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Do you think New York City would be significantly different today if the English had not taken it over from the Dutch? How do you think it would have been different? Would the differences be positive or negative?
Last edited by musicislife.glee; 09-08-2011 at 12:22 PM..
Do you think New York City would be significantly different today if the English had not taken it over from the Dutch? How do you think it would have been different? Would the differences be positive or negative?
I'd like to see the Isaac Mizrahi designer wooden shoes.
What are we talking about here? A New York city which remains Dutch while all around it is British, or New York as the center of some wider Dutch empire in North America?
If the former, then of course it would be different since it would be a city in a constant state of virtual siege. If the latter, then once more, of course things would be greatly different, for example, there would be this developing Dutch empire independent of any British holdings.
IF the Dutch, British or French had remained in firm control the US would be bowing to Royals instead of cussing our bloated, well-fed Conggress. .
Well, not really.
The Dutch were a republic dating to the late 1500's, a situation which was formalized at the Treaty of Westphalia in in the mid-1600's. While the staadtholders such as the Organges held much influence, they were ultimately subordinate except in times of war to the States-General. Chances are a North America under Dutch rule would have been treated as either a possession of the States-General or granted recognition as an actual states or states with regular repsresentation.
The British are an interesting lot as while the monarchy still wielded much influence in the 1700's, their power was very much on the decline and Parliament and the Prime Ministers were becoming more and more prominent while the royals remained as figure heads. Assuming the British kept control it would only have been a matter of time until the US was given Commonwealth status or perhaps even emerged as a direct part of the UK.
France would have been an interesting case as I don't see a French dominated North America having much impact on the events of the Revolution. Would North America have embraced the ideals of the Revolution or would it have become the sanctuary for the French Royalists? Perhaps there is a chance we would all be bending our knees to a Bourbon King today.
Do you think New York City would be significantly different today if the English had not taken it over from the Dutch? How do you think it would have been different? Would the differences be positive or negative?
If New Amsterdam and New Netherland had remained Dutch, the U.S. - assuming the English colonies rebelled - would have had a rather large hole in it. Eastern NY, New Jersey and part of Delaware were all Dutch with New Amsterdam being the administrative capital.
The English colonies, and the later U.S. would have had an embarrassingly progressive neighbor. Dutch law and customs were different from those of the English, and much more liberal in many respects, especially in regard to the role of women. As it was, after the English takeover the Dutch were at first allowed to keep their own law and customs, but rather rapidly the English went back on their word and imposed the more conservative English law.
Perhaps the influence of an independent New Netherland beside the new U.S. would have resulted in a more democratic constitution in the U.S. in 1787.
As a New Yorker myself I really cant say if NYC would have developed differently if the Dutch still ruled NYC then called New Amsterdam. For one Wall Street was a walled fortification to keep out the British. Dutch colony NYC at that time was surrounded in British colonial waters. NYC developed as a port city with deep a natural Harbor, any ship can dock anywhere in NYC. NYC really took off after the completion of the Erie Canal in the 1820s which connected the great lakes with the Hudson River. Quite possibily history would have been different.
You'd probably be able to legally smoke pot and solicit prostitutes.
Cannabis is illegal in the Netherlands, either to use or produce. But the police do not enforce the law, so it is essentially safe to use and sell. There are cafes where pot is sold (though it is illegal), but because they attract foreign drug tourism it will become illegal to sell to tourists by the end of 2011.
So, maybe things wouldn't in the end be very different in a modern New Netherland/New Amsterdam as pot smoking is certainly common in the U.S., though illegal. It would also depend upon whether such an entity were an integral part of the Netherlands or had its own laws.
Legalized prostitution is currently being severely reduced by the government because of the infiltration of criminal syndicates. Perhaps it will become as controlled as Nevada.
What would interest me more would be getting the old family farm back, it is now a commercial area of Brooklyn and could bring in on heck of a lot of guilders or euros or whatever if I could get my hands on it!
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