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Because we sin we die - Ezekiel 18:4,20 - and we can Not resurrect oneself or another, so we need someone who can resurrect us, and Jesus can and will - Revelation 1:18
So, Jesus' ransom - Matthew 20:28 - saves ( rescues / delivers ) us from our sins and our death.
Some people will have a first or earlier resurrection to heaven - Rev. 20:6; 5:9-10, but the majority of mankind can have a healthy physical resurrection back to life on earth starting with Jesus' 1,000 year governmental rulership over earth.
Those of us who are still alive on earth and have Jesus' favor at the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth - Matthew 25:31-32 - can remain alive on earth, living right into the start of Jesus' millennium-long day of governing over earth.
- Psalm 72:8, 12-14.
Why are you quoting verses that mention being saved but with no reference to being saved from hell.
To which hell are you referring? The Bible's temporary hell, or the non-biblical permanent hell of burning forever ?
Who saved the dead Jesus from biblical hell ? ________- Acts 3:15
While alive Jesus taught ' sleep ' ( Not pain ) in death - John 11:11-14
Jesus was well educated in the old Hebrew Scriptures which also teach sleep in death:
- Psalms 115:17; 146:4; Daniel 12:2,13; Ecclesiastes 9:5
If the Bible's hell was permanent then Jesus would still be in hell - Acts 2:27; 31-32
Because Jesus died a faithful death, Jesus now has the keys to unlock biblical hell - Revelation 1:18
According to Rev. 20:13-14 the Bible's hell comes to a final end.
After everyone in biblical hell is ' delivered up ' out of hell, then emptied-out hell ( the grave ) is cast vacant into a symbolic ' second death ' for vacated hell. That is then the end of ' enemy death ' - 1st Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8
The ONLY scripture that existed at the time that was written was the OT and its purpose was to prepare us for and to teach us about Christ so we coudl identify Him and validate Him once He appeared . . . you know the "Writings that testify of Him." NONE of the NT is scripture, per se. It is to teach us about Christ so we would know the Father through the "mind of Christ." It also tells us of the New Covenant instituted by Christ wherein Christ abides with us as the Comforter sent in His name to guide us to the truth God has "written in our hearts" so we do not need anyone to teach us. You and the mainstream churches are so far off-base with your "precepts and doctrines of men" corrupting the pure agape love message of reconciliation in Christ's Gospel. Your use of the context of a wrathful God who required a blood sacrifice of a horrendous scourging and crucifixion to appease Him is nothing but barbaric and savage nonsense!!! There will be a heavy burden for those who have promoted that false Gospel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanJP
That's right, plus what was being written by the Apostles at that time as Peter states in 2 Peter 3; Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
Not off base, just knowledgeable when it comes to scriptures and how the Holy Spirit DOES direct and instruct through and by them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanJP
Already gave you those, but tell me, are you saved? Have you actually confessed Jesus Christ as your God and Saviour?
There is the magic question revealing a true fundie. Answer it wrong, as Dew apparently has and you are magically unimportant. True fundies just spout rote platitudes and magic questions to identify Satan's children and avoid them. What a waste of time it is to converse with such mindless robots! Dew you are lucky. I personally try to avoid such fundies like the plague. There is no value in discussing anything with them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps
Why are you quoting verses that mention being saved but with no reference to being saved from hell. I am not disputing being saved i am disputing and rejecting what you believe that is not there in the scriptures...
Because he hasn't a clue about what he is saved from or why nor any other rational reason for anything he believes, pcamps. He is a true fundie also known as a mindless robot spouting rote platitudes of dogma.
Last edited by MysticPhD; 10-09-2015 at 11:54 PM..
I am glad you asked and rather than being of the wrong spirit and saying i have already said what we are saved from, and if you want to find out where i said it go find it yourself....i will oblige and i hope you see it and believe in the true message of Jesus Christ
What are we saved from ?...Ourselves missing the mark.......
For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.
Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death?(The body you live in is not you)
Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!
Thanks be to God for what? For delivering me from......excuse me for repeating myself.......For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.
First;
Paul is dealing with the LAW in Rom 7 and how he was while under it. v14 is in the perfect tense, and as Strong's states in his exposition as follows; The perfect tense in Greek corresponds to the perfect tense in English, and describes an action which is viewed as having been completed in the past, once and for all, not needing to be repeated.
Jesus' last cry from the cross, TETELESTAI ("It is finished!") is a good example of the perfect tense used in this sense, namely "It [the atonement] has been accomplished, completely, once and for all time." Certain antiquated verb forms in Greek, such as those related to seeing (eidw) or knowing (oida) will use the perfect tense in a manner equivalent to the normal past tense. These few cases are exception to the normal rule and do not alter the normal connotation of the perfect tense stated above.
Second;
There are a multitude of uses for the word 'saved', and not all have the same connotation. However in regards to salvation, in the context of being saved, Mark 16:20 depicts exactly what Jesus' commission was; They went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them, and confirmed the word by the signs that followed. And they promptly reported all these instructions to Peter and his companions. And after that, Jesus Himself sent out through them from east to west the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation.
Jesus is our Saviour and hence our salvation. The moment we do as Paul instructed in Rom 10:9-11, we are saved from the wages of sin, which is eternal death and separation from God. Not confessing Jesus as our saviour and not obeying His commands as a way of life, is what leads to death, and death is where we all end up without salvation. This is clearly found in Rev 20:11-15
So NO, we are not saved from ourselves, we are saved from the results of sin in our lives, which is eternal judgement. Matt 25:46
There is the magic question revealing a true fundie. Answer it wrong, as Dew apparently has and you are magically unimportant. True fundies just spout rote platitudes and magic questions to identify Satan's children and avoid them. What a waste of time it is to converse with such mindless robots! Dew you are lucky. I personally try to avoid such fundies like the plague. There is no value in discussing anything with them.
Because he hasn't a clue about what he is saved from or why nor any other rational reason for anything he believes, pcamps. He is a true fundie also known as a mindless robot spouting rote platitudes of dogma.
The only rote I see is from you and your ilk, and you have a very strange way of avoidance. ALL I can deduce is that you have nothing really to contribute but ad hominems, which is typical of trolls.
Please feel free to contribute usefully, or just don't post at me. Either way I'll be a happy camper.
First;
Paul is dealing with the LAW in Rom 7 and how he was while under it. v14 is in the perfect tense, and as Strong's states in his exposition as follows; The perfect tense in Greek corresponds to the perfect tense in English, and describes an action which is viewed as having been completed in the past, once and for all, not needing to be repeated.
Jesus' last cry from the cross, TETELESTAI ("It is finished!") is a good example of the perfect tense used in this sense, namely "It [the atonement] has been accomplished, completely, once and for all time." Certain antiquated verb forms in Greek, such as those related to seeing (eidw) or knowing (oida) will use the perfect tense in a manner equivalent to the normal past tense. These few cases are exception to the normal rule and do not alter the normal connotation of the perfect tense stated above.
Second;
There are a multitude of uses for the word 'saved', and not all have the same connotation. However in regards to salvation, in the context of being saved, Mark 16:20 depicts exactly what Jesus' commission was; They went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them, and confirmed the word by the signs that followed. And they promptly reported all these instructions to Peter and his companions. And after that, Jesus Himself sent out through them from east to west the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation.
Jesus is our Saviour and hence our salvation. The moment we do as Paul instructed in Rom 10:9-11, we are saved from the wages of sin, which is eternal death and separation from God. Not confessing Jesus as our saviour and not obeying His commands as a way of life, is what leads to death, and death is where we all end up without salvation. This is clearly found in Rev 20:11-15
So NO, we are not saved from ourselves, we are saved from the results of sin in our lives, which is eternal judgement. Matt 25:46
Paul is being truthful with himself..... for as the scripture says....God desires truth in the inward parts. We are under the law of sin and death( not the 10 commandments) until we have that thanks be to God experience like Paul.
. For Jesus Christ did not come to save you from the eternal eternal for it not scriptural but to save you from the law of sin and death. Death being a life without the power to overcome the law of sin and death.
The law of sin and death what Paul cried out to be delivered from is this
For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do.If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find.
I hope this post i am responding too is not a copy and paste without quoting the source.
First;
Paul is dealing with the LAW in Rom 7 and how he was while under it. v14 is in the perfect tense, and as Strong's states in his exposition as follows; The perfect tense in Greek corresponds to the perfect tense in English, and describes an action which is viewed as having been completed in the past, once and for all, not needing to be repeated.
Jesus' last cry from the cross, TETELESTAI ("It is finished!") is a good example of the perfect tense used in this sense, namely "It [the atonement] has been accomplished, completely, once and for all time." Certain antiquated verb forms in Greek, such as those related to seeing (eidw) or knowing (oida) will use the perfect tense in a manner equivalent to the normal past tense. These few cases are exception to the normal rule and do not alter the normal connotation of the perfect tense stated above.
Second;
There are a multitude of uses for the word 'saved', and not all have the same connotation. However in regards to salvation, in the context of being saved, Mark 16:20 depicts exactly what Jesus' commission was; They went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them, and confirmed the word by the signs that followed. And they promptly reported all these instructions to Peter and his companions. And after that, Jesus Himself sent out through them from east to west the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation.
Jesus is our Saviour and hence our salvation. The moment we do as Paul instructed in Rom 10:9-11, we are saved from the wages of sin, which is eternal death and separation from God. Not confessing Jesus as our saviour and not obeying His commands as a way of life, is what leads to death, and death is where we all end up without salvation. This is clearly found in Rev 20:11-15
So NO, we are not saved from ourselves, we are saved from the results of sin in our lives, which is eternal judgement. Matt 25:46
Paul was only dealing with the law of Moses for those who lived under it. Jesus Christ came to set us free(to save us from...... by knowledge of the truth) from the law of sin and death, which you fundamentalists cannot accept because it turns the focus on yourself instead of those you wrongly believe are eternal hell bound.
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