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For conservative christians, its more homosexuality in general though many of them might be willing to say the emotion is not wrong, just the act. It wouldnt be just sodomy for them since that might be a bit difficult for lesbians
All sin is forgivable and if someone truely has Christ in their heart they are forgiven even before they sin, but sin still makes their relationship questionable.
I have prayed on this repeatedly and in my opinion it would be a sin such as overeating, laziness, overdrinking (not being an alchoholic just not knowing your limit or not not paying attention to haw many you drink). Anything done in excess can be sin but not unto death.
I have struggled with this topic as well as many other temptations and I just take them to the Lord in prayer and repentance because I don't know for sure if they are sins or not. Remember Paul lived his remaining days with a thorn in his side and prayed to be released from it and God told him "My grace is sufficiant." It was never revealed what this thorn was.
Masturbation is not a sin, certain forms of coveting are (arguably when it has to do with someone else's property, but thats another discussion). Actually, recent studies have shown that it is actually very beneficial for the prostate especially with older men because it helps flush out free radicles. The verses (aside from the coitus interruptus Onan story) that use to be used to condemn masturbation are now more widely used to condemn homosexuality.
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Originally Posted by Submariner
Homosexual-ity? or Sodomy?
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Originally Posted by Jrhockney
For conservative christians, its more homosexuality in general though many of them might be willing to say the emotion is not wrong, just the act. It wouldnt be just sodomy for them since that might be a bit difficult for lesbians
Do we have to turn this into a homosexuality thread? Really? Another Christian bashing thread? Really? Everyone sins even the most righteous among us.
For conservative christians, its more homosexuality in general though many of them might be willing to say the emotion is not wrong, just the act. It wouldnt be just sodomy for them since that might be a bit difficult for lesbians
In my experience the more conservative, the more Bible based.
... Remember Paul lived his remaining days with a thorn in his side and prayed to be released from it and God told him "My grace is sufficiant." It was never revealed what this thorn was.
God explains the phrase 'Thorn in the flesh' three times in previous passages. [Numbers 33:55, Joshua 23:13, Judges 2:3].
With that understanding, Paul explains in detail the thorns he dealt with.
In my experience the more conservative, the more Bible based.
For the most part that is true, though with it comes a much greater if not blind trust in traditional christian ideas and sadly, it seems a less actual understanding of the culture in which the bible was written and thrusting perfection on certian things when it is neither needed or warranted. They also seem at times to desperately search for sin even where there appears to be nothing but love.
To be fair, the liberal christians often have the general problem of throwing the baby out with the bathwater and forcing mismatching puzzle pieces together (metaphorically speaking of course).
If you want examples, sorry you won't get any tonight. Its much more fun to talk in code and generalities!
Could you share with us the passage from which you derive the doctrine that "Grace is only given if" ?
I would like to review that passage.
God's promises are given to all.
They are not restricted to only a select group, unless God says they are.
It is only God who can decide such things. Not Man.
Of coarse only God decides, because only He knows the hearts of all men. All we can discuss is basic doctrine. The promises are there for all but all will not beleive and ask. It is written that you have not because either you do not ask, do not believe, or asks amiss to have ones own desires rather than His.
HEB 10 "For you have need of patience, that, after you have done the will of God, you might receive the promise. For yet a little while, and He that shall come will come, and will not tarry. Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, My soul shall have no pleasure in him.
ACTS 5:31-32 "Him has God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins. And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God has given to them that obey him." To do the work of God one must first beleive in Him and then as He said, JN 15:14 "You are My friends, if you do whatsoever I command you." All by Grace given for that purpose, not to do your own thing if it is wrong to do it.
REV 2:13-17 "I know your works, and where you dwell, even where Satan's seat is: and you hold fast My name, and have not denied My faith, even in those days wherein Antipas was My faithful martyr, who was slain among you, where Satan dwells. But I have a few things against you, because you have there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication. So you also have them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate. Repent; or else I will come unto you quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of My mouth. He that has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcomes will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knows saving he that receives it."
For the most part that is true, though with it comes a much greater if not blind trust in traditional christian ideas and sadly, it seems a less actual understanding of the culture in which the bible was written and thrusting perfection on certian things when it is neither needed or warranted. They also seem at times to desperately search for sin even where there appears to be nothing but love.
To be fair, the liberal christians often have the general problem of throwing the baby out with the bathwater and forcing mismatching puzzle pieces together (metaphorically speaking of course).
If you want examples, sorry you won't get any tonight. Its much more fun to talk in code and generalities!
I guess the lines drawn between 'liberal' and 'conservative' confuse me then.
Strictly as a Christian, a sinner, a son of God, and a brother of Jesus; I study God's Word to try to show myself approved as a workman of God's Word.
So when I see supposed 'christian' doctrines that are not based on the Bible. I must ask where they came from.
'Tradition'? Jesus spoke a lot of that. Tradition is no guide for truth, if anything Man's tradition is more oft a guide for error.
In my experience the more conservative, the more Bible based.
Correct, and also more rigid and into literal interpretation. The Bible, especially the NT, is to be taken as a "general" message about how to live life. Read it once, get the idea, and live. This is exactly why I stay away from fundamentalists and the too right-of-center Protestant sects who constantly quote. They obviously never took an economics course and learned the concept of "diminishing marginal returns."
Of coarse only God decides, because only He knows the hearts of all men. All we can discuss is basic doctrine. The promises are there for all but all will not beleive and ask. It is written that you have not because either you do not ask, do not believe, or asks amiss to have ones own desires rather than His.
HEB 10 "For you have need of patience, that, after you have done the will of God, you might receive the promise. For yet a little while, and He that shall come will come, and will not tarry. Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, My soul shall have no pleasure in him.
ACTS 5:31-32 "Him has God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins. And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God has given tothem that obey him." To do the work of God one must first beleive in Him and then as He said, JN 15:14 "You are My friends, if you do whatsoever I command you." All by Grace given unto.
REV 2:13-17 "I know your works, and where you dwell, even where Satan's seat is: and you hold fast My name, and have not denied My faith, even in those days wherein Antipas was My faithful martyr, who was slain among you, where Satan dwells. But I have a few things against you, because you have there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication. So you also have them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate. Repent; or else I will come unto you quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of My mouth. He that has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcomes will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knows saving he that receives it."
How does this apply to men making up new sins and forcing them onto others as if God were somehow involved?
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