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But it depends where you are, though. If you're in Washington Heights, and say "I'm heading downtown", it could be to Harlem, Lincoln Center, or Midtown.
On the subway yes. But otherwise I really doubt that someone from Washington Heights would say to a friend "I am going downtown this afternoon" if they are heading to Lincoln Center.
On the subway yes. But otherwise I really doubt that someone from Washington Heights would say to a friend "I am going downtown this afternoon" if they are heading to Lincoln Center.
I used to live up there, and we would say it all the time, but maybe Washington Heights is unique? I don't know.
But it depends where you are, though. If you're in Washington Heights, and say "I'm heading downtown", it could be to Harlem, Lincoln Center, or Midtown.
I can't speak for what people in Washington Heights say because I don't speak Spanish. I'd have to ask a Dominican.
I do agree that "going downtown" does not necessarily mean Lower Manhattan.
I have heard people from the Bronx say "I'm going downtown to Harlem." You don't hear it often because most people would just say "I'm going to Harlem" and that's that. You can Google the expression and see what you find.
I have also heard people say "I'm going downtown to Midtown." I don't hear the reverse ("I'm going uptown to Midtown") because "Uptown" means something much more specific and defined than "Downtown" in NYC, imo. "Uptown" is simply shorthand for Harlem and sometimes the Bronx depending on who you ask. I personally associate "Uptown" with Harlem and the Bronx.
It may also depend on local traditions regarding the Bronx. I find it very interesting that some people still call the Bronx Uptown even though today it is a completely different borough.
Beginning in 1873, New York began expanding from Manhattan Island onto the mainland of Westchester County. But until 1898 this mainland portion (todays Bronx) had no local government, it was just another part of the city. Only in 1898 did the Bronx become a separate borough. So there was a 25 year gap when the Bronx really was the Uptown of New York and still survives as a tradition.
Another even older tradition is having the word THE in the Bronx. This goes back to the 1600s.
man, who knew the semantics of the word downtown could elicit such passion?
I've always seen anything south of Central Park in Manhattan as "downtowninsh" When I first visited NYC in the mid-80's, Downtown and Midtown were quite distinct and you could really feel a bit of an energy chasm between the two. But last time I was there a few years ago, you could hardly notice a transition.
having said that, I not surprisingly, prefer Chicago's downtown. There is something about the interplay between nature (lake, river, sky) and built environment, with parkland mediating between the two that is unlike anywhere on Earth.
I can't speak for what people in Washington Heights say because I don't speak Spanish. I'd have to ask a Dominican.
I do agree that "going downtown" does not necessarily mean Lower Manhattan.
Wash Heights isn't all Dominican. It never was. They're the biggest group, but have been moving to the Bronx for decades now.
Wash Heights was mostly Irish, with heavy Cuban, PR, and Jewish populations until about 30 years ago. Now Wash Heights is steadily getting more hipster and yuppie, and growth of Russians and non-Dominican Hispanics.
I have heard people from the Bronx say "I'm going downtown to Harlem." You don't hear it often because most people would just say "I'm going to Harlem" and that's that. You can Google the expression and see what you find.
I have also heard people say "I'm going downtown to Midtown." I don't hear the reverse ("I'm going uptown to Midtown") because "Uptown" means something much more specific and defined than "Downtown" in NYC, imo. "Uptown" is simply shorthand for Harlem and sometimes the Bronx depending on who you ask. I personally associate "Uptown" with Harlem and the Bronx.
I thought Uptown could sometimes refer to the Upper West Side and Upper East Side. In Billy Joel's Uptown Girl, the Uptown Girl was obviously not from Harlem, Washington Heights or The Bronx. Maybe it's changed.
man, who knew the semantics of the word downtown could elicit such passion?
I've always seen anything south of Central Park in Manhattan as "downtowninsh" When I first visited NYC in the mid-80's, Downtown and Midtown were quite distinct and you could really feel a bit of an energy chasm between the two. But last time I was there a few years ago, you could hardly notice a transition.
having said that, I not surprisingly, prefer Chicago's downtown. There is something about the interplay between nature (lake, river, sky) and built environment, with parkland mediating between the two that is unlike anywhere on Earth.
THAT is why i would give Chicago the edge on this one. BOTH are great but i prefer Chicago's a lil bit more for the reasons you stated.
man, who knew the semantics of the word downtown could elicit such passion?
I've always seen anything south of Central Park in Manhattan as "downtowninsh" When I first visited NYC in the mid-80's, Downtown and Midtown were quite distinct and you could really feel a bit of an energy chasm between the two. But last time I was there a few years ago, you could hardly notice a transition.
having said that, I not surprisingly, prefer Chicago's downtown. There is something about the interplay between nature (lake, river, sky) and built environment, with parkland mediating between the two that is unlike anywhere on Earth.
Lol, the semantics of "downtown", "midtown" and "uptown" is one reason I believe that the term may have started in New York or at least came to New York very early.
To many New Yorkers there is a clear difference in locations between Downtown and Midtown, although as you see it depends on where the individual is coming from. I can sort of see of what your are saying about the energy chasm between the two - Downtown used to be dead during the weekend. That's changing.
After reading your last paragraph about parks in Chicago, I think you will also like they are building in Brooklyn right across form Downtown Manhattan.
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