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I'd disagree. The combined Orlando/Kissimmee urbanized areas (which are contiguous) have a population of 2.1M while the combined contiguous Charlotte/Concord/Gastonia/Rock Hill urbanized areas have a population of 2.0M. Orlando has a significantly larger CSA than Charlotte because it is located in a more populous region with several nodes of urbanization but the region's geography (lakes, state/national parks, nature reserves, etc.) breaks them up; as a result, Orlando/Kissimmee's urbanized area feels somewhat contained and distinct. Lakeland and Daytona Beach don't feel particularly close to Orlando even though they are located within the larger CSA in adjacent MSAs to Orlando's southwest and northeast, respectively.
While I can’t say I fully endorse going too far down the urbanized area nuances, I’d just like to point out that Orlando-Kissimmee UA’s larger population is made in about 35% less area. But also it somehow separates out Deltona’s 200,000 because of a lake (despite Lake Monroe being developed the 7 miles it takes to get from Deltona to Sanford).And that’s without touching Polk or Lake County. The core of Orlando is more populated, and it’s reaches go further out. It’s a different tier.
Edit: Wait, is Statesville in Charlotte’s UA? There is a reason I don’t like going down the Urbanized area route.
I couldn’t disagree more about your perception of Orlando. Have you been to ACTUAL Orlando? Away from the tourist bubble?
I specifically seek out that part of town (downtown, central Orlando) and make sure to stay there when I visit. Lake Eola is great. There's some cute brick street urban neighborhoods there too. Have you ever been to Dayton? It's built environment surpasses Orlando. It's Orlando, but without the endless suburbs, so it's metro is only 870,000. It sprawls all the way to Cincy's suburbs, and it still doesn't make Dayton feel bigger than it is. Same for Orlando and Tampa Bay. I'm not saying that Dayton and Orlando are in the same tier, I'm saying Orlando is underbuilt and lacking in sense of place, for a metro that will finish the decade with 3 MILLION PEOPLE!!!
Central Florida feels massive. The caveat is I don’t know what the transition between San Antonio/Austin feels like. But I-4 is basically 120 miles of near continuous buildout. Tampa is kinda it’s own thing, but I guess the question is when will Polk County join Orlando’s MSA. But it’s a matter of when and not if.
We are just gonna have to agree to disagree. There is a gap between Tampa and Orlando. My parents live in Parrish. I will actually be in Tampa again the 2nd week in June. Charlotte feels a little bigger than both as separate entities... I do agree though they are gonna smash into each other eventually.
We are just gonna have to agree to disagree. There is a gap between Tampa and Orlando. My parents live in Parrish. I will actually be in Tampa again the 2nd week in June. Charlotte feels a little bigger than both as separate entities... I do agree though they are gonna smash into each other eventually.
No, Orlando is bigger on the ground even not including Polk county. Orlando’s UA at 600 square miles is more populated than Mecklenburg, Union, and York counties which covers 3 times the area. And that’s before we mention Kissimmee.
We are just gonna have to agree to disagree. There is a gap between Tampa and Orlando. My parents live in Parrish. I will actually be in Tampa again the 2nd week in June. Charlotte feels a little bigger than both as separate entities... I do agree though they are gonna smash into each other eventually.
I don't think Orlando and Tampa will ever merge, primarily due to the Green Swamp that separates them.
That being said, I the TB area feels larger than both Orlando and Charlotte, to me, particularly due to Pinellas County's virtually uninterrupted density. Tampa itself has that industrial vibe to it, especially with the port in the heart of the city. Adding St-Pete, Clearwater, and the rest of Pinellas to the mix, it just feels like a bigger place.
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Originally Posted by austiNati
I specifically seek out that part of town (downtown, central Orlando) and make sure to stay there when I visit. Lake Eola is great. There's some cute brick street urban neighborhoods there too. Have you ever been to Dayton? It's built environment surpasses Orlando. It's Orlando, but without the endless suburbs, so it's metro is only 870,000. It sprawls all the way to Cincy's suburbs, and it still doesn't make Dayton feel bigger than it is. Same for Orlando and Tampa Bay. I'm not saying that Dayton and Orlando are in the same tier, I'm saying Orlando is underbuilt and lacking in sense of place, for a metro that will finish the decade with 3 MILLION PEOPLE!!!
I have not been to Dayton. However, I do think that Orlando gets sold a bit short on these boards due to its relatively low skyline and lack of skyscrapers, and C-D's love for those. The core is much bigger and more active than most give it credit for, and it extends for quite some time following Orange Ave and Mills, North and South of downtown. I lived in Baldwin Park for a short period while working downtown, and it just seemed like there was an active urban node that extended from Winter Park down to SoDo, and again along Colonial from Semoran to OBT. The entirety of the I-4 corridor is also extremely built out. Similar to what I did in Charlotte by riding the Blue line, I suggest visitors in Orlando ride the Sunrail from Sanford to Kissimmee to see the extent of the urban environment.
Unfortunately, the hideous suburban sprawl around the city gives many a terrible impression of the place.
I find it to be an almost direct comparison to Charlotte, minus the skyline.
It absolutely does feel like a metro area of 3M people (as far as US cities are concerned anyway.)
Central Florida feels massive. The caveat is I don’t know what the transition between San Antonio/Austin feels like. But I-4 is basically 120 miles of near continuous buildout. Tampa is kinda it’s own thing, but I guess the question is when will Polk County join Orlando’s MSA. But it’s a matter of when and not if.
Austin and San Antonio aren't connected as cities at all in my opinion. However, Hays County (Austin MSA) and Comal County (SA MSA) are very connected. San Marcos and New Braunfels are only 15 mins from each other whereas they are 30+traffic to Austin/San Antonio.
I don't see the single CSA happening. The issue is that Austin doesn't have that many jobs on the south side, so there isn't too many people that are going to commute in from Comal County, even if costs are cheaper there. Maybe if Tesla gets really big that could change. I think a CSA with Austin/Killeen/Temple is more likely, as those areas are better positioned for commuting into North Austin's tech economy. Particularly with the stuff getting built in places like Hutto and Taylor.
Right now San Marcos is a college town fairly independent from Austin and NB is a retirement community fairly independent from SA.
Last edited by whereiend; 05-20-2022 at 06:56 PM..
To me, it’s really two completing cities of peers which are Nashville and Charlotte. If indeed both cities got 90% of what is proposed built, both will finally look like major cities. Indy is more established like mos midwestern cities in terms of “major” city appearance. Welcome to the party Nash-Vegas and QC. Y’all can bicker about the nuances.
Although Nashville has a larger HBCU presence, Charlotte benefits from a much larger Black base population in the Carolinas…it has become a large draw for Black folk.
Austin and San Antonio aren't connected as cities at all in my opinion. However, Hays County (Austin MSA) and Comal County (SA MSA) are very connected. San Marcos and New Braunfels are only 15 mins from each other whereas they are 30+traffic to Austin/San Antonio.
I don't see the single CSA happening. The issue is that Austin doesn't have that many jobs on the south side, so there isn't too many people that are going to commute in from Comal County, even if costs are cheaper there. Maybe if Tesla gets really big that could change. I think a CSA with Austin/Killeen/Temple is more likely, as those areas are better positioned for commuting into North Austin's tech economy. Particularly with the stuff getting built in places like Hutto and Taylor.
Right now San Marcos is a college town fairly independent from Austin and NB is a retirement community fairly independent from SA.
Are Austin and San Antonio really southern? They are extremely close to each other. But I don’t think either are really “southern” so to speak. Nashville and Charlotte, leave no doubt are southern… and my reasoning for the best peer comparisons.
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