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The day of the LORD [singular] return ... not days
It will be a unique day... Zechariah 14:7 no formulas, no 1000 yr or 7 yr...no secret rapture, you won't have to guess what's happening, just one unique day
a day known to the LORD. Zechariah 14:7 Hal Lindsay, Jack Van Impe, or any other ministry web sight has insight knowledge
The LORD will be king over the whole earth Zechariah 14:9
On that day men will be stricken by the LORD with great panic Zechariah 14:9
"Surely the day is coming; it will burn like a furnace.." Malachi 4:1
It will be a unique day... Zechariah give examples of this uniqueness, so unique that the day will not be anything close to normal
without daytime or nighttimeZechariah 14:6 time will cease to exist
there will be no light, no cold or frost. Zechariah 14:6 ----Hope you're understanding the contradition here, a day with no light would be very cold and frosty----
When evening comes, there will be light.Zechariah 14:6 Day and night has no difference to God, so it (the only one Day) will be for us.
On that day living water will flow out from Jerusalem, half to the eastern sea and half to the western sea, in summer and in winter.Zechariah 14:6 Jerusalem here is the same picturesque one as the new Jerusalem coming down in Revelation. "The living water" is the same picture used that Jesus describes himself in John 4:13
There is no UR
On that day there will be one LORD, and his name the only name.Zechariah 14:9 "Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."Acts 4:12 That name being Jesus. Jesus the subsitute...not the example to follow taught by LDS. It's a must, not 'oopps, now I get it'
the LORD will strike all the nations that fought against Jerusalem:Zechariah 14:12 "Jerusalem" is the symbolic term used for the place where all God's chosen dwell.
Are those who "fought against Jerusalem" UR'ed? .... hardly
Their flesh will rot while they are still standing on their feet Zechariah 14:12
their eyes will rot in their sockets Zechariah 14:12
their tongues will rot in their mouths Zechariah 14:12
All the arrogant and every evildoer will be stubble, and that day that is coming will set them on fire," Malachi 4:1
God's Word summorizes these two prophesies in different ways in the NT... 1 return, no UR:
"Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and come out—those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned."
"For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever."
"Once again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net that was let down into the lake and caught allkinds of fish. When it was full, the fishermen pulled it up on the shore. Then they sat down and collected the good fish in baskets, but threw the bad away." ..... no UR, not just believers are caught up; but all kinds, the good (believers) are first then the bad (unbelievers)....[as explained by Paul in the "rapture" verse].
No secret rapture of only believers.."caught allkinds of fish"
No UR...."Then they sat down and collected the good fish in baskets, but threw the bad away."
Last edited by twin.spin; 02-08-2010 at 12:34 PM..
Universal Restoration aka universal salavation...the belief that ultimately God doesn't send anybody to hell for unbelief.
the passages you quoted teach rather annihilation then torment in hell, especially Maleachi, I agree that the OT overwhelmingly implies the annihilation of sinners, but doesn't make the verses unwritten that say that all men will be made alive and saved and justified.
The OT merely deals with earthly judgments as I understand it, I do in fact believe that God executes death penalty at judgment day.
the passages you quoted teach rather annihilation then torment in hell, especially Maleachi, I agree that the OT overwhelmingly implies the annihilation of sinners, but doesn't make the verses unwritten that say that all men will be made alive and saved and justified.
The OT merely deals with earthly judgments as I understand it, I do in fact believe that God executes death penalty at judgment day.
Zechariah 14 and Malachi 3, 4 are prophesies of judgement day. They refer to them as "the day".
"but doesn't make the verses unwritten that say that all men will be made alive and saved and justified?"................ no.
Their flesh will rot while they are still standing on their feet Zechariah 14:12
their eyes will rot in their sockets Zechariah 14:12
their tongues will rot in their mouths Zechariah 14:12
All the arrogant and every evildoer will be stubble, and that day that is coming will set them on fire," Malachi 4:1
The OT merely deals with earthly judgments as I understand it, I do in fact believe that God executes death penalty at judgment day.
That's right. From Genesis to Malachi a good argumant can be made that God's law and judgement pertain to this life only. The exception is one single verse found in Daniel 12:2
Quote:
"And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, Some to everlasting (olam) life, Some to shame and everlasting (olam) contempt".
and even in this verse we have "olam" to contend with in regards to postmortem shame.
Olam seems to be the most tortuously translated word from the Hebrew Language. The book of Jonah 2:6 uses the exact same word:
Quote:
" I went down to the moorings of the mountains; The earth with its bars closed behind me forever(olam)"
to describe a period of three days and nights.
So with Jonah's obvious usage in mind - one verse using "olam" in regards to afterlife judgement doesn't make much of an OT case for ET. I guess if someone seriously wants to find ET the other strand of hope is to reference Isaiah's immortal worms which Jesus also famously referenced: we read (Is 66:24) that people
Quote:
will go out and look upon the dead bodies of those who rebelled against me; their worm will not die, nor will their fire be quenched, and they will be loathsome to all mankind.
It seems obvious that it's speaking of actual unburied dead bodies. In Jewish culture, burning a body was considered an abhorrence to the will of God. Jewish law/tradition required burial just as Abraham buried Sarah and as other patriarchs and matriarchs were also buried. Deut. 21:23 "You shall surely bury him".
Anyway - in regards to the OT and ET I always reference Genesis 3 which spells out what the deal is in regards to the consequences of sin. I guess those who want to hold onto the myth of "eternal life in misery" will spin what they want out of it all.
Anyway - in regards to the OT and ET I always reference Genesis 3 which spells out what the deal is in regards to the consequences of sin. I guess those who want to hold onto the myth of "eternal life in misery" will spin what they want out of it all.
Psalm 92:6-8 6The senseless man does not know, fools do not understand, 7 that though the wicked spring up like grass and all evildoers flourish, they will be forever destroyed.
"fools do not understand,... the wicked and all evildoers....
they will be forever destroyed."
Psalm 92:6-8 6The senseless man does not know, fools do not understand, 7 that though the wicked spring up like grass and all evildoers flourish, they will be forever destroyed.
"fools do not understand,... the wicked and all evildoers....
they will be forever destroyed."
We'll see who is the fool
I believe all evildoers will be forever destroyed. See Genesis 3 and read all about it. The failure here (on your part AISI) is to discern soul from spirit, joint from marrow and to discern the thoughts and intents of the heart..
That which is born of spirit is spirit - you should know this by now.
The day of the LORD [singular] return ... not days
It will be a unique day... Zechariah 14:7 no formulas, no 1000 yr or 7 yr...no secret rapture, you won't have to guess what's happening, just one unique day
a day known to the LORD. Zechariah 14:7 Hal Lindsay, Jack Van Impe, or any other ministry web sight has insight knowledge
The LORD will be king over the whole earth Zechariah 14:9
On that day men will be stricken by the LORD with great panic Zechariah 14:9
"Surely the day is coming; it will burn like a furnace.." Malachi 4:1
It will be a unique day... Zechariah give examples of this uniqueness, so unique that the day will not be anything close to normal
without daytime or nighttimeZechariah 14:6 time will cease to exist
there will be no light, no cold or frost. Zechariah 14:6 ----Hope you're understanding the contradition here, a day with no light would be very cold and frosty----
When evening comes, there will be light.Zechariah 14:6 Day and night has no difference to God, so it (the only one Day) will be for us.
On that day living water will flow out from Jerusalem, half to the eastern sea and half to the western sea, in summer and in winter.Zechariah 14:6 Jerusalem here is the same picturesque one as the new Jerusalem coming down in Revelation. "The living water" is the same picture used that Jesus describes himself in John 4:13
There is no UR
On that day there will be one LORD, and his name the only name.Zechariah 14:9 "Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."Acts 4:12 That name being Jesus. Jesus the subsitute...not the example to follow taught by LDS. It's a must, not 'oopps, now I get it'
the LORD will strike all the nations that fought against Jerusalem:Zechariah 14:12 "Jerusalem" is the symbolic term used for the place where all God's chosen dwell.
Are those who "fought against Jerusalem" UR'ed? .... hardly
Their flesh will rot while they are still standing on their feet Zechariah 14:12
their eyes will rot in their sockets Zechariah 14:12
their tongues will rot in their mouths Zechariah 14:12
All the arrogant and every evildoer will be stubble, and that day that is coming will set them on fire," Malachi 4:1
God's Word summorizes these two prophesies in different ways in the NT... 1 return, no UR:
"Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and come out—those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned."
"For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever."
"Once again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net that was let down into the lake and caught allkinds of fish. When it was full, the fishermen pulled it up on the shore. Then they sat down and collected the good fish in baskets, but threw the bad away." ..... no UR, not just believers are caught up; but all kinds, the good (believers) are first then the bad (unbelievers)....[as explained by Paul in the "rapture" verse].
No secret rapture of only believers.."caught allkinds of fish"
No UR...."Then they sat down and collected the good fish in baskets, but threw the bad away."
It says the wicked will be stubble. Do you really believe that or do you believe they will last forever in torment?
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