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This is true. Whoever tells you otherwise is teaching a false message. I notice some people already claimed that good works is enough, but it is not true. No one is saved by works alone.
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Originally Posted by David in Christ
Very true. One must believe that Jesus is the Christ, that he IS THE MESSIAH.
THANK YOU! I can't believe there are Christians who don't understand this. It's a bit troubling.
Yeah, as a christian Jesus asks that we believe he is the messiah and to wait on him till he comes again. Good works are good and the Bible says the good works of the saints are before him and that they are numerous, and sure good works earn you stuff in heaven and are filling to the soul while on earth, and faith without works is dead, but Jesus teaches that works alone don't earn you a spot in heaven believing on him is what does it.
Last edited by David in Christ; 01-25-2016 at 08:37 AM..
what about the other things ive posted? what if theres only a 1% chance im right and there is a heaven and hell. isn't it worth looking into?
They're all worth looking into from my perspective, but being presumptous with "major biblical discoveries" on this forum will often times result in the person making the claim being very quickly discredited by the actual known facts of the case because they don't look into it enough or unbiasedly. So far no one has raised any red flags or started making fun of you so maybe you dodged a bullet or no one can find anything to confirm or deny it...but I will say this is not the only "I found the ark" youtube video.
Regarding Heaven and Hell, I've been in that debate for years. One conclusion I've come too is that while it is important as to whether heaven and hell exist and who God is, I don't approach it from the perspective that I might be saving someone from eternal torture by evangelizing. God made the rules from the beginning of time, and if one of the rules he made was that "one sin = eternal torture" (which fundamentalists traditionally belief) and applied it to his created beings he knew full well are imperfect and would fail, then he would have to be so psychotically sadistic he would make Jeffrey Dahmer and Hitler look like saints by comparison. Anyways, becareful in your (new?) faith and don't shut off your brain just because you want to follow your church doctrine without question.
They're all worth looking into from my perspective, but being presumptous with "major biblical discoveries" on this forum will often times result in the person making the claim being very quickly discredited by the actual known facts of the case because they don't look into it enough or unbiasedly. So far no one has raised any red flags or started making fun of you so maybe you dodged a bullet or no one can find anything to confirm or deny it...but I will say this is not the only "I found the ark" youtube video.
Regarding Heaven and Hell, I've been in that debate for years. One conclusion I've come too is that while it is important as to whether heaven and hell exist and who God is, I don't approach it from the perspective that I might be saving someone from eternal torture by evangelizing. God made the rules from the beginning of time, and if one of the rules he made was that "one sin = eternal torture" (which fundamentalists traditionally belief) and applied it to his created beings he knew full well are imperfect and would fail, then he would have to be so psychotically sadistic he would make Jeffrey Dahmer and Hitler look like saints by comparison. Anyways, becareful in your (new?) faith and don't shut off your brain just because you want to follow your church doctrine without question.
you aren't looking at it the right way. he gave everyone free will including the angels who rebelled and tried to overthrow God. believe me, God still loves Satan and all the demons but his justice and righteousness holiness and judgement are perfect..so what they did was so bad it did deserve eternal separation from God. Why it has to be a lake of fire I don't know. we won't know everything until we meet him. none of us were meant to go to hell. and the problem with sin is God's perfection and his inability to dwell among people who sin. All sin is serious and used to require animal sacrifices but lets be real..when you go by God's perfect standard we sin continuously and are enslaved to it. You say God must be sick to make us knowing we can never be perfect. A better way to put it is he literally sent his Son who had to live a perfect life and then be beaten half to death, murdered on a cross, and had God crush him with the full wrath of every single sin anyone will ever commit. That has to be what...in the trillions? Hundreds of trillions? is it even possible to comprehend the pain he endured? He did this for everyone. He is our creator, the key to eternal life and eternal happiness and joy and love. He reveals himself multiple times to everyone and everyone who goes to hell knew at multiple points He is God. you have to remember we are the evil ones by nature who reject/deny him or even serve Satan. would you go through what Jesus did for someone who treats you like that? well, he did. for me, for hitler, for Dahmer, and for you. where you end up for eternity is up to you.
This is true. Whoever tells you otherwise is teaching a false message. I notice some people already claimed that good works is enough, but it is not true. No one is saved by works alone.
Enough for what ? I personally have never met anyone who said that their good works will save from eternal hell or that they hope they will or that good works is enough. No one is saved from eternal hell period anyone who teaches this is teaching a false message because the bible does not teach be saved from eternal hell anymore than it teaches good works will save you from eternal hell. It was never once preached throughout the book of Acts and no one in the scriptures ever testified that they were saved from eternal or asked how they can be saved from it. Yea yea, I know I am hating on you because I am correcting your false beliefs.
you aren't looking at it the right way. he gave everyone free will including the angels who rebelled and tried to overthrow God. believe me, God still loves Satan and all the demons but his justice and righteousness holiness and judgement are perfect..so what they did was so bad it did deserve eternal separation from God. Why it has to be a lake of fire I don't know. we won't know everything until we meet him. none of us were meant to go to hell. and the problem with sin is God's perfection and his inability to dwell among people who sin. All sin is serious and used to require animal sacrifices but lets be real..when you go by God's perfect standard we sin continuously and are enslaved to it. You say God must be sick to make us knowing we can never be perfect. A better way to put it is he literally sent his Son who had to live a perfect life and then be beaten half to death, murdered on a cross, and had God crush him with the full wrath of every single sin anyone will ever commit. That has to be what...in the trillions? Hundreds of trillions? is it even possible to comprehend the pain he endured? He did this for everyone. He is our creator, the key to eternal life and eternal happiness and joy and love. He reveals himself multiple times to everyone and everyone who goes to hell knew at multiple points He is God. you have to remember we are the evil ones by nature who reject/deny him or even serve Satan. would you go through what Jesus did for someone who treats you like that? well, he did. for me, for hitler, for Dahmer, and for you. where you end up for eternity is up to you.
Argh! I can't believe I missed this post...its almost too disturbing to respond to until I realized I use to think the same way...For the record, I've "looked at it" your way for most of my life and found it morally, logically, and in many cases, biblically lacking.
...First of all, do you think God is a cosmic Vampire? If not, why would he ABSOLUTELY require blood sacrifices and the blood of Jesus to magically absolve sin? If he is truly omnipotent as you probably believe he is, he does not "absolutely require" anything and he would have had to specifically choose this system for a specific reason, which in my opinion was perhaps to show what "no greater love" is rather than just being the only possible thing that could absolve us of what he long knew we would have. Now unless he is either extremely sadistic (more so than any sadist in history) or an extremely bad planner. You also have to remember that God himself would have had to make the fundamentalist rule that "one sin = being deserving of eternal torture". Therefore, if he chose this system of redemption for a reason, it probably wasn't only to save people from something is but to also teach us something about him who is Love and while love includes justice, to say that justice is eternal torture for 99% of humanity is quite insane infinitely beyond any known standard of Justice
The next point about what you essentially consider "freewill to choose eternal damnation" is almost laughable when considering the diversity of the world. Saying he gives or has given every single person on the planet a chance to choose him is absurd unless you think he magically told every person (including aboriginees long before white settlers) who he is and what his son did...if you believe that...good luck with that one ;p Now many fundamentalist Christians believe those people weren't necessarily damned because they didn't know and are "judged on what they do know" but that is still incredibly vague and many people are born into another religion being told that Christianity is horrible and aren't smart or brave enough to question anything they believe...just like many Christians who just happened to be lucky enough to be born into a christian home. So here you have the vast majority of the world essentially born into an impossible or nearly impossible situation.
Does this sound like much of a "Choice" to you?...For these people, many of them already have their own religious hells they believe in that are scarier sounding then ours and don't have the resources to Google why our religion is greater.
Lastly for now, I'm well aware of what Jesus may have experienced on the cross and I try to keep that in mind always...but it sounds like you're asking me to ignore the insanely bum deal the God of fundamentalism bestowed upon 90 to 99% of humanity and just say:"...well, it is the way it is...God works in mysterious ways"...well, I say: #&$% that! You eternal torture chamber believing fundamentalists are asking me to believe in a system that, when you really look at it, is even more insane that the belief of a suicide bomber looking forward to their multitude of virgins! I WILL look for biblical alternatives to this madness so I can actually sleep at night and thats what me and the more moderate and progressive Christians here at this forum and elsewhere have done and I hope you will too. Bottom line: God made the rules...all of them! And I'm of the mind that they are probably not be the perfect reflection of my morality and may have some "hard truths", but these hard truths are not so insane that...well..choose any example from above.
At least the publicans, tax collectors and prostitutes of Jesus' day saw that they were. To believe you are not sick because you think you are on the ball with bible doctrine is a sickness that needs a temple clear out.
At least the publicans, tax collectors and prostitutes of Jesus' day saw that they were. To believe you are not sick because you think you are on the ball with bible doctrine is a sickness that needs a temple clear out.
I suspect you have misidentified and misunderstood nate, pcamps.
4 for it is impossible for those once enlightened, having tasted also of the heavenly gift, and partakers having became of the Holy Spirit,
5 and did taste the good saying of God, the powers also of the coming age,
6 and having fallen away, again to renew them to reformation, having crucified again to themselves the Son of God, and exposed to public shame.
7 For earth, that is drinking in the rain many times coming upon it, and is bringing forth herbs fit for those because of whom also it is dressed, doth partake of blessing from God,
8 and that which is bearing thorns and briers is disapproved of, and nigh to cursing, whose end is for burning;
This is speaking of persons who have been baptized with the Holy Spirit and then falling away and back into a life of sin..........a large number of "Christians" have never been baptized with the Holy Spirit and have only an "outer court" experience. This does not apply to them
For those who have been baptized with the Holy Spirit but still fall away..............not a good thing and for many the future is not bright.
However, in the story of the prodigal son who had already received his inheritance before running off, when he repented and started the journey home his father ran to greet him while he was still a ways off
Never underestimate the love of a Father for His children because the only time God ever changes is to repent from passing judgment and give mercy where none is owed
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