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Maybe the rancor for Joe the Plumber is more base and of a deeper nature than the rhetoric given here. He is white and bald. Not a real good place to be anymore in this nation, especially when put in the limelight of any measure of prosperity. Now if he was a minority (and maybe even had a full head of hair), people would be falling all over him singing his praises. Just a thought....
You can't be serious? People would sing his praises if he was a successful client of Hair Club for Men - seriously???!!!
I'm not falling all over him because I really don't care what he has to say. It has nothing to do with his race, gender or follicle count. We all have opinions. We can all express them. I'll pay closer attention to those that have an impact on my future (boss, presidential candidate, wife.)
What is interesting is that people are more than willing to spend someone else's money!
Oh I want this...........this.........and this.............. if you pay for it!
The worst financial crisis is always the one that is happening now. No matter what the data actually says. It's not just me and McCain. If it is it's a sad state of affairs for the nation. Yes the graphs are fairly old and things have gotten worse I don't disagree. That does not mean the world is over or that this was the worst 8 years ever.
You actually think trickle down economics is working? You and McCain who still thinks the economy is fundamentally sound. Some graph that you pulled out of God knows where does not negate what is common sense to most of us. Trickle down economics is making the rich richer and the middle class poorer. That is a miserable failure in my opinion and, thankfully, the majority share my views.
Look at the car industry, for example. Why is it that so many in manufacturing and sales are losing their jobs by the thousands? It's simple. Because the middle class doesn't have any money to buy any new cars. Why are Home Depots closing all over the country? Because middle class people don't have any money for home improvement, if they still have a home at all. More jobs will be lost if we continue down the path we have been going.
As far as how the CEO's I mentioned in my previous post walked away with millions? I really do not know. But I sure do know that it is criminal that they did. That is the real issue.
Boards determine pay for CEO's. They have to find the best of the best and that does not happen with $60k/year. Would you run a billion dollar company and take the risk of utter disaster if you fail for a cool $100k/year....
Again why did they fail.....Look no further than the Union's. For the people and against the business.....to bad you don't have people without the business.
Biden takes a shot at Joe the Plumber - Questions his credibility..
What a low move from Biden.
First the guy says it's patriotic to pay higher taxes.
Then he supports the socialistic "pass the wealth around" BS.
Now he actually questions Joe's credibility....
Obama and Biden are so out of touch and CLUELESS! Maybe in the academic and journalism elite circles they only associate with super wealthy business owners.. BUT out here in the real world 250k is not a lot of money for a small business to make.
I know plenty of contracters, entrepeneurs and work at home people who are running a business making over 250k and very scared about the policies being proposed....
And the democratic response is to try and paint every business owner with this broad brush of executive excess.
I can't wait until these guys disapper back into the shadows of DC
By latching onto the artificial device of "joesixpak," or some plumber named Joe, it shows the GOP has NO knowledge or understanding whatsoever of the average citizen. These mythical "american working man" creations are insipid cartoons and show the GOP's contempt for we the people.
Obama does not try to characterize us with these insipid devices. Having worked at street level to make better the lives of his fellow citizens, he has profound insights into the common needs and aspirations of us all.
That same line of thinking - that some have achieved too much and therefore it's not 'fair' - is exactly what's dumbing down our kids in our public school systems, too. Many schools refuse to group students by skill/achievement level and insist on mixed-ability classrooms where the curriculum is aimed at the low-middle because that is the level at which the majority in the mixed-ability class can achieve.
Professor Dan Singal analyzes what happened, why it happened, and the consequences (keep in mind that this article was written before the SAT had to be recentered in 1995 - making scores higher than they would have been - because SAT scores have been consistently declining), lengthy, but important to read to find out why this has happened and how some schools have bucked the trend...
"While students in the bottom quartile have shown slow but steady improvement since the 1960s, average test scores have nonetheless gone down, primarily because of the performance of those in the top quartile.This "highest cohort of achievers," Rudman writes, has shown "the greatest declines across a variety of subjects as well as across age-level groups." Analysts have also found "a substantial drop among those children in the middle range of achievement," he continues, "but less loss and some modest gains at the lower levels." In other words, our brightest youngsters, those most likely to be headed for selective colleges, have suffered the most dramatic setbacks over the past two decades--a fact with grave implications for our ability to compete with other nations in the future.
The Other Crisis in American Education - 91.11 (http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/educatio/singalf.htm - broken link)
And, Joann DiGenarro of the Center for Excellence in Education (which works in collaboration with MIT) has this to say about what's happeneing to academic talent in our schools:
The ugly secret is that our most talented students are falling through the cracks. Not one program of such major governmental agencies as the National Institutes of Health, the National Science Foundation or NASA specifically targets the top 5 percent of students who have demonstrated academic excellence and have the greatest potential for becoming our inventors, creators and groundbreaking scientists. An international assessment of math problem-solving skills of 15-year-olds in 2004, along with more recent studies, found that the United States had the fewest top performers and the largest percentage of low performers compared with other participating countries. By the time students reach 12th grade in math and science, they are near the bottom or dead last compared with international competition, according to the Education Department. Joann DiGennaro - Gifted Minds We Need to Nurture - washingtonpost.com
What happens when you refuse to encourage and nourish excellence is that you get exactly what we have now, a rising tide of mediocrity - not a world class educated populace or a world class economy.
"Our nation is at risk. The educational foundations of our society are presently being eroded by a rising tide of mediocrity. If an unfriendly foreign power had attempted to impose on America the mediocre educational performance that exists today, we might well have viewed it as an act of war. We have, in effect, been committing an act of unthinking, unilateral educational disarmament. History is not kind to idlers." - A Nation At Risk, 1983.
Excellent post and spot on!!!!!! Facts are facts and it's a sad day when we close our eyes to this truth in education!!!
Does it really matter if people can "relate" to Joe the Plumber? That should not have an effect on one's voting decision. I relate to a lot of people doesn't mean that I think they should represent our country.
He struck a chord with conservatives who are grasping at straws right now.
No, I think he struck a chord with everyone who is not an Obama zombie and wants to know what Obama REALLY stands for. And those people are listening to Joe the plumber and finding out the truth.
Whats wrong with small-business owners taking side-jobs for cash? The way you see it, it is not illegal. According to you, you are just trying to survive and pay your bills and feed your family. They are being smart because they don't have to pay tax on the income. When a business owner takes income on the side and does not report it, it is illegal. That is an undisputed fact. Lets think larger. Large business has been the target of the liberals and Dems for ages. They view them as a large bucket of money to tap and redistribute to people like you who have no respect for the law anyway. Lets expand on your comments.
Sir: you paraphrase wrong again. I never typed "and they can get their taxable income low or near zero."
Please do me a favor, if you're going to paraphrase my posts, do so accurately.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewMexicanRepublican
You stated, and I paraphrase, "shrewd business owners know that everything is a deduction and they can get their taxable income low or near zero."
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewMexicanRepublican
How ironic that Obama and other liberals criticize large companies for not paying taxes, following the exact same set of laws. In fact, it was the Democrats who initiated the AMT. In the sixties, when taxpayers used the law and tactics which you advocate to to minimize their tax burden (legally, by the way), the Dems came back and said "well, we'll just tax them anyway with a minimum tax." One of the fundamental issues I have with Demmies is their blatant hypocrisy.
You advocate (illegally) not paying taxes, and see nothing wrong with it. Large companies play by the rules and are just "rich crooks". You see nothing wrong with paying a guy less after hours in your backyard, but Ford ships jobs to Mexico to pay less, and they are "shipping our jobs oversees because they are greedy!" It goes on and on. You cannot, in your personal actions, act one way when it is convenient for you, and then expect everybody else to act the "right way." Your actions and statements are not consistent. That is why I questioned your character.
By the way, you have not read the plan and do not understand the implication of Obama's intent. $250,000 may sound like a lot, but in reality the number will be much lower. You do not understand the tax code, or the implications of an S-corp. The jobs in this country are provided by small business owners. Many are S-corps. Research and learn.
Taking money illegally or 'on the side'? everyone knows that. what is the Goverment supposed to do, post a IRS agent at every business?
And, you can continue charater assination if you wish, just don't slander me anymore. And, please, don't paraphrase unless you can do it accurately.
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Biden takes a shot at Joe the Plumber - Questions his credibility..
