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Please tell me how this would in any way have stopped any of the recent mass shootings?
I'm pro gun. I use guns to hunt and for sport.
A national gun registry wouldn't have stopped this mass shooting, or the next one, or even the next one. However, with time, it MIGHT help. Enact one right now and require anyone who buys a gun from here on out to get it register before they can take it into their possession.
What a national registry does is at least lets the police, government, and the necessary parties know who owns guns when it pertains to their job.
Get committed into a mental health hospital for a mental health condition that may make the patient aggressive, suicidal, or violent? Look them up on the registry and confiscate their guns. Either permanently or until they can prove themselves healthy again.
Get charged and proven guilty of a violent crime/felony that would bar you from having guns now? The police storm your house and take the guns that you have. Right now I think the court/police just ask "Do you own any firearms? If so, you need to dispose of them."
911 call on a person committing a violent crime? Look them up and see what kind of fire power they posses.
Gun stolen? Go to the registry to find the original owner.
Caught with an unregistered gun? Face a fine much like you would face a fine for driving around in an unregistered vehicle.
Its funny that my name gets ran and stored in a database when I buy cold medicine. However, I can go buy all the guns and ammo and those things aren't recorded beyond the sale that the seller keeps.
If you are a responsible gun owner than there is no reason why a registry would hurt you as long as it is constructed in good faith.
Yes, criminals are going to find a way around this from time to time. There are millions of guns in America and there is zero way to get them all registered.
Okay, for those who keep bringing up Brazil, here is the breakdown. Firstly it's not even a fair comparison, because Brazil is a third world country and the US is a first world country, but since you all insist.....
Gun control has had a life saving impact there. Is it still a problem, yes, but reduction is better than sitting around and doing nothing. And you all seem to be of the consensus that they are worse off than us, yet they are still trying to do something about.
Quote:
"From the analysed data, we concluded that the greatest impact of firearms control policies was their enormous capacity for preventing juvenile homicides. Young people represent 27% of the total population, but these policies helped to save the lives of 113,071 young people out of an overall total of 160,036. That is 70.7% of the averted deaths were young people", says Julio Jacobo
Per the article 95% of deaths are homicides. The remaining 5% are suicides, accidents or unknown causes of gunshot death. There was an increase in homicides in Aragolos (sp?) areas, but:
Quote:
The Southeast region decreased by 39.8% during the same period, driven by the states of São Paulo (-58.6%) and Rio de Janeiro (-50.3%).
So yeah it was effective at saving lives in two major states.
One problem Brazil has, is that they have a weak justice system and many gun violence cases are often just dropped. Gun crimes just aren't taken very seriously there, which also perpetuates the problem. The US is heading that way with more and more justified shootings through open/conceal carry and "stand your ground laws." Cops aren't even held to high standards for murdering people!
The NRA also can't seen to mind their own business and was instrumental in preventing a gun ban law in Brazil that was supported by 70% of residents in 2005. It would quite interesting to see where Brazil would be today if they hadn't intervened (and don't venture a guess on this unless you can back it up with data).
You're falling into the same quicksand that gun rights people use on everything. There's no need for laws, a registry, whatever. They will endlessly bog down every discussion by dissecting the differences between X, Y, Z gun or ammo or stats that show this or that.
Make it purely a social change. Start small. Have commercials that embarrass people that have lots of guns. Narrow it down. "Want a gun? Just buy one," or something. Then make it embarrassing to own a gun. Make people shake their heads at those buying guns, the same way people shake their heads at kids that start smoking. Make the gun nut in the family equivalent to the racist grandparent that everybody shoos into the corner.
These are generational changes that can be done. Civil rights, gay rights, environmentalism, smoking - these are all things that have turned over quickly through changing social norms and that the previous generation thought would never change. Make the gun nut the same person that didn't want to change on women voting or segregation or pollution.
What a great idea! In fact we could slay a lot of problems with the brain washing of all our children into the concept that a Bill of Rights is not needed at all. Then sometime in the near future we wouldn't have all those pesky "rights" that interfere with our concept of what a free country is all about.
Funny, I just came across this article which depicts EEXACTLY what I was talking about in how Constitutional rights are treated differently!! They don't like it when the shoe is on the other foot now do they??!!?
Funny, I just came across this article which depicts EEXACTLY what I was talking about in how Constitutional rights are treated differently!! They don't like it when the shoe is on the other foot now do they??!!?
A national gun registry wouldn't have stopped this mass shooting, or the next one, or even the next one. However, with time, it MIGHT help. Enact one right now and require anyone who buys a gun from here on out to get it register before they can take it into their possession.
What a national registry does is at least lets the police, government, and the necessary parties know who owns guns when it pertains to their job.
Get committed into a mental health hospital for a mental health condition that may make the patient aggressive, suicidal, or violent? Look them up on the registry and confiscate their guns. Either permanently or until they can prove themselves healthy again.
Get charged and proven guilty of a violent crime/felony that would bar you from having guns now? The police storm your house and take the guns that you have. Right now I think the court/police just ask "Do you own any firearms? If so, you need to dispose of them."
911 call on a person committing a violent crime? Look them up and see what kind of fire power they posses.
Gun stolen? Go to the registry to find the original owner.
Caught with an unregistered gun? Face a fine much like you would face a fine for driving around in an unregistered vehicle.
Its funny that my name gets ran and stored in a database when I buy cold medicine. However, I can go buy all the guns and ammo and those things aren't recorded beyond the sale that the seller keeps.
If you are a responsible gun owner than there is no reason why a registry would hurt you as long as it is constructed in good faith.
Yes, criminals are going to find a way around this from time to time. There are millions of guns in America and there is zero way to get them all registered.
Gun control doesn't equal no guns.
Thank you! Finally, a gun owner who doesn't just throw up roadblocks to every suggestion! A gun owner who doesn't view a gun registry (if such a thing would be implemented) as an evil plan to take away all your guns. A gun owner who is willing to make a sacrifice for the greater good.
Other than that, I still have yet to hear any reasonable proposals from the gun folks here. And "round up all the Muslims and get rid of them" is NOT a reasonable proposal.
"I think there are three questions that those proposing gun laws should answer BEFORE they propose their "dream laws":
1. Will the proposed law actually prevent another "gun related"death?
2. Would the proposed law have prevented ANY of the previous gun-related deaths?
3. Would I be willing to post a bond equal to my entire net worth insuring that, when this law is passed, there will never be another incident of gun violence?
IMO, if the answer to any of the above questions is "NO", then your proposed law is useless!
If there is no doubt that the law will not or can not do what it is intended to do, why bother passing it?"
So, apparently there are those who think that asking those who propose laws to actually THINK about what the effects of their proposed laws will actually be is "unreasonable"!
"I still have yet to hear any reasonable proposals from the gun folks here."
1, 2, and 3 above are imminently "reasonable", IMO. THINK about what you are proposing!
Will it work in the United States of America? If you can't absolutely say YES, then don't propose it! If you are convinced it will work, then put your money where your mouth is!
Forget about whether or not it worked in any other country in the world, we do not live there, and we don't think like they do!
What a great idea! In fact we could slay a lot of problems with the brain washing of all our children into the concept that a Bill of Rights is not needed at all. Then sometime in the near future we wouldn't have all those pesky "rights" that interfere with our concept of what a free country is all about.
Except that a truth-style campaign requires no loss of rights or changes to the Constitution/Bill of Rights. People could certainly still own and use guns. None of my posts call for a loss of rights at all. That's the way to tackle the gun lobby.
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