Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Boy, the Oil-Forever idiots are going to be wearing that Ding-Bat's speechery for a long while.
Nah. Just some of us, while realizing we should explore other technology just because we can all benefit from it, aren't a bunch of idiot Chicken Littles who believe all the fear mongering nonsense about oil 'running out.'
We are at the level of tech in our society that it's just time to find more efficient energy sources.
Boy, the Oil-Forever idiots are going to be wearing that Ding-Bat's speechery for a long while.
Nah. Just some of us, while realizing we should explore other technology just because we can all benefit from it, aren't a bunch of idiot Chicken Littles who believe all the fear mongering nonsense about oil 'running out.'
Dunno that it is Fear Mongering. You are from Texas . . . ever been in an Oil Field? Not like that is a good thing either way. I tend to view it as work, and in general I am a "work sucks," sort of guy.
But really -- Texas Oil Field production. It is a dying thing.
Here are the real world numbers -- If you are Drill, Baby, Drill, read them and weep.
As goes Texas, so goes the US. And the North Sea. And Cantrell (Mexico). And Saudi. And . . . .
And that is not for a lack of drilling, lack of being clever, or lack of flooding, floating, fracting, cracking, nor any of the typical Clownservitive nonsense about environmentalists, etc.
I have watched the numbers for about the last five years. When we started putting Solar in the Oil Fields last year, I sort of really, really, really, knew we had come to the end of the line.
Quote:
We are at the level of tech in our society that it's just time to find more efficient energy sources.
Probably well past time, but better late than never, huh?
Yunno, between The Wind and The Sunshine, Texas really ought to be leading this Energy Boom/Rush, as well.
Just time to come up out of the hole in the ground and into the fresh breeze and the sunshine.
Dunno that it is Fear Mongering. You are from Texas . . . ever been in an Oil Field? Not like that is a good thing either way.
Neither are acres upon acres of solar panels or miles and miles of rows of wind farms.
Nobody says oil is the greatest solution but neither are electric cars that depend on hundreds of pounds of batteries in each car and limit the distance one can drive.
This thread is not about oil.......... try not hijacking this thread.
It was about a new technology that doesn't force an abnormal driving style on people.
It was about a new technology that doesn't force an abnormal driving style on people.
The point is not to change people's driving habits, but to provide them with a vehicle matched to their driving habits. Millions of people commute 5 days a week for 40-50 miles a day round trip to work. The pure EV is targeted towards that person. They will save money on fuel, reduce the volatility of their fuel bill, and reduce pollution and smog the center city (a big issues for many cities.) People will decide for themselves whether to adopt this technology, but it's my understanding that the Nissan Leaf has sold out it's entire first year production.
For those who need a car with more flexibility, the a plug-in hybrid like the Chevy Volt might be a very good alternative. There are 100 million households in this country, not all of them need a Chevy Suburban.
The point is not to change people's driving habits, but to provide them with a vehicle matched to their driving habits. Millions of people commute 5 days a week for 40-50 miles a day round trip to work. The pure EV is targeted towards that person. They will save money on fuel, reduce the volatility of their fuel bill, and reduce pollution and smog the center city (a big issues for many cities.) People will decide for themselves whether to adopt this technology, but it's my understanding that the Nissan Leaf has sold out it's entire first year production.
For those who need a car with more flexibility, the a plug-in hybrid like the Chevy Volt might be a very good alternative. There are 100 million households in this country, not all of them need a Chevy Suburban.
Seems that electric cars even in huge cities don't sell:
Cars – electric or otherwise – are most efficient when used for special trips on empty roads. However, most cars are used as a form of mass transport on congested roads, a task for which they are manifestly unsuited. Compared with efficient electric buses and trains, in most cases there is little economic or environmental justification for electric cars as a form of mass transportation.
(page 9 point 3)
Using any personal vehicle in that manner will put a huge dent into the "major change in our driving habits" argument.
Quote:
Whether a nation squanders oil or coal or biodiesel, there’s still a high cost; in nature, nothing comes free. There is abundant evidence that there simply isn’t enough energy to support the current lifestyle of the West, let alone the rest of the world that is increasingly trying to adopt a Western lifestyle, or, to put it more accurately, an American lifestyle.
(Page 12 final paragraph)
Hmm, and you supported an article based on this report...?
Quote:
Thus, for America and the countries that wish to emulate America, the problem is not so much the car by itself, but a package deal of wasteful cars, wasteful suburbs based around cars, together with a wasteful society based around consumption, with the car as the most obvious symbol of this waste. Changing the way that American cars are powered will not solve the built-in problems of the American system of over-consumption.
(Page 18 final paragraph)
Which is the root of the problem, this seems to be a good report, and quite balanced. Actually so is the article you linked to, unfortunately if you'd read beyond the soundbite headline, you'd see that it's supporting a position that you are not.
Basically both state the conclusion, we're screwed, the only variable is how we choose to be screwed, via polluting electrical plants, or polluting vehicle fleets. The only way to get "unscrewed" is to change the way we live, so that we don't need as large a vehicle fleet. Or to put it another way, send the family car to the junkyard and not replace it. I don't think this is a position you advocate.
While the Tesla comes in for some criticism, it's more for its pandering to the current expectations of people, not the vehicle itself. In the grander scheme of things, it's a electrical sports car, that's as polluting (if not more) as it's gas powered equivalent the Lotus Elise. Then again it's a sports car developed for the consumer, and sports cars are not designed to be low impact, with low energy consumption, that's an entirely different requirements set.
Do you understand they are still shipping out the Chevy Volt Demos to the very limited test markets they are being offered in? The Leaf is sold out and the Chevy Volts are sold as they hit the market.
Quote:
Oh, and here is an article on why electric cars are not as green as the auto companies say they are:
Every customer we have ask about adding a charging station . . . (don't forget you are dealing with real world folks, here) . . . wants it to go with the New Solar PV Equipment we are putting in for them.
Do you really not follow that you are not in the Real World or in Real Time on any of this?
Look, nobody cares if we have Hydrogen to go along as an option or not. But folks are lining up for Solar + Electric vehicles because they want to go off Fossil -- both Coal and Oil -- and No, they do not want Nukes, either.
At this point we even have customers asking us to take them totally off-grid (which means they throw-away tens of thousands of dollars in utility rebates) just because they so resent the Nuke decommissioning bills being fed into their electric bill.
Why in the world are you trying to make-believe some contest or struggle of Hydrogen v. Electric? If you bring working Hydrogen to the market, folks will be happy to get that, too.
Dunno that it is Fear Mongering. You are from Texas . . . ever been in an Oil Field? Not like that is a good thing either way. I tend to view it as work, and in general I am a "work sucks," sort of guy.
But really -- Texas Oil Field production. It is a dying thing.
Here are the real world numbers -- If you are Drill, Baby, Drill, read them and weep.
As goes Texas, so goes the US. And the North Sea. And Cantrell (Mexico). And Saudi. And . . . .
And that is not for a lack of drilling, lack of being clever, or lack of flooding, floating, fracting, cracking, nor any of the typical Clownservitive nonsense about environmentalists, etc.
I have watched the numbers for about the last five years. When we started putting Solar in the Oil Fields last year, I sort of really, really, really, knew we had come to the end of the line.
Probably well past time, but better late than never, huh?
Yunno, between The Wind and The Sunshine, Texas really ought to be leading this Energy Boom/Rush, as well.
Just time to come up out of the hole in the ground and into the fresh breeze and the sunshine.
Beautiful day, today in Texas.
My dad has worked in the oil industry all over the world for almost 50 years...I think I have a clue as to where the state of the world's oil stands.
Texas leads the country in wind farming.
Your sanctimonious sarcastic attitude does little to hide your total ignorance.
Why in the world are you trying to make-believe some contest or struggle of Hydrogen v. Electric? If you bring working Hydrogen to the market, folks will be happy to get that, too.
It's not a "make believe contest" as you allude to, it was comparing what the technologies do to a persons driving habits.
Why? because that was the topic of the OP I started.
Why do you constantly bring up oil and coal when it has absolutely nothing to do with the OP? OH, I forgot, that one link in one sentence out of 14 paragraphs mentioned this:
Quote:
However, a New Zealand scientist recently predicted that if the New Zealand car fleet was replaced with electric cars, the country would probably need to build coal power stations to meet the increased demand.”
Grow up, you want to start a flame war? Open a different thread...
Quote:
At this point we even have customers asking us to take them totally off-grid (which means they throw-away tens of thousands of dollars in utility rebates) just because they so resent the Nuke decommissioning bills being fed into their electric bill.
Yup, the above is right on-topic
I used the Singapore article because 16 million people live there and they have tremendous traffic issues.
You want an American article?
Quote:
But only the 2011 Prius today could be called a big seller; and even at that, it's at a fraction of the sales that were predicted years ago.
Now you are substituting Hybrids of the article above for Electrics, and then comparing that to make-believe -- (someone's who-knows projections from some years ago) -- again for Hybrids.
to . . .
declare Hydrogen a "winner" over Electrics?
okay dokey, that Kung Fu logic has my slow poke engineering analysis baffled.
You win this round.
This is like one of those Ford v. Chevy discussions, right?
Beam me up, Scotty. No intelligent life found.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
OH, I forgot, that one link in one sentence out of 14 paragraphs mentioned this: 
