Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
We have rented a townhome in Southern California for five years. We have two young children, who were both born while we have lived here. Yesterday when I was cleaning the floor in the kitchen I noticed that part of the vinyl flooring was coming up. A corner broke off in chunks. At first I was solely concerned about mold - the subfloor is yellow with green splotches. So I started looking around online for info about mold under vinyl tiles (our landlord does not think mold is a heath hazard so I knew he would not address it the way we would want) and discovered in the process that our specific vinyl has asbestos. It is a distinctive pattern and I was able to find a picture of it online, and the date matches when our townhome was built.
I know asbestos is present in many buildings and not a concern unless it is airborne. However, we now have not only this cracked portion of vinyl in our kitchen, but I realized there are huge sections missing in our laundry room adjacent to our kitchen. So does this mean my kids have been exposed to asbestos their whole lives? Our landlord did not disclose the asbestos, although I don't know if he is aware of it, and had I known it was in the tiles I would have been concerned a long time ago about the condition of the floor in the laundry room.
Help! Set my mind at ease or tell me we need to move? Are my kids going to be OK or will they get lung cancer in 30 years?
Piece broke yesterday
Laundry room site A
Laundry room site B (this area extends underneath the whole washer)
Normally asbestos tiles are not something you should be too concerned about unless you are going to be doing something to them that causes particles to become airborne. Broken tiles are probably not something to worry too much about, unless they are still being broken as a result of walking on them, playing on them, etc.
I'm not sure what makes you think that is a "distinctive" pattern? I've seen dozens of similar ones, mostly in sheet vinyl, but some in stick on, some in 12 x 12, and some in larger squares.
If you want to panic, you ARE in California, so you will probably get a lot of support. However... the entire area that would be releasing any fiber would be effectively limited to the broken edges. The surface has a printed sealed covering, and if asbestos can magically seep into concrete and then take a train to an exposed area and become airborne, I have not seen it. Once the broken edge is suitably crudded up, very little would become airborne. So, if I had to guess, you might have a thimbleful of material containing the stuff that could have been vacuumed up or otherwise become airborne. The chances of any of that making it to the lungs is not real great either. Worst case? Maybe an amount of asbestos the size and weight of a couple of pencil period marks on paper made it to the lungs -IF the tiles do in fact contain asbestos. Stand over a dog poo and sniff and you undoubtedly will have more dog poo in your lungs than asbestos. The example may be frivolous, but the reality is about correct.
There is a deadly disease caused by asbestos, and the substance can aggravate other conditions and diseases. I do not in any way mean to undermine the seriousness of that. However, the people affected are primarily miners and shipyard fitters. Attorneys have taken those incidents and turned them into a cash cow by fearmongering over television.
The organic State of Vermont is LOADED with Serpentine and Asbestos. The entire town of Johnson used to be covered in asbestos dust. The residents of that town, much to the dismay of lawyers, have not died en-masse from horrible lung disease, even though many of them also smoked. I used to drive through there all the time. Last time I checked, I was also still alive with no lung problems.
If you want to freak-out, have a blast. People who don't understand the relative risks involved with living, and depend upon the slanted reports of those out to make money off them, are quite amusing to read.
Otherwise, keep your kids away from traffic, and beat it into their heads to use seatbelts, and you'll be doing a thousand time better job of protecting them than becoming overwrought about broken tiles.
I'm not sure what makes you think that is a "distinctive" pattern? I've seen dozens of similar ones, mostly in sheet vinyl, but some in stick on, some in 12 x 12, and some in larger squares.
If you want to panic, you ARE in California, so you will probably get a lot of support. However... the entire area that would be releasing any fiber would be effectively limited to the broken edges. The surface has a printed sealed covering, and if asbestos can magically seep into concrete and then take a train to an exposed area and become airborne, I have not seen it. Once the broken edge is suitably crudded up, very little would become airborne. So, if I had to guess, you might have a thimbleful of material containing the stuff that could have been vacuumed up or otherwise become airborne. The chances of any of that making it to the lungs is not real great either. Worst case? Maybe an amount of asbestos the size and weight of a couple of pencil period marks on paper made it to the lungs -IF the tiles do in fact contain asbestos. Stand over a dog poo and sniff and you undoubtedly will have more dog poo in your lungs than asbestos. The example may be frivolous, but the reality is about correct.
There is a deadly disease caused by asbestos, and the substance can aggravate other conditions and diseases. I do not in any way mean to undermine the seriousness of that. However, the people affected are primarily miners and shipyard fitters. Attorneys have taken those incidents and turned them into a cash cow by fearmongering over television.
The organic State of Vermont is LOADED with Serpentine and Asbestos. The entire town of Johnson used to be covered in asbestos dust. The residents of that town, much to the dismay of lawyers, have not died en-masse from horrible lung disease, even though many of them also smoked. I used to drive through there all the time. Last time I checked, I was also still alive with no lung problems.
If you want to freak-out, have a blast. People who don't understand the relative risks involved with living, and depend upon the slanted reports of those out to make money off them, are quite amusing to read.
Otherwise, keep your kids away from traffic, and beat it into their heads to use seatbelts, and you'll be doing a thousand time better job of protecting them than becoming overwrought about broken tiles.
While I don't appreciate the condescension here or think it was necessary, thank you for trying to reassure me that there is little to be concerned about.
The vinyl tiles are 12x12 and I found the image of them here, under 1978 - Armstrong Solarian Vinyl Asbestos Floor Tiles, 12" x 12", etc.
I'm not seeing a similarity. 57130 looks like a cheaper tile. Yours appears to have deeper indents. Did you see a marking on the back? I could be wrong.
Condescension. You make an error. The condescending folks are the attorneys you see on tv all the time. I am simply brutally honest in stating my opinion of them and their scams. I also have issues with the nanny-state attitude of California in general, which I find GROSSLY condescending every time I open a package of screws and washers and find a little note "The State of California has determined..."
My frustration is aimed at a system that would make you so fearful. NOT at you.
I'm not sure what makes you think that is a "distinctive" pattern? I've seen dozens of similar ones, mostly in sheet vinyl, but some in stick on, some in 12 x 12, and some in larger squares.
If you want to panic, you ARE in California, so you will probably get a lot of support. However... the entire area that would be releasing any fiber would be effectively limited to the broken edges. The surface has a printed sealed covering, and if asbestos can magically seep into concrete and then take a train to an exposed area and become airborne, I have not seen it. Once the broken edge is suitably crudded up, very little would become airborne. So, if I had to guess, you might have a thimbleful of material containing the stuff that could have been vacuumed up or otherwise become airborne. The chances of any of that making it to the lungs is not real great either. Worst case? Maybe an amount of asbestos the size and weight of a couple of pencil period marks on paper made it to the lungs -IF the tiles do in fact contain asbestos. Stand over a dog poo and sniff and you undoubtedly will have more dog poo in your lungs than asbestos. The example may be frivolous, but the reality is about correct.
There is a deadly disease caused by asbestos, and the substance can aggravate other conditions and diseases. I do not in any way mean to undermine the seriousness of that. However, the people affected are primarily miners and shipyard fitters. Attorneys have taken those incidents and turned them into a cash cow by fearmongering over television.
The organic State of Vermont is LOADED with Serpentine and Asbestos. The entire town of Johnson used to be covered in asbestos dust. The residents of that town, much to the dismay of lawyers, have not died en-masse from horrible lung disease, even though many of them also smoked. I used to drive through there all the time. Last time I checked, I was also still alive with no lung problems.
If you want to freak-out, have a blast. People who don't understand the relative risks involved with living, and depend upon the slanted reports of those out to make money off them, are quite amusing to read.
Otherwise, keep your kids away from traffic, and beat it into their heads to use seatbelts, and you'll be doing a thousand time better job of protecting them than becoming overwrought about broken tiles.
Harry, loved this post!
But, I must confess that I freaked out too when I found out the tiles in our old homes' laundry room could contain asbestos. Hubby was, annoyingly, blase about this. So, I set about to research it myself.
To the OP, here is a simple synopsis of my "way too much" research on this issue- How to Know VAT or VCT | eHow.com
I sure do understand your concern though.
Basically, in the mid to late '70's they stopped producing VAT (vinyl asbestos tiles) and they where replaced with VCT (vinyl composite tile). They look very similar but VAT's are generally 9x9 squares, VCT are generally 12x12.
Our '60's vintage laundry room most likely has the VAT version. I primed and painted that floor (many times) and have not worried about it since.
As Tyrone says, it is a concern only if these tiles are disturbed and become friable.
The yellow/green under your kitchen floor tiles might just be the adhesive.
Hi Socalmom,
Are you saying that the townhome was built in 1978 or some date near that? I didn't see that in your posts. This appears to be a minimal amount of friable material in the photos you provided. You can coat the exposed edges of the tile with clear latex paint and that will help encapsulate any asbestos. I would like to know the exact date of the construction if you can provide it.
Hi Socalmom,
Are you saying that the townhome was built in 1978 or some date near that? I didn't see that in your posts. This appears to be a minimal amount of friable material in the photos you provided. You can coat the exposed edges of the tile with clear latex paint and that will help encapsulate any asbestos. I would like to know the exact date of the construction if you can provide it.
Built in 1978 although I don't have the exact date. Good tip about the paint. I have not heard back from our landlord yet so I'm not sure what he will want to do (if anything).
Thanks,
You are in the window where asbestos was still being used in several aspects of the building process( along with lead paint). As long as the products are stable( like being encapsulated) and not being disturbed I wouldn't panic. Disturbing the materials even with proper remediation techniques can create the need for periodic sampling as the disturbance process can leave friable residual material( so be careful what you ask for.
As an aside, have the Gas Company come out and check your firebox if you have a gas fueled furnace that appears to be original or over 15 years old. They can assess your ducting for asbestos at that time if you ask them.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Harry, loved this post!
