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We had a guy at work who was from New Zealand. He had a chinese name, looked chinese and was of chinese ancestry. He was outraged when HR classified him as 'Asian' for diversity purposes. As far as he was concerned he was a New Zealander and not Asian.
We also had a Spanish guy who was over on a two year secondment. Same story. The clowns in HR decided he was 'Hispanic'. He informed them that he was Spanish and European.
the U.S.'s historical attempt to break from Europe. Many Americans don't realize the general disdain that Europeans have for them (at least so far as I can tell), yet continue to believe that we're all one, big, happy "western civilization."
Anyway, are there any Americans who share my thoughts on this? Or, better yet, might there be any Europeans who care to validate my thoughts on this?
I do not recall reading in history of any attempt by Americans to break from Europe. I read about some descendents of English (and a few other mostly northern European) colonists in north America who seceded from the British Empire and formed an independent sovereign entity (they called it a revolution), but others didn't and remained part of the "commonwealth" (whose picture is on the Canadian dollar?). Though a few years later they fought another war over trade routes, they have been butthole allies ever since.
The US and France have been on the same side in every war including the very first war for secession from the British Empire. (France and Britain since the Crimean War, 1853),
Families sometimes quarrel, are enmeshed in petty jealousies, so what?
Having said that, indeed the concept of western civilization is vexed (read some recent and ongoing threads); the US is becoming just as much Asian, for example, as it has been mostly northern European, and who knows what Europe will become in its struggle with Islam (shades of 732 and 1563 all over again) but we probably won't live to see the long-term consequences, if any.
Anyway, I doubt that most Americans live with a concept of "western civilization", just like some slave 2,000 years ago didn't know that he lived in the Roman Empire, or somesuch, most don't even travel abroad, instead they are more concerned with their own daily lives and families, the lord of the manor, and paying the minimum balance on their credit card bills.
Anyway, I lived in Europe almost all the first half of my adult life and never experienced any disdain, not once.
]If one hasn't lived in Europe and at the very least understand the culture and language, then one is not European. People such as you and countless others are above all AMERICAN which there's nothing wrong with that and its something to be proud at just as anyone else should be for what they are.
Agreed - with a condition. Some families are only a generation or two removed from Europe and still knowingly maintain and pass on European traditions. I think it's possible for an American in this situation to feel very connected to their European roots even though they haven't lived in the "mother country."
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Europeans don't hate Americans individually but do dislike its imperialistic, breathing down your throat, in your business attitude in foreign policy and I don't blame them for that.
Considering Europe's history - even the most recent 100 years or so - I find this sentiment REEKING of irony.
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That said there is such a thing as the "ugly American" where some Americans go overseas and act like dumbasses and disrespect other cultures.
I think the same could be said of just about any country - there are going to be a few tourists who give their country a bad name by their boorish behavior. I've seen this first hand, and it's not just Americans that do this - or even MOSTLY Americans.
It only takes one or two bad apples to leave a bad impression.
I do not recall reading in history of any attempt by Americans to break from Europe. I read about some descendents of English (and a few other mostly northern European) colonists in north America who seceded from the British Empire and formed an independent sovereign entity (they called it a revolution), but others didn't and remained part of the "commonwealth" (whose picture is on the Canadian dollar?). Though a few years later they fought another war over trade routes, they have been butthole allies ever since.
The US and France have been on the same side in every war including the very first war for secession from the British Empire. (France and Britain since the Crimean War, 1853),
Families sometimes quarrel, are enmeshed in petty jealousies, so what?
Having said that, indeed the concept of western civilization is vexed (read some recent and ongoing threads); the US is becoming just as much Asian, for example, as it has been mostly northern European, and who knows what Europe will become in its struggle with Islam (shades of 732 and 1563 all over again) but we probably won't live to see the long-term consequences, if any.
Anyway, I doubt that most Americans live with a concept of "western civilization", just like some slave 2,000 years ago didn't know that he lived in the Roman Empire, or somesuch, most don't even travel abroad, instead they are more concerned with their own daily lives and families, the lord of the manor, and paying the minimum balance on their credit card bills.
Anyway, I lived in Europe almost all the first half of my adult life and never experienced any disdain, not once.
What on earth are you talking about?
I agree with you. I have lived in and traveled through Europe and have never experienced any more rudeness from Europeans than I have from any other bunch of folks. I mean, Germans are pretty brusque but so what - so are people from Philadelphia.
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I don't know why Americans make such a big deal about 'ancestry' when for most it plays zero part in their daily lives, unless they are British American.
I don't know why Americans make such a big deal about 'ancestry' when for most it plays zero part in their daily lives, unless they are British American.
Why would it be different if their ancestry was British rather than, say, French or Spanish?
My family is comprised of Dutch, Irish, and Spanish decent. If someone ask where I'm from, I don't say America or say I'm Spanish, I say Texas. My family and I were in Scotland a few years back and everyone knew we were from Texas.
I'm Texan. Not American, but Texan.
People come disrespect our culture too. Its silly and ignorant to say only Americans do this. It seems there are many American stereotypes on here. I've heard that Greeks and French don't like Americans but the thing about SOME Americans is we dont play into the silly stereotype game.
My family is comprised of Dutch, Irish, and Spanish decent. If someone ask where I'm from, I don't say America or say I'm Spanish, I say Texas. My family and I were in Scotland a few years back and everyone knew we were from Texas.
I'm Texan. Not American, but Texan.
People come disrespect our culture too. Its silly and ignorant to say only Americans do this. It seems there are many American stereotypes on here. I've heard that Greeks and French don't like Americans but the thing about SOME Americans is we dont play into the silly stereotype game.
Right on.
I am not a native of Texas but I have lived here for twenty years and married the quintessential Texan - cowboy boots and all.
I consider myself Texan now and I'm proud to call myself that!
Everyone in Minnesota (who has Norwegian ancestors) is really proud of their Norwegian heritage. Walking around Minneapolis you'll see Norway flags on alot of peoples homes and a Norway flag on the bumper of their car.
I'm an American of Irish, English, Scottish, German and French descent. Is it strange that I feel absolutely no attachment to it (or fondness for it) whatsoever?
Americans constantly describe their nationality according to their ancestral background, and I find this to be not only incredibly misinformed, but also somewhat disrespectful in relation to the U.S.'s historical attempt to break from Europe. Many Americans don't realize the general disdain that Europeans have for them (at least so far as I can tell), yet continue to believe that we're all one, big, happy "western civilization." Don't even get me started on the Europhiles of our political Left...
Anyway, are there any Americans who share my thoughts on this? Or, better yet, might there be any Europeans who care to validate my thoughts on this?
I met many Americans that arrived a couple or three generations ago from Europe and had a strong liason with their old country, mostly immigrants arrived during the last 100 years. They even had family in their old country.
But after say 150-200 years or so, you are American. Apart, who the hell knows in the US where the hell their ancestors came from? When immigrants arrived into the New World, they changed their name, country of provenance, age and religion. Many were deserters, left a pregnant wife and 25 beers on credit at the bar of their town.
There's also more mobility in the US, so people moved a lot inside the country and also changed their name and religion. Other had Indian or Black blood and moved away to pass as whites, others changed their country of origin to avoid religious discrimination.
And yes, why so much fixation with the dump they fled from? Even more considering that they would have perished if they had stayed in Europe (religious refugees, deserters, etc).
Last edited by cojoncillo; 07-18-2012 at 04:57 AM..
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