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You still don't get it or you are deliberately pretending not to. While we are in this physical body, our Spirit (conceived by God) is growing and developing under the guidance and influence of the Holy Spirit of agape called the Comforter, sent in Christ's name. There is no birth or rebirth of any kind until we are dead. That is the REAL baptism that Jesus was so distressed about AFTER he had been baptized by John the Baptist. WHY did Jesus repeatedly refer to the baptism He had to be baptized with AFTER having been baptized by John?
Luke 12:50 (New King James Version)
50 But I have a baptism to be baptized with, and how distressed I am till it is accomplished!
The baptism Jesus was to be baptized with was death and rebirth as Spirit (Holy Spirit). His consciousness is the ONLY human one that actually contained the complete Holy Spirit of God (perfect agape) and He could thereby make it available to the rest of us as the Comforter and guide within the collective human consciousness. This is the real baptism - following the Holy Spirit (inner guidance) to spiritually mature sufficiently through "love of God and each other" to be reborn after death as Spirit . . . as Jesus was.
Romans 6:4 (King James Version)
4Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
The Holy Spirit within us guides our embryo Spirit to develop properly within the "water of life" that surrounds our brain. THAT is the "water of life" referred to that is within us that is the source of our emotional maturity.
John 7:38,
' From within him there shall flow rivers of living water.'
John 4:13
the water that I will give him shall become in him a fountain of water, springing up unto life everlasting.
No, you just don't get it, there is no such thing as "our embryo spirit", it's the spirit of a full grown man and that man is Adam, the old man carnal nature we were all birthed into via the "waters" of our physical mother. THIS spirit is the same spirit as the spirit of the world, which is the principality of sin.
Which is PRECISELY why ye must be born again/from above, because every GOOD AND PERFECT GIFT COMES FROM ABOVE (not already is here), and we must be born out of our mother, New Jerusalem/wisdom from above, the wisdom that builds the HOUSE (as in many membered heritage body) of G-d. And that's precisely what the HG does, ie. builds the house, for unless G-d builds the house, they labor in vain. This is the city (multiple habitations/houses of HIM) that Abraham sought.
And again, there is not one thing in the death of the physical body that accomplishes a spiritual rebirth, indeed no way it can, it's the last ENEMY and as such it's from BELOW, not above.
Just like real estate, it's all about location, location, location. Let's check it out. So as for the baptism Jesus spoke of, it was the Spirit Son who spoke, and He said He has a baptism to be baptized with, and He does and it's with fire, and how HE is CONSTRAINDED (means bound) until it be accomplished. WHERE is HE, Mystic? Christ IN YOU, the hope of glory. And so where then must He also be constrained? IN YOU.
Now you can keep Him bound if you want to, which is what would have happened if G-d Himself had not provided the ram, but you'd be crucifying Him again, because the son of the promise actually died at the moment there was a covenant/agreement with G-d to do the sacrifice, within the heart of Abraham. Which is what actually happens when man acknowledges and accepts the covenantal death of Jesus within themselves. And so then rather than crucify the flesh AGAIN, the Spirit/ram came.
So what them sets Him free, IN YOU? Acts 2 at 9am on the day of Pentecost, a baptism of fire happened, the POWER that He told them to stay in Jerusalem until they be endued with it. And when you read the rest of Acts, which literally means, the ACTIONS the apostles performed after they received the baptism that brings the POWER of G-d.
This is why we are told that the Holy Ghost does the WORKS/ACTIONS. And without it, He is bound or constrained in us from doing any SPIRITUAL works or actions = the gifts of the Spirit, which go hand in hand with forming the fruit of the Spirit, WHICH IS YOU IN CHRIST, THE GLORY, NOT THE HOPE OF GLORY, which is Christ in you. It's literally His love IN ACTION.
And so we are also told that faith (Christ in you) without works (you in Christ/baptized in His RISEN SPIRIT, the HOLY GHOST) is dead. Without this baptism, there is no resurrection power, but if the SAME SPIRIT, dwell in you that raised Jesus from the dead, then He (the Holy Ghost) will also raise you from the dead.
And so a believer (faith) is not necessarily a follower (Spiritual works), and so again we see the pattern. He said to pick up your cross (believer) and follow (follower) Him. Water baptism is the same as being baptized into the likeness of His death, but the HG baptism is the same as being baptized into the likeness of His LIFE, which is Spirit life engendered WORKS = the gifts of the Spirit.
He told John who protested about needing to be baptized of Him, rather than baptize Him, that BOTH BAPTISMS were necessary to fulfill ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS, literally right STANDING, standing UPRIGHT by the power of G-d = the first resurrection. And so literally there WERE, some standing there that would not taste death until they saw HIM (the Spirit Son Seed) return, in a people called by His name. And He's still been returning in every generation since, which will culminate soon in it's final fulfillment of G-d's word. Peace
Thanks Mystic, got to give credit where credit is due. You pull out of the well like no other on here.
Sure did. And 30 years later, I'd do the same thing for the same reason. Peace
I've had the born-again salvation experience---but my spiritual life did not stagnate. It grew and continues growing. Your words about doing the same thing 30 years later indicates you have a stagnated heart. Once YOU make a decision it is set in stone--no ability to reflect or stand in someone else's shoes and reflect. It is as true in your spiritual life as it is in real life.
Your hubris remains your most astonishing characteristic.
Living one's entire life as if you were in a war or in some kind of spiritual boot camp preparing for a war, with constant self-denial is a pretty miserable existence. Been there, done that.
I have joy when I see what comes from obeying His Spirit. Peace
I've had the born-again salvation experience---but my spiritual life did not stagnate. It grew and continues growing. Your words about doing the same thing 30 years later indicates you have a stagnated heart. Once YOU make a decision it is set in stone--no ability to reflect or stand in someone else's shoes and reflect. It is as true in your spiritual life as it is in real life.
Your hubris remains your most astonishing characteristic.
Your "agape love" is so condem...er, I mean comforting, isn't it? Making such a big deal out of a memory brought to mind that fell under the topic, and that's the BEST part of your comment. Sad. Peace
LOL, not trying to make it about you but salvation is just not reward, salvation is a free gift and reward is something you work at and I would be extremely disappointed if God didn't make good on his promises to people who went after reward because a person who gives his entire life to God is just not the same as somebody who doesn't. Why should they be the same?
That doesn't make any sense.
Those first disciples sold businesses and homes because they went out in search of a better resurrection and they suffered tremendously for those choices. If everyone is just the same, then why would anyone try and give a better effort?
It's just like today's generation, for some reason they think they are entitled to everything good without working for everything good, and if they don't get everything a hard worker gets, they get angry but why?
God would be a very unjust God if he gave reward to people who don't deserve reward, to let them stand alongside people who actually earned the reward would be a travesty and just down right unfair.
If I have lived my life in great servitude of the needs of others and I have lost houses, family and comfort for the sake of Christ and even lost my life, why should some vain, rich, prosperous preacher be able to stand in the same place I stand when he didn't give anything up?
Salvation is broad but it has nothing to do with reward and in my eyes, it shouldn't have anything to do with reward or what would be the reason to sacrifice so much for Christ?
If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
Why would somebody want to serve an unjust, unfair God?
And if only 1 in a million people receive the reward, why should anyone be able to gripe when they received the gift of salvation and not reward?
God forbid that everyone should be the same because it just wouldn't be just and I would be seriously disappointed.
Everyone has their salvation, but just because God gives them such a great gift, they have no right to tear down the ones who worked to receive a reward.
Yeah, it would be such a great convenience for everyone to lie to themselves because they want to believe some unjust thing but I wouldn't want to serve a God who is so unjust that he gives the same thing to some lazy person who is not filled with good works, who is not filled with a great spirit of love, and who never ever makes sacrifices like somebody who has but that is how society seems to think. They think they should be able to take anything from a man who has worked hard all his life building up a business when they have no right to that man's reward, they didn't work hard and build that business but they want all the profits and they seriously believe that the right thing to do is to take everything a person has worked for to then divide amongst the common lazy people.
God gives the multitudes salvation and this is so wonderful and beautiful, but when they shall look and see what others had worked hard for all their lives, they feel cheated because they didn't do the same work somebody else did and then they say,'' God is an unjust God because he gave me my free gift, but to this other person, he gives them reward, God is so unfair.''
If God gives everyone reward that don't deserve reward then he doesn't deserve to be God.
I don't figure that I have deserved the reward, the great prize that few obtain, but I wont be angry when looking at the people who do receive reward, they deserve to have what they worked for all their lives.
Your "agape love" is so condem...er, I mean comforting, isn't it? Making such a big deal out of a memory brought to mind that fell under the topic, and that's the BEST part of your comment. Sad. Peace
Your hubris is so great it resembles a personality disorder.
One thing is for sure--we know you won't ever talk of ANY kind of love except love of your self-serving "biblical" knowledge for which you have never engaged in any kind of ACADEMIC study.
Study to show yourself approved unto God--so that you might rightly instead of proudly proclaim the gospel. I am not kind to you in order that you might see how YOU appear to others. But your hubris is a mighty wall against any kind of love.
I have joy when I see what comes from obeying His Spirit. Peace
Did you do the happy dance when you set fire to 300 of your mother's books?
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Sad. Peace
