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Some people will never give up perverting the word of God. It is best to let them believe whatever they want.
Who on this thread has perverted the word of God? Besides sggraham and yourself, that is? The only references to the word of God that I've seen from others are pretty much spot on. Rather than simply dismiss these folks with typical 'fundie' rhetoric, can you actually show us where those ones you refer to have perverted the word of God? All that people have done on this thread is to say that the sins of Sodom did not (not that we're told anyway) have anything to do with homosexuality. Where are they wrong? You DO have a Bible, don't you?
If you can't supply scripture that indicates that folks here are perverting the word of God, then it might be a good thing for you to apologize to them.
Who on this thread has perverted the word of God? Besides sggraham and yourself, that is? The only references to the word of God that I've seen from others are pretty much spot on. Rather than simply dismiss these folks with typical 'fundie' rhetoric, can you actually show us where those ones you refer to have perverted the word of God? All that people have done on this thread is to say that the sins of Sodom did not (not that we're told anyway) have anything to do with homosexuality. Where are they wrong? You DO have a Bible, don't you?
If you can't supply scripture that indicates that folks here are perverting the word of God, then it might be a good thing for you to apologize to them.
You pervert it by saying things like Sodom did not even exist. And now you are talking about sins of Sodom. How do you have sins in a place you say did not even exist?
Feel free to believe whatever you want, but don't expect everyone to agree with you.
You pervert it by saying things like Sodom did not even exist. And now you are talking about sins of Sodom. How do you have sins in a place you say did not even exist?
Feel free to believe whatever you want, but don't expect everyone to agree with you.
I agree with Romulus. The stories of Sodom and Gomorrah are just that. Stories. We are arguing about what the bible actually says. I'm saying that the real sin of of Sodom was the consensual rape of virgin daughters. Consensual by their fathers! Did not Lott offer his two virgin daughters to the crowd to "do as they please with"? Or does that not bother Christians? Only that the men wanted the strangers?
After reading so many sex threads in Religion and Spirituality category of C-D, I get the impression that the fundamentalists are trying to get the word sodomy forever linked to homosexuality, when in fact sodomy which can be oral or anal sex, is far from exclusive to homosexuals. More heterosexuals commit the act of sodomy than gay people, as most of the population is straight. It seems fundamentalists also try to link the words rape and sodomy together, to give people the impression that sodomy is always a violent act. Of course the anti-sodomy crowd will never bray about straight people committing sodomy, perhaps they secretly hope nobody notices their dirty little double standard.
After reading so many sex threads in Religion and Spirituality category of C-D, I get the impression that the fundamentalists are trying to get the word sodomy forever linked to homosexuality, when in fact sodomy which can be oral or anal sex, is far from exclusive to homosexuals. More heterosexuals commit the act of sodomy than gay people, as most of the population is straight. It seems fundamentalists also try to link the words rape and sodomy together, to give people the impression that sodomy is always a violent act. Of course the anti-sodomy crowd will never bray about straight people committing sodomy, perhaps they secretly hope nobody notices their dirty little double standard.
They think about it the way they prefer to think about it.
The way that comes naturally for them to think about it.
The way they always think about it.
Last edited by TroutDude; 04-24-2016 at 09:35 PM..
Reason: Added an "it."
Sodom and Gomorrah's sins weren't merely inhospitality, as Bible haters suggest.
"Perhaps the most common Scripture-twisting done by the homosexualist movement is pretending that the sin of Sodom was inhospitality, rather than homosexuality. Even a cursory review of the text of Genesis 19 and related texts, however, reveals clearly that Sodom’s principal sin had to be aberrosexual in nature. Genesis 19, ironically, provides perhaps the most exuberantly over-the-top illustration of hospitality in all of literature. Nobody was a better host than Lot."
Forcing yourself upon someone or gang rape, and offering up your daughters' is beyond consensual.
It falls in line with that of shoving one's beliefs down the throat of others who may see it differently.
Strange flesh follows that of bestiality, or an animal-like behavior.
Who on this thread has perverted the word of God? Besides sggraham and yourself, that is? The only references to the word of God that I've seen from others are pretty much spot on. Rather than simply dismiss these folks with typical 'fundie' rhetoric, can you actually show us where those ones you refer to have perverted the word of God? All that people have done on this thread is to say that the sins of Sodom did not (not that we're told anyway) have anything to do with homosexuality. Where are they wrong? You DO have a Bible, don't you?
If you can't supply scripture that indicates that folks here are perverting the word of God, then it might be a good thing for you to apologize to them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
You pervert it by saying things like Sodom did not even exist.
As far as I know there is no archaeological evidence for these cities having existed. That's all I'm going on. If evidence is found for their existence some time in the future, then fine. I'll then believe that they existed. This won't mean that the Bible account is real, however. The entire population of Sodom - men, women, children and their pets - battering down Lot's door to have sex with the angels? Lot's wife turning into a pillar of salt? I mean ...really?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
And now you are talking about sins of Sodom. How do you have sins in a place you say did not even exist?
Well, I'm playing the devil's advocate here because YOU believe they existed. And, you're using this belief with which to cast condemnation on others. So, we're both assuming for the sake of argument that they DID exist in order to continue the discussion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
Feel free to believe whatever you want, but don't expect everyone to agree with you.
It's not a matter of 'agreeing' or 'disagreeing' on the subject. The Bible either states something or it doesn't. Regarding Sodom and Gomorrah, the Bible doesn't make any reference to homosexuality as being 'one of its sins'. And, that's all we're saying.
Some people will never give up perverting the word of God. It is best to let them believe whatever they want.
The silly thing is that it's YOU GUYS that are perverting the word of God, assuming that the Bible IS the word of God. You're reading things into scripture that simply ARE NOT THERE! Had you not been taught that Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed because of rampant homosexuality and had just relied on a formal reading of the appropriate passages yourself/ves you would not now be making these false claims.
You know what the main issue is that you guys - as well as mainstream Christianity - face? The issue is that you can't bring yourself/ves to say "We were wrong!" This falsehood about S&G as well as other scriptures that are falsely used to condemn homosexuality have been preached for too long, the mustang bolted long ago and can't now be reigned in. The Church would lose face and, probably, membership. "I" personally would be more drawn to a church that was big enough to admit that it was wrong. You bet. No one is perfect and no one has ALL the truth and can't be expected to. From now on I would have trust in that church knowing that if they get something else wrong in the future they will likely admit to it. But, not everyone would do the same. The average mainstream church can't risk being honest and losing membership. SO, best to dig in its heels and perpetuate the status quo.
So, let's see . . .Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed because of rampant homosexuality. Leviticus 18:22/20:13 condemns homosexuality. Romans 1:26-27 condemns homosexuality. The Book of Jude condemns homosexuality. 1 Corinthians 6:9 condemns homosexuality.
Everyone still sitting comfortably in the pews?
Phew! ...an expression of a strong reaction of relief . . .
Sodom and Gomorrah's sins weren't merely inhospitality, as Bible haters suggest.
"Perhaps the most common Scripture-twisting done by the homosexualist movement is pretending that the sin of Sodom was inhospitality, rather than homosexuality. Even a cursory review of the text of Genesis 19 and related texts, however, reveals clearly that Sodom’s principal sin had to be aberrosexual in nature. Genesis 19, ironically, provides perhaps the most exuberantly over-the-top illustration of hospitality in all of literature. Nobody was a better host than Lot."
Sodom and Gomorrah's sins weren't merely inhospitality, as Bible haters suggest.
"Perhaps the most common Scripture-twisting done by the homosexualist movement is pretending that the sin of Sodom was inhospitality, rather than homosexuality. Even a cursory review of the text of Genesis 19 and related texts, however, reveals clearly that Sodom’s principal sin had to be aberrosexual in nature. Genesis 19, ironically, provides perhaps the most exuberantly over-the-top illustration of hospitality in all of literature. Nobody was a better host than Lot."
Jesus wasn't talking in context of any kind of "sex" when He told His disciples that whatever towns would not "receive" them (did that mean the townspeople were supposed to provide "sex" to the disciples?), would be worse than Sodom and Gomorrah--because inhospitality was at the heart of what those towns would be doing by sending His disciples away.
Apparently you are unable to use Scripture to interpret Scripture.
The Jews understand the OT one heck of a lot better than you do:
Quote:
In the case of Sodom we see the same word applied, “…when God destroyed (beshachet) the cities of the plain…” (Gen. 19:29). The Torah did not elaborate on the sin of Sodom, but the underpinnings are expressed later in the prophecy of Ezekiel: “Behold this was the sin of Sodom…She and her daughters had pride, excess bread, and peaceful serenity, but she did not strengthen the hand of the poor and the needy” (16:49). What Did They Do?
The prophet’s description combined with what the Torah reveals to us gives us the following picture: the people of Sodom insisted on preserving their high quality of living to such an extent that they established a principle not to let the poor and homeless reside in their city. Consequently when a destitute person would come seeking help, they would revoke his right to any welfare–public or private! By doing this they figured they would preserve an elite upper class community who would monopolize the profits that the bountiful land offers without having to distribute any revenues to a “lower class” of people.
Rabbinic legends about Sodom describe an area of unusual natural resources, precious stones, silver and gold. Every path in Sodom, say the sages, was lined with seven rows of fruit trees. Eager to keep their great wealth for themselves, and suspicious of outsiders’ desires to share in it, the residents of Sodom agreed to overturn the ancient law of hospitality to wayfarers. The legislation later prohibited giving charity to anyone. One legend claims that when a beggar would wander into Sodom, the people would mark their names on their coins and give him a dinar. However, no one would sell him bread. When he perished of hunger, everyone would come and claim his coin. There was once a maiden who secretly carried bread out to a poor person in the street in her water pitcher. After three days passed and the man didn’t die, the maiden was discovered.
Your religion has gone backwards from the Jewish faith, sinking into a mire that stinks. All the while your religion is part of the reason America is becoming like Sodom--treating its poor like dirt. That has been the modus operandi of your "political" arm for decades now. The last Republican President who really gave a damn about the people in the country was Teddy Roosevelt--and the Republicans in his party hated his guts.
You are unable to understand the clear language of Scripture and you will do anything to cling to the hate that always needs an "other" to look down upon. In the U.S. it is homosexuals right now, but I can already see it switching to Muslims in the Ted Cruz campaign--which calls for armed police to patrol Muslim neighborhoods.
Yes, my Jewish friends are quite concerned. You see, Adolf Hitler instituted armed patrols for Jewish neighborhoods in the early thirties.
The new Gestapo likes to hide underneath a church spire.
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- battering down Lot's door to have sex with the angels? Lot's wife turning into a pillar of salt? I mean ...really?
