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I see all sorts of half-completed bench presses and squats at the gym all the time. Big muscular guys that don't bring the bar all the way down with far too much weight for them (and one or two reps). I always smile, because they don't realize they're just cheating themselves.
Many in the training community are advising that for bench, you only lower the bar until your upper arm and lower arm are at a right angle. Any deeper and it starts to damage the rotator cuff. Similarly for squats, I hear not to go much lower than parallel to the floor for saving the knees.
Many in the training community are advising that for bench, you only lower the bar until your upper arm and lower arm are at a right angle. Any deeper and it starts to damage the rotator cuff. Similarly for squats, I hear not to go much lower than parallel to the floor for saving the knees.
Who are these "many"?
If I had a dime every time I heard this BS, I could retire early. These wives' tales are years old, they still do not go away, it is like they are the urban legends of the lifting world.
Many in the training community are advising that for bench, you only lower the bar until your upper arm and lower arm are at a right angle. Any deeper and it starts to damage the rotator cuff. Similarly for squats, I hear not to go much lower than parallel to the floor for saving the knees.
You should probably tell all the olympic weight lifters (those novice/amateur and olympic medaling) they're doing squats wrong then.
Are you a trainer? Do you train? Are you competitive in any strength sport? Are you CSCS certified? Do you have a degree?
I "hear" shouldn't be call for factual information or even opinion, for that matter. If you have no basis for argument other than, "I hear", it's not an argument open for discussion.
edit: I doubt you know "many" in the training community.
If I had a dime every time I heard this BS, I could retire early. These wives' tales are years old, they still do not go away, it is like they are the urban legends of the lifting world.
Plenty of articles and trainers. Heck, just google it and you get plenty of returns. I have no idea who you need to collect all the dimes from, but wouldn't want to be the bank teller when you drag them all in.
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You should probably tell all the olympic weight lifters (those novice/amateur and olympic medaling) they're doing squats wrong then.
Are you a trainer? Do you train? Are you competitive in any strength sport? Are you CSCS certified? Do you have a degree?
I "hear" shouldn't be call for factual information or even opinion, for that matter. If you have no basis for argument other than, "I hear", it's not an argument open for discussion.
edit: I doubt you know "many" in the training community.
Whoa... Nowhere did I say full ROM was wrong or are trying to convert anyone. Someone made an observation about all the people he sees doing partial benches. I don't know the extent of the merits for either. But yes, there are 'more than a few handfuls' of trainers out there teaching this. I don't know the educational background of all of them, some I do know are CSCS. Some get high profile articles in magazines for fitness (Men's Health, etc). I know plenty in the training community--and a few of them flat out discourage flat bench now in favor of dumbbells/cables and the latest science.
Internet opinions are usually not worth much, but occasionally give someone a point of reference to do some real investigative research. Such as someone wondering why all the partial benches, can now go look into some of the current trends in teaching.
Then regurgitating the information is a material fallacy and as such, is misleading.
If you don't know the merits of something, then why are you blindly restating "knowledge" that you did not come up with?
It's as good as five wives sitting around the table gossiping about what they "hear", which then turns into pandora's box of harmful information.
Damage to the rotator cuff from any pressing exercise is the causation of tight shoulders and back. Committing to an exercise with a ROM that is past capacity, is begging for injury; the exercise itself does not cause the injury.
The reduction in ACL and PCL forces associated with deep squatting is believed to be a result of an impingement between the posterior aspect of the upper tibia with the posterior femoral condyles as well as compression of various soft tissue structures including menisci, posterior capsule, muscle, fat, and skin (9). This helps to constrain the knee joint, significantly reducing anterior and posterior tibial translation and tibial rotation compared to lesser flexion angles. Hence, tolerance to load is enhanced in the deepest portion of the squat with a protective effect conferred to ligamentous structures.
It can be argued that ligamentous injury risk during squatting is actually greatest in the parallel squat—the position where
PCL forces are at their apex. However, the magnitude of maximal posterior shear during squat performance (approximately
2,700 N) is well below the strength capacity of a young, healthy person’s PCL, which is estimated to exceed 4,000 N (5).
I don't agree with this statement though:
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This would seem to infer that squatting past 90 degrees is superfluous if the goal is to maximize the development of the quadriceps.
To target the quadriceps femoris, a squat depth of 90 degrees appears to be optimal.
Parallel (Powerlifting) style squats definitely engage the hamstrings, much more than the quads. Full squats make use of the Quads more than parallel squats.. evidenced here:
tommodonahue, you do realize that elite athletics are not healthy right?
It would be hardly surprising if those guys weren't juiced to their eyeballs and on HGH as well. Angel Heredia, a former steriod dealer for many high profile Olympic Athletes said that he can make 20 undetectable steriods combinations.
What good is it if your body is in peak condition for 10 years and then you are riddled with numerous injuries for the rest of your life?
Flat bench press is notorious for causing rotator cuff injuries. Perhaps, not to the extent that behind the neck presses are, but it is still common for people to get injured. Additionally, weighlifters have a higher occurance of osteoarthritis in the AC and GL joints.
Honestly, I would scrap weightlifting all together and concentrate on advanced calesthenics and pylometrics. Unless you are playing in the NFL or competing in weightlifting, you will be plenty strong and explosive.
You should investigate some of these Olympic guys that are outside of their prime.
I bet it won't be all flowers and green fields and everything else you're making it out to be.
tommodonahue, you do realize that elite athletics are not healthy right?
It would be hardly surprising if those guys weren't juiced to their eyeballs and on HGH as well. Angel Heredia, a former steriod dealer for many high profile Olympic Athletes said that he can make 20 undetectable steriods combinations.
What good is it if your body is in peak condition for 10 years and then you are riddled with numerous injuries for the rest of your life?
Flat bench press is notorious for causing rotator cuff injuries. Perhaps, not to the extent that behind the neck presses are, but it is still common for people to get injured. Additionally, weighlifters have a higher occurance of osteoarthritis in the AC and GL joints.
Honestly, I would scrap weightlifting all together and concentrate on advanced calesthenics and pylometrics. Unless you are playing in the NFL or competing in weightlifting, you will be plenty strong and explosive.
You should investigate some of these Olympic guys that are outside of their prime.
I bet it won't be all flowers and green fields and everything else you're making it out to be.
Do you have some references to back that up?
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