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How many fraudulent votes cast in Florida during the 2000 election would have been prevented by voter ID?
...Accept for those that sued the state of PA to get the law overturned.
I don't know, how many fraudulent votes were cast in Florida in 2000? I don't feel like digging through 14 yr old links. From what I remember, the issue wasn't fraudulent votes and more to do with "does this hanging chad count and did the names line up so the person voted for the correct candidate."
As for PA, I don't follow the laws in that state, so I don't know the issues with their voter ID law that they wanted or what changes were needed to be made to get it to pass.
I admit, it is a pain to dig out the birth cert or request a copy from your state of birth (I don't mind this though if it helps reduce fraudulent voting)... but who DOES NOT keep their SS card in a place they will remember? LOL
Maybe there should be a life organizational test as requirement for voting as well. Sheesh.
No, that would be unconstitutional.
Voting is a citizen right, period.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas Minded
Key word... "citizen".
What kind of citizen has no legitimate state ID.
A state ID is not a requirement of citizenship, so your question is irrelevant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmsterp
Voter fraud isn't a real thing?
Imagine a liquor store owner who never checks anyone's ID. Seeing that this provides incentives to buy liquor illegally, one is tempted to ask the liquor store owner if anyone ever takes advantage of this. The owner says "why, I've never caught anyone buying liquor underage! I can't point to a single example of that happening, so it must not be a problem"
Because someone will point it out, obviously voting is a fundamental right and liquor is not, but that fact is completely irrelevant to the point. The liquor store owner didn't think anyone purchased liquor underage since he never saw anyone's ID! How would he know? The point is, if you do nothing to detect voter fraud, then obviously you will not turn up any examples of voter fraud!
Voter registration.
The only things that have to be verified are citizenship and age. Both of which are done by having a social security number (which all U.S. citizens have).
The burden of proof is on you. How does a photo ID prove citizenship any more than voter registration does?
There has been lots of investigations into voter fraud each election and it rarely turns up any real voter fraud, and went actual voter fraud do turn up, a photo ID wouldn't have prevented anything.
Just so I know you're not spouting off talking points, what methods do these investigations use to determine whether each vote was cast fraudulently or not? Do tell me how they could possibly know. It seems the only way to find out would be to verify that the voter says who they are.
A state ID is not a requirement of citizenship, so your question is irrelevant.
Voter registration.
The only things that have to be verified are citizenship and age. Both of which are done by having a social security number (which all U.S. citizens have).
The burden of proof is on you. How does a photo ID prove citizenship any more than voter registration does?
It doesn't, it proves that that person is who they say they are. Say I have John Doe's SSN. I have the ability to prove that John Doe is an of-age citizen and thus meets the only two criteria for voting. What I haven't proven, however, is whether or not I am John Doe. But I guess they can just take my word for it
Imagine a liquor store owner who never checks anyone's ID. Seeing that this provides incentives to buy liquor illegally, one is tempted to ask the liquor store owner if anyone ever takes advantage of this. The owner says "why, I've never caught anyone buying liquor underage! I can't point to a single example of that happening, so it must not be a problem"
Because someone will point it out, obviously voting is a fundamental right and liquor is not, but that fact is completely irrelevant to the point. The liquor store owner didn't think anyone purchased liquor underage since he never saw anyone's ID! How would he know? The point is, if you do nothing to detect voter fraud, then obviously you will not turn up any examples of voter fraud!
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Most Americans who vote regularly do not mind showing Photo IS, Voters card, just make sure the final step is completed. I think what some people get caught up with is if the voter show to the voting facility or the Voter Registration on the role does not match.
The vote is not discarded , but goes to a "provisionary vote." Meaning The Board of Elections will correct or verify who that person is and make any last minute changes. Then the vote is added to the overall ballad.
Oh, the PROBLEM these RW think-tank voter ID laws are trying to solve is obvious to anyone with half a brain. The Dem base is booming, and the GOP base is shrinking.
The GOP guys with the slide rules know, the FEWER people eligible to vote, the better for the GOP. So, let's require forms of ID that our studies have shown, by a slim but constant margin, Dems are appreciably less likely to have in their possession.
We'll call it "fraud prevention"!
Whatsat? You say voter fraud via impersonation at the polls is virtually non-existant? So??? If we prevent ONE fraudulent vote, it will be worth it! (Actual position taken by Scott Walker in last weeks debate).
Oh, the PROBLEM these RW think-tank voter ID laws are trying to solve is obvious to anyone with half a brain. The Dem base is booming, and the GOP base is shrinking.
The GOP guys with the slide rules know, the FEWER people eligible to vote, the better for the GOP. So, let's require forms of ID that our studies have shown, by a slim but constant margin, Dems are appreciably less likely to have in their possession.
We'll call it "fraud prevention"!
Whatsat? You say voter fraud via impersonation at the polls is virtually non-existant? So??? If we prevent ONE fraudulent vote, it will be worth it! (Actual position taken by Scott Walker in last weeks debate).
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Where do you get this stuff! There has been great length in how the voter registration works from the DMV, to what kind of Documents the voter need. What is a good ID, that is free 100% of the time. Every state has a mandated process to obtain a DL and register to vote. There is no mystery here.:th ink:
State of Georgia will come to your area to sing you up free!
Photo ID and your voters card is the last step in a measured process. There will be some who feel the need to break the law, but those who end up in jail on Federal Charges.
Everyone in American has ID of a Drivers Lic. We use ID in every day life. Bank, Notary, Legal business, Shopping at Macys.
As far as voter turn out. I think democrats have seal their fate by their own doing. They are going lose more than they think and most Dems are in Def. Con #3 now!
Unfortunately, those who do not like Voter ID is suspect. Everyone wants clean election, Independent Democrat and Republican alike.
Just so I know you're not spouting off talking points, what methods do these investigations use to determine whether each vote was cast fraudulently or not? Do tell me how they could possibly know. It seems the only way to find out would be to verify that the voter says who they are.
Hardly a talking point, just search for any thread in here talking about "rampant voter fraud" and then actually read what was found in that "voter fraud" and it rarely turns out to be like what the poster is saying. The Franken voter fraud is a good one, there wasn't 1099 fraudulent votes, there was only at most a couple hundred questionable votes, and the issue was with the fact that felons might have voted in the election, which if their names are on the voting rolls, then an ID wouldn't have prevented them from being able to vote.
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