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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks You can't be Christian, unless you really believe in His deity, that is what separates Christianity from all the other religions that acknowledge His prophetic nature....like Islam and Judaism, they recognize Jesus, even agree with some or most of His teachings, but they don't regard Him as Deity. This is where the line is drawn. Just like the JW, are not a part of the church, the Christian church, whether they think they are or not, they aren't. Believing in His divinity is what makes us "Christians".
I have seen this remark made on several threads...that one has to believe Jesus is GOD to be a Christian.
I would like anyone to please provide just one scripture that says I, or anyone else for that matter, has to believe Jesus is God in order to be considered a Christian (Christ Follower).....just one.
This is an essential doctrine of Christianity...I have seen it placed in the first order and the second order but it remains one of the essentials.
The scripture is found in all of 1 John, not that Jesus is God that is all over the bible but that we better have the right understanding of who Jesus is because if we don't have the Son rightly then we don't have the Father.
This is an essential doctrine of Christianity...I have seen it placed in the first order and the second order but it remains one of the essentials.
The scripture is found in all of 1 John, not that Jesus is God that is all over the bible but that we better have the right understanding of who Jesus is because if we don't have the Son rightly then we don't have the Father.
I didn't ask for man's doctrine on the issue.....I asked for scripture. It's been stated many times on these threads, by various people, that one has to believe Jesus is God in order to be a Christian (Christ Follower).
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks You can't be Christian, unless you really believe in His deity, that is what separates Christianity from all the other religions that acknowledge His prophetic nature....like Islam and Judaism, they recognize Jesus, even agree with some or most of His teachings, but they don't regard Him as Deity. This is where the line is drawn. Just like the JW, are not a part of the church, the Christian church, whether they think they are or not, they aren't. Believing in His divinity is what makes us "Christians".
I have seen this remark made on several threads...that one has to believe Jesus is GOD to be a Christian.
The reason you have seen it on so many threads is because this is how the religion has been defined for nearly 2,000 years. I didn't define it that way, and neither did sciotamicks or Fundamentalist.
The fact that people like you want to twist that definition into a pretzel doesn't wipe out 2,000 years of history.
Perhaps your argument isn't with sciotamicks, it's with God--or at the very least, with the people who produce dictionaries.
I believe that the Word - who was God - became flesh.
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God...14 and the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
I didn't ask for man's doctrine on the issue.....I asked for scripture. It's been stated many times on these threads, by various people, that one has to believe Jesus is God in order to be a Christian (Christ Follower).
Please provide scripture for this issue.
Well whatever concept you and others come up with will be man's doctrine too.....It doesn't matter what verse you get you will explain it away so why ask?
I believe that the Word - who was God - became flesh.
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God...14 and the Word was made flesh,and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
This is the scripture that resolves it for me also, little elmer . . . although the underlined part always seems to be ignored or misinterpreted by the magic believers. Jesus was entirely HUMAN before He elevated His consciousness to PERFECTLY RESONATE with God and become ONE and the same. It is a little detail that is rejected . . . and completely negates the whole point of Jesus's life and example. God being godly and acting godly and enduring suffering in a godly way is completely pointless. OF COURSE God could do all that. So What? What could possibly be the implications and importance of all that for US? . . . NONE.
That Jesus AS A HUMAN did those things is significant for us. It establishes a direction for our soul's development . . . something to aspire to . . . and a safe haven from which to do so in His love for us all.
Well whatever concept you and others come up with will be man's doctrine too.....It doesn't matter what verse you get you will explain it away so why ask?
I asked because it was stated as fact.....that one would have to believe this way in order to be a Christ Follower/Christian....so if one wants to call those who don't believer this way not Christians....surely there is some scripture to back this claim up. I've searched high and low and can't find where Jesus or anyone else made this critical statement.
This is the scripture that resolves it for me also, little elmer . . . although the underlined part always seems to be ignored or misinterpreted by the magic believers. Jesus was entirely HUMAN before He elevated His consciousness to PERFECTLY RESONATE with God and become ONE and the same. It is a little detail that is rejected . . . and completely negates the whole point of Jesus's life and example. God being godly and acting godly and enduring suffering in a godly way is completely pointless. OF COURSE God could do all that. So What? What could possibly be the implications and importance of all that for US? . . . NONE.
That Jesus AS A HUMAN did those things is significant for us. It establishes a direction for our soul's development . . . something to aspire to . . . and a safe haven from which to do so in His love for us all.
Yeah...I believe Jesus the man became ONE with God in mind, will and spirit but not the same....not GOD.
Yeah...I believe Jesus the man became ONE with God in mind, will and spirit but not the same....not GOD.
I believe that when John said the Word was made flesh, he was saying that the Spirit was a part of Him. He was conceived by the Holy Spirit, so that's one point. He said "You wanna see my Daddy? Look at Me." That's another point.
There are issues about Him being conformed into what He became - learning obedience by the things He suffered - that tell us He was man. All I know is that He is now seated at the right hand of the Father, and the elders worship both the Father and His son.
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