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Question: What is Americans fascination with people that lived nearly 250 years ago.
A-lot has changed, what is the thinking with them knowing what's best for us now?
Why? Because what arose in America, and Great Britain, and several other European nations, represented the furthest refinement of true pluralism, as embodied in the governance of a Nation-state by a Parliament, up to that time.
And because the framers of those nations, instead of being wedded to absolutes supposedly established via Divine Right, recognized that economic, as well as individual freedom (the study of economics was, after all, formerly described as "political economy") are unitary and inseparable.
Because, all the tested members of this group (100 or more years of the transfer of power exclusively by peaceful means) subscribe to a Judeo-Christian ethic, although that standard seems likely to expand.
Because the vast majority of technical and commercial progress has emerged from within that group.
And because, among the tested members of the group as defined above, no member has since taken up the sword against another member.
They probably would be astonished that we have landed on the moon, can pick up a device and instantly talk to anyone in the world. That some nations have nuclear weapons that could instantly kill millions. You have the world of knowledge on a thing called the internet.
As far as politics, they already predicted how that would play out, and they were right.
A famous man once said, "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic".
I believe they would be abhorred at how far this nation has fallen. How our so called leaders have do blatantly sold this country out to special interests. The total disregard for the constitution. How we've fallen from a nation with good solid Christian foundation trusting in Christ to a humanist nation trusting in money.
I think they would be shocked to see how american citizens at large are ignorant, apathetic, and uneducated despite the resources available (there is no excuse). How multitudes of people are holding their hand out to collect from the public treasury. How the populace at large simply handed the power of the people over to the government. How gullible the majority are about the news media in the propaganda machine.
The list goes on and on.
What they did understand was God's Word. A nation that turns their back on God in Christ has written their own fate on the wall.
Nations that forget God will be forgotten. Do not be surprised if you see foreign troops on American soil. Possibly Chinese troops coming to claim what we've given to them when we show up empty handed to pay the trillions owed in our pampered service-based, welfare economy.
The Bible says the borrower is slave to the lender.
I wouldn't bother with concerning yourself with retirement saving or upgrades on your home. I would recommending turning to God through JESUS Christ. He's the only one that can save from what is coming. This nation has embraced every abomination under the sun, and I do believe we are RIPE for judgment.
They probably would be astonished that we have landed on the moon, can pick up a device and instantly talk to anyone in the world. That some nations have nuclear weapons that could instantly kill millions. You have the world of knowledge on a thing called the internet.
As far as politics, they already predicted how that would play out, and they were right.
A famous man once said, "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic".
My respect for Tocqueville and Bastiat notwithstanding, we are still a fair distance from that, and the workings of an open economy in which most of us have the ability to vote with our property, our savings, and our feet, has a tendency to show up the folly of a gang of thugs sooner or later, just as it does anyone who becomes convinced that his personal dialogue with the Deity is a bit too exclusive.
They would be shocked. One thing they wouldn't approve of would be the low educational levels because the founding fathers were well read and educated. They believed that only an educated and informed electorate could be trusted to provide good government.
Our schools are only a shadow of what they were even 50 years ago. Kids are so impertinent that a teacher is a police man, not a teacher. Talking on cell phones in class which the teacher is trying to teach--rude, and how can anyone learn anything. These kids not only do not learn in school but most of the information they get is from brief tv newscasts or the internet. Easy for them to be uninformed and get brainwashed by fast talking politicians. Not what the founding fathers had in mind.
Absolutely true. The Founders understood the importance of an enlightened citizenry.
A few quotes from Jefferson:
"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."
"I know of no safe depository of the ultimate powers of the society but the people themselves; and if we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with a wholesome direction, the remedy is not to take it from them, but to inform their discretion by education. This is the true corrective of abuses of constitutional power."
This is a political thread masquerading as a historical one. Asking what the founding fathers would think of the nation today is actually "What do you think of the nation today?" The response may say "I think the founding fathers would...." but it is actually just the poster assigning all of his or her political agenda to the founding fathers and claiming that this was their intent.
I suggest that the thread be moved to the political forum.
Blount, Dayton, Fitzsimons, Gorham, Robert Morris, Washington and Wilson were land speculators.
Bedford, Blair, Clymer, Dayton, Fitzsimons, Franklin, King, Langdon, Robert Morris, Charles Cotesworth Pinckney, and Sherman formed the proto-Wall St faction.
Bassett, Blair, Blount, Johnson, Butler, Carroll, Jenifer, Jefferson, Madison where the Monsanto, Archer Daniels, Midland of their time.
Let's get real about who these fine fellows actually were.
Agreed, but every industrialized society develops similar factions; Krupp, Thyssen and Farben were cut from the same cloth -- simply moved into the shadow of the corruptive effect of state power at a faster rate. And Lenin, Stalin and Mao took it somewhat further.
You have identified the problem, but the "remedy" is not to move in the direction of further concentration of power, simply because that power id falsely cloaked in a principle of "public" interest.
This is a political thread masquerading as a historical one. Asking what the founding fathers would think of the nation today is actually "What do you think of the nation today?" The response may say "I think the founding fathers would...." but it is actually just the poster assigning all of his or her political agenda to the founding fathers and claiming that this was their intent.
If so, it is being conducted with far greater dignity and respect than the shameless cackle-fests over at P&OC.
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