Quote:
Originally Posted by Believethebook
I don't think the testimony of Bill Weiss is devious or insincere- and I don't find it to be contrary to the plain words of the Holy Bible. I think bringing the words sheol and hades into the story are misguided, though, because they are not english words and do not always refer to the place of the eternally damned and so give an inaccurate picture of the whole concept. The King James bible has it correct.
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Really?
First Bill refers to Paul's catching up to prove his own 'catching down' saying:
(quote) "Some Christians have said, "Oh a Christian can't leave his body." But that's not true, In 2 Corinthians 12:2, when Paul was caught up into the third heaven, He said, "whether in the body, or out of the body I do not know." (end quote)
Okay, fine.
But then he refers to Jonah:
(quote)"And In Jonah 2:6 it says, "the earth with her bars was about me forever, yet thou has brought up my life from corruption." So at least there was somebody in the Bible that experienced Hell, Jonah". (end quote)
Of course you and I know that the KJV translates "Sheol" as ' the grave', 'the pit' and 'hell'.
" I cried out to the LORD because of my affliction,
And He answered me.
" Out of the belly of Sheol I cried,
And You heard my voice.
Was not Jonah speaking metaphorically here? ie: " I was as good as dead"?
Later Bill claims "The earth with her bars" confirms the literal bars on his prison cell in 'hell'.
Then Bill quotes Job 17:16 to further confirm his assigned prison cell in 'hell' had literal bars. Again, it's clear to me that Job was speaking of the grave in a generic sense:
NRS: Will it go down to the bars of Sheol? Shall we descend together into the dust?"
NIV "Will it go down to the gates of death? Will we descend together into the dust?"
amp"[My hope] shall go down to the bars of Sheol (the unseen state) when once there is rest in the dust. "
Bill is cherry picking to try and give his vision some credibility.
To prove 'cells' or 'rooms' he quotes Prov. 7: 26
"For she has cast down many wounded,
And all who were slain by her were strong men.
27 Her house is the way to hell (Sheol - the grave)
Descending to the chambers of death".
Bill just plays on people's (and his own) ignorance concerning the generic state of death by using the KJV rendering of 'Sheol - the grave - the unseen' as the English word 'hell'.
He goes on to state how strong the demons were and how weak he was:
(Quote) "The one picked me up, and the other one, with his razor-sharp claws; he just shredded my flesh right off. He just tore it off, and had absolutely no care what so ever for this body that God so wonderfully made. It had a hatred that was so intense against me. I wondered, "Why am I alive, why am I living through this? I don't understand why am I not dead." My flesh just hung there in ribbons. And there was no blood, just flesh hanging, because life is in the blood, and there is no life in Hell. And there is no water in Hell.
In Isaiah 14:9-10 it says
Hell (the grave) from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations. All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? Art thou become like unto us?
Psalms 88:4
I am counted with those who go down to the pit; I am like a man who has no strength, (end Quote)
Of course dead men no longer have strength. Sheeeesh Bill!
Then he talks about the cussing and profanities in 'hell'
(Quote) The profanities, that they were cursing at God is mentioned in Ezekiel 22-26 "I am profaned among them"
Her priests have violated My law and profaned My holy things; they have not distinguished between the holy and unholy, nor have they made known the difference between the unclean and the clean; and they have hidden their eyes from My Sabbaths, so that I am profaned among them. (end quote)
Clearly this passage has NOTHING to do with cussing or what we call profanity.
Then he explains the scriptural-ness of the demons ripping his flesh off by quoting Micah 3:2
" 1 Hear now, O heads of Jacob,
And you rulers of the house of Israel:
Is it not for you to know justice?
2 You who hate good and love evil;
Who strip the skin from My people,[a]
And the flesh from their bones;
3 Who also eat the flesh of My people,
Flay their skin from them,
Break their bones,
And chop them in pieces
Like meat for the pot,
Like flesh in the caldron."
This is obvious metaphorical speech of how the leaders were taking advantage of the masses at that time (same as today!)
Then he talks about the humiliation you endure in the afterlife:
(quote) There are scriptures about the humiliation you have to endure. "This thing is going to run my life, I can't stop it!" In Isaiah 5:14-15
Therefore my people have gone into captivity, Because they have no knowledge; Their honorable men are famished, And their multitude dried up with thirst. Therefore the grave enlarges its appetite and opens its mouth without limit; into it will descend their nobles and masses with all their brawlers and revelers. So man will be brought low and mankind humbled, the eyes of the arrogant humbled.
Ezekiel 32:24
There is Elam and all her multitude, All around her grave, All of them slain, fallen by the sword, Who have gone down uncircumcised to the lower parts of the earth, Who caused their terror in the land of the living; Now they bear their shame with those who go down to the Pit.
On and on it goes. That was a horrible thing, to have your life run by these creatures, that have no mercy for you whatsoever.
(end quote)
Again, he uses all this to claim demonic 'creatures' are ruling in 'hell'.
Then he claims Psalms written by David to confirm the darkness in 'hell'
(quote) "I looked one direction, all black, and all I heard was screams, billions of people screaming in this place. I knew there were billions, and it was so loud. If you have ever heard someone scream before, it is so annoying. Well if you hear billions of people screaming, you can't imagine how it affects your mind. You just can't stand it. You hold your ears because it is so loud and penetrating. You can't get away from the screams.
And the fear that overcomes you is unbelievable. Everything is dominated by fear. There is no presence of God in this place, so you have to endure the fear and the torment and the blackness. You can't see anything. You can't even see what is coming up against you.
Scripture talks about this darkness in Psalms 88:6 "You have laid me in the lowest pit, In darkness, in the depths". (end quote)
Again, David is speaking about his trials here and totally contradicts Bill's application in another Psalm "If I make my bed in Sheol, YOU (God) are there"
Then he talks about how desolate it is:
(Quote) "I was now outside the cell and I looked this direction and as I looked this way I could see there was flames of fire, about 10 miles away from me. I knew it was 10 miles. And a pit of fire, about 3 miles across, had flames that lit up the skyline enough to see the landscape of Hell just a little bit.
The darkness was so heavy; it just eats up any light. But there was enough to just see some of the skyline. It was all brown and desolate! I mean absolutely not one green leaf, not anything of life of any kind, just stone, dirt and black sky, and smog in the skylight. The flames were really high, so I could see it. There was a scripture in Deuteronomy 29:23
The whole land is brimstone, salt, and burning; it is not sown, nor does it bear, nor does any grass grow there, like the overthrow of Sodom and Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboiim, which the LORD overthrew in His anger and His wrath.
There is no life whatsoever in Hell. It is so strange to be in a world where there is no life. Here we enjoy trees and fresh air, but there it is absolutely all dead. (end quote)
In context we see this passage has absolutely nothing to do with the afterlife:
Deuteronomy 29:20-25 (New King James Version)
20 "The LORD would not spare him; for then the anger of the LORD and His jealousy would burn against that man, and every curse that is written in this book would settle on him, and the LORD would blot out his name from under heaven. 21 And the LORD would separate him from all the tribes of Israel for adversity, according to all the curses of the covenant that are written in this Book of the Law, 22 so that the coming generation of your children who rise up after you, and the foreigner who comes from a far land, would say, when they see the plagues of that land and the sicknesses which the LORD has laid on it:
23 'The whole land is brimstone, salt, and burning; it is not sown, nor does it bear, nor does any grass grow there, like the overthrow of Sodom and Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboiim, which the LORD overthrew in His anger and His wrath.' 24 All nations would say, 'Why has the LORD done so to this land? What does the heat of this great anger mean?' 25 Then people would say: 'Because they have forsaken the covenant of the LORD God of their fathers, which He made with them when He brought them out of the land of Egypt;
Bill speaks of heat:
(quote) The heat was so intense, you can even describe it. It says in Deuteronomy 32:24
They shall be burnt with hunger, and devoured with burning heat, and with bitter destruction: I will also send the teeth of beasts upon them, with the poison of serpents of the dust. (end quote)
About water he says
(quote) Regarding the water, in Zechariah 9:11,
...I have sent forth thy prisoners out of the pit wherein is no water.
Absolutely no water in Hell. (end quote)
Concerning hopelessness he says
(quote) This is the worse thing about Hell, that there was absolutely no hope of ever getting out. I understood that. I grasped eternity. I could understand eternity. Here on earth, we can't quite, can't get a hold of it. But there I understood it. I knew I would be there forever and ever, and had no hope of getting out. Even people in concentration camps had a hope of getting out, or dying at least, to get out of it. But we've never experienced a totally hopeless situation. In Isaiah 38:18 it says,
"Those who go down to the pit cannot hope for Your truth." (end quote)
Again, read the context.
15 " What shall I say?
He has both spoken to me,
And He Himself has done it.
I shall walk carefully all my years
In the bitterness of my soul.
16 O Lord, by these things men live;
And in all these things is the life of my spirit;
So You will restore me and make me live.
17 Indeed it was for my own peace
That I had great bitterness;
But You have lovingly delivered my soul from the pit of corruption,
For You have cast all my sins behind Your back.
18 For Sheol cannot thank You,
Death cannot praise You;
Those who go down to the pit cannot hope for Your truth.
19 The living, the living man, he shall praise You,
As I do this day;
The father shall make known Your truth to the children.
20 " The LORD was ready to save me;
Therefore we will sing my songs with stringed instruments
All the days of our life, in the house of the LORD."
This passage is simply making the case for remaining alive to praise God, as there is no work or thought or knowledge in the grave (Sheol) where man goes.
Bill just twists every scripture to fit his unscriptural description of the afterlife.
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God bless.
A definate fraud and cult leader!
