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Transit still feels busy in Seattle, though part of that is reduced frequencies during Covid. And ridership will keep growing once people go back to the office, even if a lot of people work from home in the new normal.
Plus, it's not just a way to address surge traffic. People should be able to travel easily by transit in any city.
These are all fair points. IDK, I guess I've just found Seattle's light rail pretty disappointing given how people talk about it, but Seattle is a much denser city than the other two, so there just are more high-density neighborhoods that could be covered. Also the higher traffic volume here makes the need for greater light rail coverage more in-your-face.
And while I don't tend to count future developments when assessing cities' livability, I do like that people have approved funding all these extra Link lines that won't be finished for another 15 or 20 years. They might not even personally still live here or be alive when those are finished, but they want their kids and fellow citizens to have access to them. It speaks well of people's values here.
Yeah I think I expect more from a city/metro like Seattle, if that makes sense? Given how long it's been growing both in neighborhood density and a pro-transit population, plus being a pretty wealthy region from the tech boom, I'm surprised they didn't invest in rail transit earlier. But the important thing is they're doing it now, and it's nice to see progress & construction even if the network isn't perfect or complete.
And I do think future developments are worth considering. The depressing thing here in Denver is that our leadership - and that of RTD - is sitting on their hands at the moment; we currently have 0 rail projects under construction, and BRT is lost in feasibility study purgatory that makes it seem a long way off. It gives the impression that, unlike Portland/Seattle, addressing that lack of neighborhood connectivity is not a priority here. Regular buses are okay and get the job done, but they are beholden to the same traffic as everyone else, so to me it's not a great alternative. As long as driving is easier and more pleasant (which in Denver it is for most people), that's going to be the 1st choice for those with the means.
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Originally Posted by Gfitz1010
Valid criticisms but on the contrary both Denver and Portland have much better rail connectivity to the rest of their metros. Seattle lacks severely in that area compared to the other two. All need work, Portland probably the least of all.
Honestly in the post-pandemic times (should they ever come), I don't think funneling a bunch of people from the suburban Park-N-Rides into downtown Denver will be as important or beneficial. Still good for sporting events, etc, but is that enough? At least for myself, it's essentially a useless system.
Last edited by boomtown boi; 09-30-2021 at 10:28 AM..
I'd also say people are friendlier in Denver. Seattle and Portland have that West Coast snootiness, although the suburbs tend to be much friendlier than the cities proper.
Agree on both points. To Denver's credit, it's a quite friendly city and metro area overall, and doesn't have much of the standoffish culture I detect when visiting Seattle proper. However when visiting my aunt in Edmonds, WA this summer, it also seemed pretty friendly, so I would assume that could be true of other suburbs and smaller cities in the PNW.
I'm in a similar boat, but I also have some wonderful friends here (more like chosen family) which will make it harder to leave. I do find the sugar-coated Denver boosterism a fascinating phenomina though - I think it has a lot to do with people trying to justify the ever increasing cost of living here. I mean - who wants to admit they pay an arm and a leg to live in a place that is average at best in terms of built environment/transit, with a mediocre food scene, etc? The main perks to me to are the amount of sunny days, Red Rocks concerts when I can afford them, and the 30 min. proximity to hiking in Boulder (on a Saturday morning this is still possible, I avoid the I-70 rat race altogether). Nothing I love about living here is tied to the city itself.
Since I'm most likely going to be stuck here for another year, I'm considering moving out to Boulder or even further west since I'm pretty much 95% WFH. I have a 4wd now and pretty much no reason to keep toughing it out near downtown Denver. Also, it's getting harder and harder to portage kayaks in Denver apartments lol.
... It gives the impression that, unlike Portland/Seattle, addressing that lack of neighborhood connectivity is not a priority here. Regular buses are okay and get the job done, but they are beholden to the same traffic as everyone else, so to me it's not a great alternative. As long as driving is easier and more pleasant (which in Denver it is for most people), that's going to be the 1st choice for those with the means.
Honestly in the post-pandemic times (should they ever come), I don't think funneling a bunch of people from the suburban Park-N-Rides into downtown Denver will be as important or beneficial. Still good for sporting events, etc, but is that enough? At least for myself, it's essentially a useless system.
I think this is real difference between the 3 cities. Seattle and Portland have bottlenecks created by bridges, whereas in Denver this doesn't exist. There are simply more ways to get around in a car freely in any direction. Even though rush hour traffic is bad in all 3 cities, you only have to put up with it once a day in Denver and that doesn't seem to be enough of a deterrent for residents to use public transit more.
I love how some people seem to think transportation mode trends are about one thing.
Density, quality of system, job concentration, parking, etc., are apparently minor factors!?
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