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I said I think less of the guy who has the physique through the help of drugs than I do from the guy who does it through hard work and clean living. While I agree that the big juiced up bodybuilders also put in tons of effort to obtain that look, it's infinitely more difficult to obtain a so-called great physique naturally without the assistance of drugs.
Hopefully that clears my opinion up for you. Clearly, it's upsetting for you to hear.
Not upsetting at all. Trying to have a logical discussion but you seem pretty uninformed. I haven't taken them but researched a ton andmconsidered if I decide to compete some day. I'm 5'9 and 215 right now. About maxed naturally but I'd need another 20-30lbs before I'd step on a stage.
If a persons "natural" muscle mass capped out around 190lbs while being lean, is that really more impressive than the same person who use steroids and puts in the same work/effort and is able to achieve 220lbs with a similar BF?
In addition, unless they tell you, how would you know? Unless you're of that typical mindset of "oh he's bigger than me, he's on steroids" lol.
That being said, for steroids to be effective you typically have to put in more work. 300g of carbs will only put on so much muscle steroids or not, there's a reason steroid users typically eat wayyyy more than natural guys, which is a feat within itself. In addition their bodies can handle more and recover faster so they can train more and should take advantage.
So you think less of people that don't compete that use steroids for no one's interest except their own, as compared to people who compete and use steroids? Interesting..
I don't take them but I have loads of friends that do. I'm not quite sure how them taking steroids effects me or my opinion on the physiques they have built.. In regards to their health, there are many and much worse legal things that people partake in on a regular basis.
Quote:
Originally Posted by houstan-dan
Not upsetting at all. Trying to have a logical discussion but you seem pretty uninformed. I haven't taken them but researched a ton andmconsidered if I decide to compete some day. I'm 5'9 and 215 right now. About maxed naturally but I'd need another 20-30lbs before I'd step on a stage.
I'm with Florida2014 on this subject. I think less of people that juice up even though it really doesn't affect me personally in any manner. I think these people only fit and further the stereotypical meathead mold and are all style and no substance. My opinion on the matter is different to professional bodybuilders however since I understand this to be their norm (however I would prefer that bodybuilding was a clean sport).
Of course there is no way of really telling who is doing what without someone actually admitting it since it's rightly considered taboo behavior. So I never even think about it and never judge dudes that might be bigger than me (although there are tell tale signs, at the gym I concentrate on myself). But main point is that if steroids were to become accepted within the regular gym confines, a lot more people would do it and those of who choose to remain clean would be lumped in with the juicers out there. I wouldn't want to be associated with this crowd. An example of this is the MLB. Many players were accused and found to be juicing. Among those were plenty of would be Hall of Fame players. But the effects of the steroid era even affected players who were not juicing as they have to face the million dollar question of whether or not they've ever juiced. That's not particularly fair, but MLB did it to itself when ballclubs and players made it a social norm.
As to the bolded part, you can't accuse Florida2014 of being "pretty uninformed" when all he is stating is his opinion. Just because you don't like or particularly agree with his opinion, as you probably don't like/agree with mine, doesn't mean that we are "uninformed".
Last edited by latino_esq; 09-23-2014 at 10:19 PM..
Reason: editing
Not upsetting at all. Trying to have a logical discussion but you seem pretty uninformed. I haven't taken them but researched a ton andmconsidered if I decide to compete some day. I'm 5'9 and 215 right now. About maxed naturally but I'd need another 20-30lbs before I'd step on a stage.
If a persons "natural" muscle mass capped out around 190lbs while being lean, is that really more impressive than the same person who use steroids and puts in the same work/effort and is able to achieve 220lbs with a similar BF?
In addition, unless they tell you, how would you know? Unless you're of that typical mindset of "oh he's bigger than me, he's on steroids" lol.
That being said, for steroids to be effective you typically have to put in more work. 300g of carbs will only put on so much muscle steroids or not, there's a reason steroid users typically eat wayyyy more than natural guys, which is a feat within itself. In addition their bodies can handle more and recover faster so they can train more and should take advantage.
What, exactly, are you claiming I'm "uninformed" about? I simply said all things being equal I have much more respect for the clean physique than I do the drugged up one. Would you not agree it's more difficult to obtain that physique being drug-free?
How do I know someone is juicing? Are you serious? One needs only look to baseball and guys like Sammy Sosa/Mark McGwire/A-Rod to see the difference in physiques and performance before and after doing steroids. If I see a guy in my gym who has been doing the same workouts and has ample body fat and he suddenly puts on 20lbs of lean muscle and the veins on his arms are popping out of nowhere, on top of pushing more weight than he's ever done is a pretty clear indication of juicing. You don't need to see someone popping pills or sticking a needle in their arse to know they are juicing.
For steroids to be effective you have to put in more work??? Steroids increase testosterone, reduce body fat and will get you stronger all things being equal, hence the results (bigger muscles, leaner physique). You really think if your diet stays the same and you do the same exact workouts day after day that once you start taking steroids you won't see results unless you workout harder? lol....Now it's you who sounds uninformed.
I was referring to the average Joe in the gym, not professional bodybuilders who obviously have to 'roid up to compete with everyone else.
You can obtain a nice, muscular physique without the help of illegal substances. That's all I'm saying.
Not only nice but one that can last. i been working out since 2002 (freshman year of college) to present day. I have a great physique with endurance. Also, my muscles don't disappear after i stop taking the drugs, shakes, etc since i am 100% drug/enhancement free. (no steroids, no gaterode/poweraide, no creatine, no musclemass 2000x, etc)
Just cardio, functional powerlifting exercises, boxing/kickboxing, swimming, and stretching/yoga.
For steroids to be effective you have to put in more work??? Steroids increase testosterone, reduce body fat and will get you stronger all things being equal, hence the results (bigger muscles, leaner physique). You really think if your diet stays the same and you do the same exact workouts day after day that once you start taking steroids you won't see results unless you workout harder? lol....Now it's you who sounds uninformed.
You're missing the point. While maintaining the status quo and adding steroids might let you see somewhat better results, doing so would be a waste of money and I don't think you would see the results you expect. Steroids allow you to workout longer, recover faster, and therefore workout more frequently, getting much better results.
protein shakes and creatine make your muscle disspear. This is news to me. I read it on the internets guys, must be true and dont get me started on that there power ade.
protein shakes and creatine make your muscle disspear. This is news to me. I read it on the internets guys, must be true and dont get me started on that there power ade.
If you stop taking them, you muscles will disappear. There has been studies on Poweraide, Gaterode and Coconut water and how they replenish the body and it was no vast different than drinking water.
Last edited by LifeSurfer; 09-24-2014 at 09:36 AM..
who would have thought protein was valuable to nutrition
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