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Anyway, you are saying the same thing. I said it didn't go up because of the safe injection site, but when up because of the fentanyl crisis...which is an elephant tranquilizer.
I was referring the to the sweeping laws that impacted prescription opioid drugs in 2012. This is when doctors stopped writing scripts for them over fear of being raided and having their MD licenses taken away.
The elephant tranquilizer was not fentanyl...it was carfentanyl, and that was only causing deaths for a short time, they have regulated access to that drug now.
I was referring the to the sweeping laws that impacted prescription opioid drugs in 2012. This is when doctors stopped writing scripts for them over fear of being raided and having their MD licenses taken away.
The elephant tranquilizer was not fentanyl...it was carfentanyl, and that was only causing deaths for a short time, they have regulated access to that drug now.
We were discussing Vancouver safe injection site in Canada. Was this sweeping law a Canadian law? I've tried to find it and can't.
One of the biggest benefits of all is that there is no need for an addict in a desperate condition to watch a woman with keys in her hand and a purse over her shoulder. If that desperate person has a safe place to go for their "fix", they won't even notice her. A crime was just prevented. After this happens a few thousand times you'll find yourself wondering where all the crime went.
Addicts are not walking dead. I have a very good friend who is walking and talking proof of that.
Lastly, legalization is not "Enabling"! It isn't like it would be available at every 5 and dime store. It would be available only at a treatment center, and even then you would be subjected to a number of different treatment options, all more appealing than the treatment center. It also opens the door to using these centers as the centerpiece of a public awareness campaign. We used advertising instead of criminal penalties to lessen the scourge of tobacco, and it worked. Tobacco use continues to fall. We can do the same thing with opioids.
But it would't be a "quick fix". The awareness campaign would save millions of lives of future generations. In the meantime, the way to deal with the current generation of addicts is to minimize the harm. You don't minimize the harm by cranking up The War. As we are currently witnessing, especially when compared to other countries that have figured it out, cranking up The War only serves to maximize the harm, not only to the addicts, but to the general public as well.
What do you mean a crime was just prevented cause a person got to go to a safe sight, what crime?
The answer is to Opiate addiction is to treat it as a medical condition and not a crime.
Here the numbers of Heroin addicts has dropped drastically since it's high point in the 70's and the problems caused by those addicted has been reduced even more, largely do to Fixerstüben controlled injection sites.
Make it available in a clinical setting for those addicted, it will reduce the enticement for those who are just curious, reduce the profit of the black market, make it easier for those who want to to quit to get help and keep those who continue from being too much of a bother.
It has been successful everywhere it's been done.
The problem with this is, is that if they don't treat it as a crime, no one will take the crime seriously, and it will just lead to more and more people using Opiate and buying it. In order for a lot of people out there who take the crime seriously, they need to be under the impression that it's a crime, and the only to do that is to enforce it.
What do you mean a crime was just prevented cause a person got to go to a safe sight, what crime?
Most crimes by heroin addicts are perpetrated because they are so desperate for a "fix" that they will burglarize, rob, and steal in order to get enough money to buy some heroin.
If there is a place for a person who is this desperate to go, where he can get a fix even though he has no money, and knows he will not wind up in jail for going there, then they will go there 100% of the time rather than rob someone. In my previous post, the addict who spies a vulnerable woman with her car keys in her hand DIDN'T rob her, the addict instead went to the treatment center. A crime was just prevented. 1000's of crimes would be prevented EVERYDAY if these centers were available for the truly desperate.
The fix isn't 100% free, though. They would have to agree to some treatment too.
The problem with this is, is that if they don't treat it as a crime, no one will take the crime seriously, and it will just lead to more and more people using Opiate and buying it. In order for a lot of people out there who take the crime seriously, they need to be under the impression that it's a crime, and the only to do that is to enforce it.
THAT is 100% pure baloney. It is the way we have been fighting the problem for DECADES now, and the problem is worse than ever! If you can't see that, or if you can't see the fallacy of your logic, then I seriously doubt there is anything I can type on this page, no matter how logical, no matter how well these different approaches are working in other countries, you will still keep your eyes tightly closed.
Would you start using heroin if it were suddenly legal tomorrow? I didn't think so. Ask all your friends the same question. Make a Poll here on these forums and check the results.
So why do you think everyone else would suddenly start using it?
I was just reading about a possible pilot program coming to my area where intravenous drug users would have a safe place to go to inject their heroine and there will be staff on hand to save them if they should overdose.
What do you think about this? Is it a good or bad idea?
The Pros are stated that they would be giving a safe place to shoot up and be watched in case they should overdose. They would also offer help to the addicts to get off the drugs. The benefits to the community is that the addicts would be in one area which means that we won't be finding discarded needles in our neighborhoods when we take the dog for a walk or kids to the park. They also say that crime will be reduced because people will not be so desperate. The spread of disease due to the sharing of needles is also said to be reduced by having a safe site.
The Cons in my mind is that we are coddling the addicts and removing the risks from their dangerous pursuit of the high. Will they ever be inspired to get off the junk if the stigma from being a junkie is removed?
There is also the concern of how you view a addict. Are they a victim of a "disease" or did they do it to themselves so there is no one to blame but themselves?
Addicts are a huge drain on our resources and a danger to everyone either through crime, disease or even the first responders that are saving someone for the 4th time and they are busy they can't get to an accident scene quickly enough to save those victims.
Should we just let the addicts wither away of even die when they overdose?
These are all hard questions but do you think that safe injection sites for drug users is a good idea?
I don't know. Will they be providing the junkie with the drug they are desperate for too? If not, I don't really see someone desperate for a fix traveling very far to shoot up. It would be nice to think it would help though.
Most crimes by heroin addicts are perpetrated because they are so desperate for a "fix" that they will burglarize, rob, and steal in order to get enough money to buy some heroin.
If there is a place for a person who is this desperate to go, where he can get a fix even though he has no money, and knows he will not wind up in jail for going there, then they will go there 100% of the time rather than rob someone. In my previous post, the addict who spies a vulnerable woman with her car keys in her hand DIDN'T rob her, the addict instead went to the treatment center. A crime was just prevented. 1000's of crimes would be prevented EVERYDAY if these centers were available for the truly desperate.
The fix isn't 100% free, though. They would have to agree to some treatment too.
But I don't see how a safe sight is suppose to fix this, because there are no people at the site who are supplying them with heroin right? They have to bring their own.
And in order to get their own, they still have to commit crimes to get the heroin, before going to the site, so how does the site help?
But I don't see how a safe sight is suppose to fix this, because there are no people at the site who are supplying them with heroin right? They have to bring their own.
And in order to get their own, they still have to commit crimes to get the heroin, before going to the site, so how does the site help?
Actually, that is incorrect. This system works in other countries in the world that have decriminalized drugs. Until that happens, these injection sites are just a stop-gap measure to try to reduce the harm being caused by prohibition.
In countries that have decriminalized and created these treatment centers both overdose deaths and drug-related crime has been reduced to near zero. In Portugal, for example, the number of overdose deaths per 1,000,000 population has dropped to 6. In the US, that rate has skyrocketed to 185!
I'm super liberal on these things yet I think we could do better than safe injection sites.
Why not give them free opiates that can be taken by other methods....just to get them one step down from needles? Maybe the place could have it all - but with a purpose to help them taper if they are in agreement. Oral or patched opiates will fight off virtually all withdraw, which is a lot of what drives a real junkie.
Then there is the other side of the coin where if you can't stop young teens from having sex, the next best thing is to make sure condoms are available.
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