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So Atlanta is more outgoing... OK, but they are also far more pretentious.
I'm from LA too (well Long Beach) so I know materialism as well, and I have no idea how you think being pretentious is better??? I can't stand those kind of people you just described.
Yes. I would rather deal with people who are more open and will acknowledge you as another human over people who are standoffish, materialistic or not!
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Originally Posted by Galounger
CO_Transplant I repped you because as a person living in Atlanta who has visited and has family in Denver I completely agree with your assessment. Except, that is, for the two things I highlighted above. At the present time Atlanta definitely has the better transit but if Denver keeps expanding as it is it could very well catch up quickly.
Most people that don't appreciate the Atlanta transit system don't because they are afraid of a few freaks that frequent the system as you are. But, it's definitely no worse than New York's system which I've used before. It's faster and carries more people than Denver's light rail because it's a heavy subway system and thanks to Atlanta's linear layout (it's main route follows this line) it hits most of Atlanta's biggest attractions, hotels, the airport and three major malls.
I think other's agree with me as well because the numbers don't lie. Atlanta's rail daily ridership is 259,000. This is pretty high for any american city. Denver's light rail daily ridership is 69,300. Metro Atlanta is larger which would ofcourse lead to a larger ridership but it's not that much larger.
I don't buy it! Sorry. Atlanta absolutely does not have better transit than Denver. I believe MARTA's recent financial troubles have been so extreme that there was talk of shutting down service on a weekday. MARTA has opened a new train station in 12 years either! As I have stated, MARTA is full of creeps and thugs. It's not a pleasant experience at all and I have always been on edge on MARTA. RTD just doesn't have that concentration of lowlives nor do I have that sinking feeling while riding it. To me ridership has nothing to do with whether a city has better transit. That just tells me more people in Atlanta happen to use the MARTA rail than people in Denver use Denver's light rail. It's just my opinion.
We're not even going to talk about how there is no direct connection between the Lenox MARTA station and that actual mall. People have to run across a busy street because there is no dedicated pedestrian tunnel! I can't imagine having to dart across a busy Atlanta street with Michael Kors bags in my hand, praying I don't get hit. Also, my experience is that Atlanta's layout is anything but linear. It's as if early city planners dumped a bowl of spaghetti on the ground and built the city as such. Atlanta is just not as traditioanlly urban, pedestrian, or transit friendly as Denver! That's just my experience.
I am not going to go back and forth with you over this topic, especially when I don't really like Denver at all and have already stated that Atlanta wins out regardless when other factors are considered!
Geesh! There seems to be no clear consensus on this thread. I too have been to both cities and have a difficult time deciding this question because they each have particular assets that make them unique. Atlanta, an international city with southern charm and history and Denver, a modern-day western city with a definite outdoor appeal. Both are great.
I don't buy it! Sorry. Atlanta absolutely does not have better transit than Denver. I believe MARTA's recent financial troubles have been so extreme that there was talk of shutting down service on a weekday. MARTA has opened a new train station in 12 years either! As I have stated, MARTA is full of creeps and thugs. It's not a pleasant experience at all and I have always been on edge on MARTA. RTD just doesn't have that concentration of lowlives nor do I have that sinking feeling while riding it. To me ridership has nothing to do with whether a city has better transit. That just tells me more people in Atlanta happen to use the MARTA rail than people in Denver use Denver's light rail. It's just my opinion.
We're not even going to talk about how there is no direct connection between the Lenox MARTA station and that actual mall. People have to run across a busy street because there is no dedicated pedestrian tunnel! I can't imagine having to dart across a busy Atlanta street with Michael Kors bags in my hand, praying I don't get hit. Also, my experience is that Atlanta's layout is anything but linear. It's as if early city planners dumped a bowl of spaghetti on the ground and built the city as such. Atlanta is just not as traditioanlly urban, pedestrian, or transit friendly as Denver! That's just my experience.
I am not going to go back and forth with you over this topic, especially when I don't really like Denver at all and have already stated that Atlanta wins out regardless when other factors are considered!
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Atlanta absolutely does not have better transit than Denver.
I understand Marta is not the best transit system for you. You've made that abundantly clear. But just because it doesn't fit your criteria of what good transit is doesn't mean it's inferior to Denvers for everyone.
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As I have stated, MARTA is full of creeps and thugs. It's not a pleasant experience at all and I have always been on edge on MARTA.
I've ridden Marta more times than I can count and the majority of people on it are regular folks. Businessmen, nurses, clerks, students, tourist, etc.
Yes there is the occasional homeless person or rowdy teen (what most people are refering to when they say "thugs") But I haven't seen either on board a train in a while. It's certainly no worse than what I saw when I rode on the NYC subway system which is considered by most rail experts to be the best system in the nation.
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To me ridership has nothing to do with whether a city has better transit. That just tells me more people in Atlanta happen to use the MARTA rail than people in Denver use Denver's light rail. It's just my opinion.
People in Denver from what I've observed seem to be no more crazy about cars than people in Atlanta. So, if ridership is so much higher proportionally in Atlanta it has to be for some other reason and my guess is because (presently) MARTA gets people more where they want to go and faster. When riding the train in Denver I noticed most of the really popular locales outside of Downtown and many in Downtown don't have train connects close to them including the Airport.
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We're not even going to talk about how there is no direct connection between the Lenox MARTA station and that actual mall. People have to run across a busy street because there is no dedicated pedestrian tunnel! I can't imagine having to dart across a busy Atlanta street with Michael Kors bags in my hand, praying I don't get hit.
Seriously? The Lenox station to Lenox mall connection is one of the most convenient I've seen in a city. You cross a relatively small street make a short walk through a pleasant attractive office building plaza (with a very nice fountain and benches) and boom you're in the mall. Once again, I've rode on the NYC subway several times and even there often you're going to have to do a little walking from the subway stop to where you're going and sometimes required to cross much crazier streets than Lenox road. Even using the subway we did a ton of walking around Manhattan along with thousands of other people one Christmas. New Yorkers are used to walking alot. Alot of the women have very nice legs because of this.
People in Denver from what I've observed seem to be no more crazy about cars than people in Atlanta. So, if ridership is so much higher proportionally in Atlanta it has to be for some other reason and my guess is because (presently) MARTA gets people more where they want to go and faster. When riding the train in Denver I noticed most of the really popular locales outside of Downtown and many in Downtown don't have train connects close to them including the Airport.
In Denver's defense here, it has been pointed out that MARTA is an older, more built out system than Denver's right now (though Denver is getting there.) Also, the Metro Atlanta area has about 2 million more people than Metro Denver. Between those two factors, that might explain some of the higher ridership figures for Atlanta. Denver's Park & Ride system is notoriously full, particularly on Weekdays and frequently on Game Days.
In Denver's defense here, it has been pointed out that MARTA is an older, more built out system than Denver's right now (though Denver is getting there.) Also, the Metro Atlanta area has about 2 million more people than Metro Denver. Between those two factors, that might explain some of the higher ridership figures for Atlanta. Denver's Park & Ride system is notoriously full, particularly on Weekdays and frequently on Game Days.
I thought Denvers light rail was really cool but they're two different kinds of trains. If Atlanta had as many stations as Denver it's ridership would most likely surpass Denver's by even much more.
Even when it is full RTD would have a very hard time carrying as many people as MARTA because it is light rail compared to MARTA heavy rail. There's a big difference (see below). MARTA is also faster, especially downtown, because it isn't stopped by traffic which it either goes under or over. I think Denver now has more stations than MARTA though but you're right MARTA rail is much older having opened it's first line in 1978.
I think Denver is slightly similar in development as Atlanta with a North-South development trend... i-25 is a beautiful interstate system, but unfortunately our East/west i-70 from the airport is horrific and an embarrassment, not to mention life-threatening.
One interesting thing I've noticed is that the architecture here in Denver was absolutely horrendous during the 70's. I've never seen so many cheap looking houses as I have here in Denver, especially around the Western part of the city near lakewood and the northeast and such. A lot of those areas look like Mexican shanty-towns for someone who's lived in the East.
This is in contrast to Atlanta, where I find homes built in the 70's to be built with higher quality than even today and they keep their value, and acreage is higher.
But since there are no trees in Colorado architectural flaws tend to stand out, whereas in Atlanta the natural beauty overgrows and makes a neighborhood better and better by the year. A lot of homes around Centennial you can tell will look like crap in 10-20 years.
And Denver's ethnic flavored Federal BLVD makes Buford highway look like Rodeo Drive.
Last edited by filmsequal; 10-25-2012 at 08:01 PM..
I've noticed that same thing about suburban houses here in Sacramento... most of them are built like crap. The further east you go, the better built the suburbs seem to be... thanks for all the responses so far!
Really - the Denver area is worth the potential of cold, standoffish people and everything else. I just went back for a week and I really appreciated the people. People are not in you face friendly, but they ARE friendly and kind. Also, it really just depends on where you are. There are a lot Texans and Southerners there - obviously super friendly. There are alot of folks from Cali who bring more materialism and judgement, but they are still pretty loose. Atlanta is a better city for shopping and urban living, I think though. I am an outdoorsy person though, so that's not my thing. My relatives never go hiking and only shop, go out to eat, and do urban things. I don't get why they live in Denver....
I thought Denvers light rail was really cool but they're two different kinds of trains. If Atlanta had as many stations as Denver it's ridership would most likely surpass Denver's by even much more.
Even when it is full RTD would have a very hard time carrying as many people as MARTA because it is light rail compared to MARTA heavy rail. There's a big difference (see below). MARTA is also faster, especially downtown, because it isn't stopped by traffic which it either goes under or over. I think Denver now has more stations than MARTA though but you're right MARTA rail is much older having opened it's first line in 1978.
Denver RTD light rail
An excellent point. Two very different kinds of trains - and systems. It will be interesting to see what happens when Denver finally builds out our commuter rail service to the Airport, as well as the Gold Line. I still don't think we'll have the kind of ridership that Atlanta has, but I think we'll be a lot closer.
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Originally Posted by coloradocutter
Really - the Denver area is worth the potential of cold, standoffish people and everything else. I just went back for a week and I really appreciated the people. People are not in you face friendly, but they ARE friendly and kind. Also, it really just depends on where you are. There are a lot Texans and Southerners there - obviously super friendly. There are alot of folks from Cali who bring more materialism and judgement, but they are still pretty loose. Atlanta is a better city for shopping and urban living, I think though. I am an outdoorsy person though, so that's not my thing. My relatives never go hiking and only shop, go out to eat, and do urban things. I don't get why they live in Denver....
I agree. Denver's "reputation" for being cold and standoffish I think is much more about people just being a little more in to not intruding on other people (the old "live and let live" slogan.) I've never had an issue starting a conversation with someone in Denver. People are almost always friendly and extremely helpful...it's just that people are less likely here to go out of their way and *assume* you need help or want to talk. If you're not broadcasting "talk to me!" then most people will probably leave you alone. It's not because they dislike you or aren't interested...just that I think Denverites don't wish to intrude...and sometimes just don't wish to be intruded upon.
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