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So I'm assuming you believe that when Jesus told His Apostles to touch him and feel that He had a physical body, He was... lying to them? playing a trick on them? What?
That's a later development. Paul, Mark, and Matthew left out that amazing story. This data is consistent with legendary growth.
And by the way, my OP on this thread refutes the claim that Paul taught a non-bodily resurrection.
You're arguing against a straw man then. Nowhere did I argue that the resurrection was "not bodily." I'm arguing that it was a "spiritual body" in heaven experienced through visions, not a physically resurrected corpse that could be touched. The "spiritual body" Paul is speaking of was made of a different substance (not flesh and blood - 1 Cor 15:50) but it was believed to be "physical" in that it was made out of some sort of heavenly material. Unfortunately for you guys though, Paul is the earliest and only firsthand source and he only gives evidence for spiritual encounters of the Risen Christ. This, in no way, supports a physical resurrection. You're just anachronistically reading in your knowledge of the later empty tomb and physical encounters that come from the gospels.
Last edited by KnowMoreThanYou; 01-13-2018 at 09:15 PM..
That's a later development. Paul, Mark, and Matthew left out that amazing story. This data is consistent with legendary growth.
Gotcha. Okay. Well, to each his own. I definitely believe in a literal, physical resurrection. This is not to say that our bodies will be mortal in nature, because they won't be. They will be glorified, immortal bodies, sustained not by blood but by spirit. They will no longer be subject to disease, deformity or death.
You're arguing against a straw man then. Nowhere did I argue that the resurrection was "not bodily." I'm arguing that it was a "spiritual body" in heaven experienced through visions, not a physically resurrected corpse that could be touched. The "spiritual body" Paul is speaking of was made of a different substance (not flesh and blood - 1 Cor 15:50) so it was believed to be "physical" in that it was made out of some sort of heavenly material. Unfortunately for you guys though, Paul is the earliest and only firsthand source and he only gives evidence for spiritual encounters of the Risen Christ. This, in no way, supports a physical resurrection. You're just anachronistically reading in your knowledge of the later empty tomb and physical encounters that come from the gospels.
Actually, you argued that the resurrection was not physical. The empty tomb and the other details provided in the Gospels prove that it was physical. And the bulk of your argument depends on the Gospels being late dated which you simply cannot prove and therefore your argument is invalidated on that point alone.
And no, Paul did not present a spiritual resurrection. Paul was a Jew and the Jewish view of resurrection was physical, not spiritual. Your's is simply an old argument which scholars have addressed.
Now, since your thread was closed in which you presented your argument, it can't be discussed here without this thread also being closed. I replied to your thread in a new thread over on the Religion forum. If you're going to argue your case you'll have to do so over there.
I've already posted in the R&S forum. If you want to claim the resurrection wasn't spiritual then can you please find me a passage where Paul says the Risen Jesus was experienced in a way that was not a vision? Also, where does he say the Risen Jesus walked around on earth (as opposed to being immediately exalted to heaven)? Feel free to answer here or in the other thread in the R&S forum.
This posting back and forth for the same subject, across multiple forums, is dizzying, not to mention bizarre.
One of the threads will probably be closed or merged, or deleted. Since my thread was posted first on that forum it's his thread that should be closed.
He just stated on his thread in the religion forum in post #24 that he believes that Christianity is false. He should have made that clear at the beginning and I wouldn't have bothered with him. On the other hand, I provided information for those who are objective that the Bible teaches a physical resurrection.
So I'm assuming you believe that when Jesus told His Apostles to touch him and feel that He had a physical body, He was... lying to them? playing a trick on them? What?
Apparently, this is an unbeliever trying to stir up trouble in the Christianity forum. We'll close this thread. He's new here, and probably won't be around very long.
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Okay. Well, to each his own. I definitely believe in a literal, physical resurrection. This is not to say that our bodies will be mortal in nature, because they won't be. They will be glorified, immortal bodies, sustained not by blood but by spirit. They will no longer be subject to disease, deformity or death.
