence, resisting arrest without violence and resisting arrest with violence.
His testimony is all we have to go on... but there is a reason he didnt take the stand.
As far as SYG laws or self defense laws make sense if you are minding your business and are attacked. However, if you are going to play cops and robbers and follow people around antagonizing them or start a fight and feel like your life is in jeopardy because you are losing it shouldnt give you the right to kill someone who doesnt have a weapon.
I also think anyone with a son needs to think twice about how justice was served. Basically any stranger with a gun can follow your kid around... demand they answer questions, etc. The only thing a kid can do is try to run home or do whatever the adult tells them to do and they can even physically hold you against your will.
I have a hard time believing Trayvon was on top of GZ bashing his head in the concrete. I know GZ is the only witness but it sure seems like everyone believes a guy who ignored 91` instructions to stay in his car, a guy who was arrested for domestic violence, resisting arrest without violence and resisting arrest with violence.
His testimony is all we have to go on... but there is a reason he didnt take the stand.
As far as SYG laws or self defense laws make sense if you are minding your business and are attacked. However, if you are going to play cops and robbers and follow people around antagonizing them or start a fight and feel like your life is in jeopardy because you are losing it shouldnt give you the right to kill someone who doesnt have a weapon.
I also think anyone with a son needs to think twice about how justice was served. Basically any stranger with a gun can follow your kid around... demand they answer questions, etc. The only thing a kid can do is try to run home or do whatever the adult tells them to do and they can even physically hold you against your will.
Where did you get that info? As far as I know, your last paragraph is erroenous. If someone is following anyone, it can be reported as stalking. And no one can stop and detain anyone, adult or child, much less physically hold you. Is there something you have read somwhere that indicated that is a lawful activity? Even police officers have to show "cause" - people cannot just be illegally detained, especially not by another citizen.
Or maybe I read what you wrote incorrectly, Felt? Trying to understand.
PS. there is no requirement that a person take the stand in his/her own defense, and in my experience, most attorneys advise their clients not to - no matter how "innocent" they may be. In fact, I believe most judges will instruct the jury that the law in no way requires that, and that it should not influence or affect the jury members as to whether or not a defendant takes the stand. Pretty sure I am right about that. I find it disturbing that people would just assume a person who doesn't take the stand has something to hide. I always assume that it is such an emotional and difficult time, most of us would be rattled and may LOOK uncomfortable (and be read as hiding something by the jury) or would be so stressed out that we are checking our words carefully and thus, again, look like we are hesitating or "covering" when we are simply nervous. So I never hold that against a defendant.
Amazing to me that people insist on bringing up OJ. Rational Black and White people EVERYWHERE knew that OJ was guilty as sin but that the defense did an excellent job planting reasonable doubt giving the jury no way to go but to acquit.
Just as rational Black and White people everywhere know that the Zimmerman defense did an excellent job creating reasonable doubt giving the jury no choice but an acquittal.
Both cases fail morally in part because of the action/inaction of the police departments. Both defendants killed innocent people and are morally wrong, imo.
I can understand the verdicts and still feel that justice was not served.
And Z's head wasn't on the concrete, they were in the grass in the back/side yard area. No concrete anywhere near by
To me the 'NO JUSTICE NO PEACE' chant is a threat.
The Martin/Zimmerman type conflict will never be resolved until we all listen to each other and acknowledge that we each have our own prejudices instead of accepting the facts. Some people believe TM was an innocent kid that was killed for 'looking suspicious'; but they refuse to acknowledge that the facts show he threw the first punch and that he was on top of GZ when shot. I don't think anyone believes TM deserved to die but the jury found that GZ was not guilty of murder. I believe both parties actions resulted in the death of TM.
I am white and I have a son. I remember a few years back a conversation I had with the (black) mom of a friend of my sons. I won't go into details however, she explained to me that both blacks and whites 'profile' black boys as more suspicious than whites. She said she expected her son to dress nice, no baggy pants, no gang type signs, no rap music, etc. because she knew how many black boys were looked upon and she was not going to have her son become a statistic. BTW - her son is currently doing well and is an upcoming senior at UNC.
The result of the Martin/Zimmerman conflict is that a young man lost his life, both families have been torn apart and race relations are as bad as they ever were. Sad.
Yep... and this is exactly why most whites reference the OJ trial. The OJ trial is a prime example of what blacks feel when justice isnt served. Funny how its the only trial that is brought up when having this discussion.
Because it's the most famous and a trial that, if mentioned, everyone knows about.
The difference is, no one took to the streets to hold rallies or protests. The other big difference is that, in the OJ Simpson case, Blacks actually CELEBRATED the "not guilty" verdict and were celebrating the fact that OJ Simpson murdered two innocent White people and got away with it. No one "celebrated" the 'not guilty' verdict in this case.
This Zimmerman should call that guy from Seinfeld and just ask how much it costs to buy your way out of national race issues..
Sorry for pointing out the irony.. I do agree if you call the cops based on clothing and skin-color and ignore police and follow and shoot the person dead because they punch you in the face post-confrontation, it's logically and morally racism and murder.. Good luck chanding the verdict against a wealthy person who has sympathy from the social majority..
Last edited by SunnyKayak; 07-21-2013 at 01:47 PM..
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