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And compare it to DC's 14th most walkable nabe according to Walkscore (Adams-Morgan is clearly not less walkable than Judiciary Square, but that's beside the point):
Even in L.A.'s densest areas, it still feels rather auto-dependent. That's why it doesn't make anyone's short list of "super urban cities" except for the few ardent L.A. supporters in the ether world.
Nitpicking much , DC is urban but its urban footprint is a fraction of LA's urban footprint
That part of Koreatown has a density of 44k ppsm. It is far from the densest tract in Koreatown.
The walkscore of the general address you posted is 91. If you are only used to the way East Coast cities look, then it looks suburban. I will admit that is one of the less urban parts of the city (10k ppsm) and mostly single family homes and although it is walkable I am sure most of the residents drive most of the time.
I would tend to agree with you, just cause there is a set back or a driveway doesn't mean it's not urban ( South Boston, Koreatown, LA)t.
I would tend to agree with you, just cause there is a set back or a driveway doesn't mean it's not urban ( South Boston, Koreatown, LA)t.
Especially considering none of those buildings are single family homes in Koreatown (at least on the street view he posted). Most are apartment buildings with 4-10 units or duplexes.
That part of Koreatown has a density of 44k ppsm. It is far from the densest tract in Koreatown.
The walkscore of the general address you posted is 91. If you are only used to the way East Coast cities look, then it looks suburban. I will admit that is one of the less urban parts of the city (10k ppsm) and mostly single family homes and although it is walkable I am sure most of the residents drive most of the time.
Munchitup, I am curious what is your definition of "walkable"?
It doesn't look like there is a whole lot going on in that part of Koreatown. Even the main routes surrounding that particular spot look like uninviting 4 to 8 lane roads/highways. Which explains why you hardly see any people around. And if as you say most people drive - which doesnt surprise me - doesn't that mean by definition that it is NOT walkable? In other words, is there a better way to define walkability than to look at the lifestyle of local residents?
Munchitup, I am curious what is your definition of "walkable"?
It doesn't look like there is a whole lot going on in that part of Koreatown. Even the main routes surrounding that particular spot look like uninviting 4 to 8 lane roads/highways. Which explains why you hardly see any people around. And if as you say most people drive - which doesnt surprise me - doesn't that mean by definition that it is NOT walkable? In other words, is there a better way to define walkability than to look at the lifestyle of local residents?
Well you hit on the head with that. There's not a lot going on there. It's really on the fringes of what I would consider Koreatown anyways and I think probably less gentrified then other parts of Koreatown.
I've never lived in Koreatown (and only been in LA one year) so I can't really attest to whether it is truly walkable.
I consider walkable to be a place you can (relatively easily) get to a grocery store, gym, drug store, bars, restaurants, doctor's etc without a car. To the average person the walking limit would probably be .5 miles to 1 mile for those amenities (on the lower end for groceries) - I would say its more like 1 - 1.5 for me.
Edit: And I get that the roads being wide in LA is a big turn off to those from the East Coast. IMO that doesn't effect walkability except for instances like this on my way to Runyon Canyon Park: http://g.co/maps/mh3kh This has more to do with the fact that there is no crosswalk on the south side of La Brea (not the wide roads), so I have to go around. It would drive me crazy if I lived in the immediate area.
IMO wide sidewalks have more to do with walkability than wide roads.
EDIT: In reference to the residence driving I was talking about Crescent Heights, not Koreatown. I get your logic about if most folks drive then a place is most likely not walkable. LA is whole 'nother thing it seems, and it often defies logic. For instance, my wife's coworker was asking her about riding the subway, and another coworker piped up that "LA doesn't have any underground subways". This is coming from someone who lived their whole life in Northridge. She is far from the exception to the rule. The attachment to cars many of residents have is baffling IMO.
Last edited by munchitup; 01-31-2012 at 06:12 PM..
Especially considering none of those buildings are single family homes in Koreatown (at least on the street view he posted). Most are apartment buildings with 4-10 units or duplexes.
But i would not say its the east coast version of Urbanitiy, Most people would call South Boston or Dorcester Urban, but most of those neigborhoods look similar to Koreatown, with setback homes, and driveways, ableit triple Deckers instead of small apartment buildings. but they have similar interaction with the street
Last edited by btownboss4; 01-31-2012 at 07:03 PM..
I have been to LA plenty of times. I think LA is very urban over an area larger than Chicago and NYC. It's massive. Because LA is not compact like east coast cities, many posters take away points which can be debated. I rode the blue line from DT LA to Long Beach and it felt very connected. I got off and walked around Watts and Compton. I just think the single family homes with yards and lack of rowhouses give it that suburbanish look to a certain degree. But I grew up on the east coast and my definition of urban is different from someone from Cali. The highways don't help it's urbanity either. I think LA as a whole is just as urban as DC, Boston, Philly and Chicago.
Compton and Watts are suburban imo. That's not where LA people on this forum are referring to when they talk about the urban parts of LA. But LA doesn't have any neighborhoods without sidewalks that I can think of. I have seen some like that from DC posted here.
And compare it to DC's 14th most walkable nabe according to Walkscore (Adams-Morgan is clearly not less walkable than Judiciary Square, but that's beside the point):
Even in L.A.'s densest areas, it still feels rather auto-dependent. That's why it doesn't make anyone's short list of "super urban cities" except for the few ardent L.A. supporters in the ether world.
Well, there might be two issues with your koreatown example. One is that you're looking at a block that is residential only (and east coast cities have that as well) when there is a street with mixed use and commercial/retail at street level both half a block south and two blocks over. The second is that the location you chose isn't actually in Koreatown. Koreatown is bound Western, Olympic, Vermont and West 3rd.
This is what's at the end of the block. It may look somewhat like an endless strip mall, but it's packed on all around by dense grid of multi-story apartment complexes rather than single-family homes and winding cul-de-sacs. What's more, the actual shops on offer there aren't run-of-the-mill chains, but an often cosmopolitan mosaic of shops, services, and restaurants. It certainly doesn't look like an East Coast city, but in terms of its actual functionality, it is very urban--an area dense with both residential and commercial activity.
Anyhow, I have no particular affection for the city. It's certainly urban, but oftentimes not urban in a way that I appreciate. For one thing, I just don't much like the look of it. I also feel that its urbanity is grimier overall than the other cities. That being said, Los Angeles is a very urban city in its core--comparable to the others in that sense (though in a very different form in places), but pretty terrible percentage-wise (that big of a MSA/CSA and yet just competitive with metros much, much smaller than it). It is getting better though--a decade ago, Los Angeles would have been completely out of its league.
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, DC is urban but its urban footprint is a fraction of LA's urban footprint
