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This is what I see
John 3:16 For GOD so loved the WORLD that he gave his son and whoever believes will not DIE but will LIVE with the knowledge of God and his son.(eternal life as defined by Jesus in John 17)
You seem to think that if this verse says those who believe will not die but live then that must mean that those who do not believe die and burn forever.... Can we state that is true simply from this verse? and Yet you posted only verse 16... what about 17?
17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.
Let me ask you something... Luke 19:10 "For the Son of Man has come to seek and to save that which was lost."
Why is it that Jesus came to seek and save the lost but you think it is those that are lost who will never be saved? Do you not believe what the verse states? That Jesus will SEEK them out to save them?
I find it interesting that Jesus' purpose is clearly stated yet some deny he will do that very thing.. save the world, the lost, the sinner, the powerless, etc.
If Jesus doesn't save the lost what exactly do you suppose he came into the world? To destroy people? Condemn them?
Of course I believe it, I believe everything that is in scripture, even the part we read of people not coming to Christ, worshipping pagan gods. Anyway, I have far to many things to do to be on line.
Of course I believe it, I believe everything that is in scripture, even the part we read of people not coming to Christ, worshipping pagan gods. Anyway, I have far to many things to do to be on line.
Miss Shawn.. Do you believe you were born under the Old Covenant or the New?
I am curious because of a discussion on another thread.
See I believe that the Old Covenant is over as of 70AD and we were born under the New Covenant.. do you agree?
Hebrews 9:15 For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance--now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.
So if Christ died for the sins committed under the first covenant.. what about those in the second covenant? Does the bible talk about what happens in the New covenant when someone sins?
The new covenant is outlined in Jeremiah 31 and it is that God will remember their sins no more . They will be his people and he will be their God..
If God doesn't remember sins in the New Covenant... why aren't all men saved?
Just because you desire something doesn't mean you are going to get it...
And God is just like us, pining away, wishing for things He can't have, even knowing He can't have them... God must be very sad knowing He failed to save most of His creation, even though He wanted to... No wait... that can't be right; God is all-powerful and achieves His desires!
Just because you desire something doesn't mean you are going to get it...
Isa 55:11
so is my word that goes out from my mouth: It will not return to me empty, but will accomplish what I desire and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.
It is funny though also sad that modern day Christians actually teach that God doesn't/cant get whatever he wants/desires/wills(thelō). I mean, really ... Who are you to say that God cant have what he desires/wills(thelō) when the scriptures teach that his word accomplishes whatever he desires/wills(thelō)? If God cant get what he desires/wills(thelō) then why pray gods desire/will(thelēma- noun form of thelō) be done on earth as it is in heaven?
Last edited by Ironmaw1776; 02-17-2010 at 02:00 PM..
Isa 55:11
so is my word that goes out from my mouth: It will not return to me empty, but will accomplish what I desire and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.
It is funny though also sad that modern day Christians actually teach that God doesn't/cant get whatever he wants/desires/wills(thelō). I mean, really ... Who are you to say that God cant have what he desires/wills(thelō) when the scriptures teach that his word accomplishes whatever he desires/wills(thelō)? If God cant get what he desires/wills(thelō) then why pray gods desire/will(thelēma- noun form of thelō) be done on earth as it is in heaven?
According to most God's will is not even done in heaven because most will be separated from him in hell forever...
So not only does the word of God come back void from earth but sinners also control heaven.... or am I deluded about the thoughts of Eters?
Please no universalism-this is a thread about some will be lost
"4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."
This verse always bothered me when I was a kid. If God desires that all are to be saved, then why aren't all saved?
God wants all to be saved, because he knows that to be unsaved is terrible beyond words. That is why he took the blame for your sins and mine, so that we have the opportunity to be saved. But he can't force us to accept his sacrifice. If we accept it, it is because, before the foundation of the world, God knew us, and knew that we would accept, because we love righteousness. If we do not accept his sacrifice, we choose unholiness, and, likewise, we chose it before the foundation of the world. What we do here is simply provide hard evidence for what we really are.
There is something more important to God than wanting all to be saved- and that is righteousness.
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No wait... that can't be right; God is all-powerful and achieves His desires! 
