Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I absolutely agree with you Mike that Mormons have quite a few religious beliefs that are different than the package of beliefs and arbitrary biblical interpretations that you have apparently learned from your pastor/mentor and have bought into.
But we're not a "cult" by the derogatory definition you choose to think of us as being.
It is my understanding that you affiliate with a tiny independent church probably started just a few years ago that is led by a charismatic preacher who (if you are an example of his methods) condemns to hell everyone who disagrees with his teachings. And yet you have the audacity to publicly and aggressively label "cult" the fourth largest Christian denomination in the United States, organized 180 years ago and now worldwide with 13,500,000 members! Even at first glance your credibility is severely threatened in my opinion...
------- General questions to ask before you condemn Latter-day Saints as non-Christians or as cultists:
1. Could your argument equally well exclude many other groups that are widely accepted as Christians?
2. Could your argument equally well exclude the early Christians themselves, or even Christ himself?
3. Are you using a Biblical definition of "Christian" or "cult" to condemn and exclude, or a definition that you or some other modern writer has devised? (E.g., are you applying a Biblical verse that uses and defines the word "Christian"?)
4. Is your definition of Christian a fair, defensible, Biblical standard, or is it just a way of saying, "Anyone who disagrees with my view of theology and my interpretations of the Bible is not a Christian?" (Same applies to "cultist.")
Before you say we are non-Christians or cultists because we accept some books as scripture not found in your set of canonized scriptures, ask yourselves these questions:
Did the early Christians accept some writings as sacred that were not in the standard canon of the day, the Old Testament? (E.g., the writings of Peter, Paul, Matthew, etc.)
When the canon of God's Word grew from the Old Testament alone to include the New Testament, were the parties responsible for these additional inspired writings non-Christian cultists?
Did both Jews and early Christians accept some books as sacred that are not found in the Bible today - books such as the Book of Enoch (see Jude)?
Did ancient writers of the Old Testament have a canon of prophetic writings and books that is larger than the set found in the Old Testament of today?
Must we likewise condemn Catholics and other Christian groups who accept a larger set of writings than typical Protestants?
It is our belief that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the restored Church of Jesus Christ upon the earth, led by Christ through modern revelation. Among the many traits we share with the early Christians is that we are spoken against by many, labeled as members of a cult or sect, a group that has departed from accepted "mainstream" views and beliefs.
In terms of the basic dictionary definition, we are a cult - that is, a religious organization.
In terms of the special definitions our critics use to exclude us from Christianity and to frighten potential converts, those definitions fit the early Christians and the prophets and apostles of the Bible as well as they fit us.
If what we have in common with early Christianity makes us a cult, then we're glad to be in such company - and I hope you'll become a fellow "cultist" as well.
Sorry, we're not going to brainwash you, put you in isolation chambers, or make you wear special tennis shoes, but you will find that the Lord has opportunities for you to serve others and to grow in faith as you follow Christ with all your heart.
So, no one wants to address the issue of Joseph Smith believing that God was once a man who lived on another planet, and somehow managed to become God? No one wants to address the issue of the Mormon belief in eternal progression, and how it completely denies that God declared Himself to be the only God that ever was or will be? I understand.
So, no one wants to address the issue of Joseph Smith believing that God was once a man who lived on another planet, and somehow managed to become God? No one wants to address the issue of the Mormon belief in eternal progression, and how it completely denies that God declared Himself to be the only God that ever was or will be? I understand.
I'm not LDS but i can say that i don't have a problem with Our Father going through a similar process...
Indeed if we are All to be One, there must be a process.
So, no one wants to address the issue of Joseph Smith believing that God was once a man who lived on another planet, and somehow managed to become God? No one wants to address the issue of the Mormon belief in eternal progression, and how it completely denies that God declared Himself to be the only God that ever was or will be? I understand.
I thought this thread was about your accusation that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is a "cult" in the now dated but once fashionable anti-Mormon kool-aid sense of the word.
If you want to discuss specific LDS canonical beliefs or non-doctrinal statements attributed to early church leaders living 150 or so years ago, why not start an appropriate thread or ask your question in the existing "Mormons made Simple" thread?
I'm not LDS but i can say that i don't have a problem with Our Father going through a similar process...
Indeed if we are All to be One, there must be a process.
I hope to always embrace it.
godspeed,
freedom
Why do you not believe the Scriptures?
Malachi 3:6 ''For I the LORD, do not change.''
James 1:17 ''Every good thing bestowed and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation, or shifting shadow.''
Numbers 23:19 God is not a man, that He should lie, Nor a son of man, that He should repent.
James 1:17 ''Every good thing bestowed and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation, or shifting shadow.''
Numbers 23:19 God is not a man, that He should lie, Nor a son of man, that He should repent.
None of those quotes address the former....
If i am fullgrown, then why would i change... we are speaking of how one gets to be fullgrown.
It's the eternal system of God.
We are to be One with God, therefore we can be Like Him. If we can be like Him, then maybe He was like us.
James 1:17 ''Every good thing bestowed and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation, or shifting shadow.''
Numbers 23:19 God is not a man, that He should lie, Nor a son of man, that He should repent.
Don`t you believe that the MAN,Jesus was God? Isn`t Jesus also called the son of man?
I thought this thread was about your accusation that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is a "cult" in the now dated but once fashionable anti-Mormon kool-aid sense of the word.
If you want to discuss specific LDS canonical beliefs or non-doctrinal statements attributed to early church leaders living 150 or so years ago, why not start an appropriate thread or ask your question in the existing "Mormons made Simple" thread?
I personally think this thread was still-born. You are not likely to convince many people that the worldwide LDS Church is a cult.
I made the point of the thread clear. I asked some questions preceded by the applicable Biblical verses, and then the quotations of the Mormon so called prophets who contradicted those verses. I then asked for Mormons to comment on those non Biblical beliefs held by their false prophets.
Why do you pass yourselves off as being Christians but deny the very unchanging nature of God?
Another question. Why do you add to the word of God by proclaming the Book of Mormon to be a companion to the Bible? It contradicts the Bible in so many ways. Just one example.
Bible: Luke 23:44 says the darkness covered the Cross for 3 hours.
Don`t you believe that the MAN,Jesus was God? Isn`t Jesus also called the son of man?
Jesus Christ is God. He is also man. But he did not become a member of the human race until the virgin birth.
As God, Jesus Christ is co-equal and co-eternal with God the Father and with God the Holy Spirit. When He became a member of the human race some two thousand years ago, He became the God-Man. The unique person of the universe. And He will remain so for all eternity. BUT!!! Nothing about the characteristics of His Deity changed. The attributes of His Deity are separate and distinct from the attributes of his humanity. He is both at once, fully God and fully human. As God, Jesus Christ remains unchanged. Immutable. His essence as God, remains as it has always been and will always be. His Sovereignty, righteousness, justice, love, eternal life, omniscience, omnipresence, omnipotence, immutability, and veracity remain unchanged and unaffected by the fact that He entered into the world as a man.
Malachi 3:6 ''For I the Lord, do not change.''
Man cannot become God.
But God was able to become man. Not by changing His nature as God, but by way of Kenosis, and hypostatic union through the virgin birth. The two separate and distinct natures of Christ exist in a union that is more than harmony or sympathy. It is PERSONAL.
If i am fullgrown, then why would i change... we are speaking of how one gets to be fullgrown.
It's the eternal system of God.
We are to be One with God, therefore we can be Like Him. If we can be like Him, then maybe He was like us.
Is there blasphemy in that to you?
godspeed,
freedom
To say that God was a man is blasphemous. TO GOD.
Isa. 44:6 Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel. And his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: I AM the first and I am the last. And there is no other God besides Me.
Isa. 43:10-13 ...Before Me no God was formed, nor will there be one after Me.
Isa. 46:9 For I AM God, and there is no one like Me.
Isa. 45:21-22 And there is no other God besides Me, A righteous God and a Savior: There is none except Me. 22) ''Turn to Me and be saved, all the ends of the earth: For I AM God, and there is no other.
God has existed eternally. He didn't become God. He has always been God from the very datelessness of eternity past. And no man can become God. It is the very height of Arrogance to think that he could.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
