Downtown Houston: The Solution (Dallas, Irving: closing, to live in, flooring)

[mpope409]

Originally Posted by Historian/Traveler

This was truly seriously close to being built right before the 1986 recession that created 'Gunspoint'.

http://http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=bankofstreetsouthwesttower-houston-tx-usa (broken link)

Would've been nice to see. Sez la vie!

Link does not work. Emporis.com - International Database about Buildings, Construction and the Real-Estate industry -> Houston, TX -> Buildings link -> High Rise Buildings -> Never Built -> Bank of the Southwest Building -> wowzers! Cheers!

It's alright. Why does Houston always have to make its buildings so wide and fat, though? Lol, I prefer more thinner and modest structures. (Some might think that our city is trying to compensate for that which it lacks)

[worldlyman]

Originally Posted by mpope409

Not necessarily in a CBD, but in an "urbane" setting. New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, Miami, San Francisco, Seattle. All of these cities have their premier shopping on their streets. Not in malls. Why should Houston be any different? Bringing big names into downtown will not hurt anybody. If anything, it will help our image and help make downtown a tourist destination, without taking any of the shine away from the Galleria. (I admit that the Galleria is fun, but it was still a very cheap and lazy idea from day one. If they were going to build something like that, the least they could do was make the architecture more interesting.)

There is upscale shopping not in box malls, and similar to, in a way, to Rodeo Drive, such as Highland Village and Rice Village. Now there is Town Center in Sugarland and the Woodlands to sort of reinforce those niches somewhat.

The Houston Galleria is sort of a majestic place. It is a climate-controlled Rodeo Drive...and that is the novelty of it. It was once the most Yahoo-searched mall in the world for awhile. The architecture is interesting and much more so than very popular malls in the L.A. area such as the Beverly Center and South Coast Plaza. It is the sophisticated yin to the earthy and asymmetric yan of San Diego's wonderful Horton Plaza. Both are equally interesting places to wander and people watch even if their designs are diametrically opposed, aesthetically.

To me, the Beverly Center and South Coast Plaza just enjoy the brand-name of being in L.A. Nothing extreme in their designs compared to the Galleria and Horton Plaza.

By the way, I'm not against busy 7 days a week retail in downtown Houston...but I don't lose sleep comparing it to that of other cities. I kind of like Houston's different street/faux-street scenes such as those like 19th Street, Montrose, Rice Village, Sugarland Town Center, etc. Hopefully, Houston Pavilions can make a mark toward that wish as well.

Look at L.A.'s variety of streets. Don't Robertson, Melrose, Colorado, Santa Monica Blvd and all the other shopping streets...have the same exact street signage, traffic lights and sidewalks even if there are tons of different storefronts and names? Rodeo Drive looks like an uber upscale version of a Robertson or Melrose...but the street template looks the same to me.

Houston's stash of shopping streets do look a bit different from each other. Morningside in Rice Village looks utterly different than West Alabama...which look utterly different than Westheimer@Montrose and then Mid Lane which looks...maybe it's the oak trees mixed with palms which help vary Houston's stuff.

[KerrTown]

Originally Posted by Historian/Traveler

This was truly seriously close to being built right before the 1986 recession that created 'Gunspoint'.

http://http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=bankofstreetsouthwesttower-houston-tx-usa (broken link)

Would've been nice to see. Sez la vie!

Link does not work. Emporis.com - International Database about Buildings, Construction and the Real-Estate industry -> Houston, TX -> Buildings link -> High Rise Buildings -> Never Built -> Bank of the Southwest Building -> wowzers! Cheers!

I wish that could've been built so that we can have our own Sears Tower. But Houston blew it again like being the state capitol or the largest metro population in the South and 4th largest city AND metro with the likes of NYC, LA, and Chicago.

[pwright1]

Originally Posted by mpope409

I'm confused. Are you for or against DT Houston shopping? Granted, many cities don't have their premier shopping in their CBD, but the problem with Houston is that outside of its core it isn't pedestrian friendly. Many people don't like that fact. Everything being in the Galleria isn't working anymore. Uptown is too spotty and not dense enough to the point where driving is necessary.

Why is the Galleria the busiest and most popular area in Houston? Because that's where all the big names are. Downtown needs that.

Thank you.

Of course I'm for downtown retail. Its just that over the years many thought, why should there be shopping downtown when there's the Galleria. But thats ridiculous because every city with major downtown shopping also has some of the same major retailers just a few miles away.

[texas7]

Houston's downtown area has always been a 9-5 kind of place. They tried to revive it with the rail and some nightclubs/restaurants (of course really not for our benefit but solely to attract the superbowl and an attempt at grabbing an Olympic game year). The clubs/restaurants did well for a while until a younger, less desirable crowd began driving it at night. The mature, upscale crowds don't want to deal with thuggy, suburban kids and end up going elsewhere and that ends the nightlife development. The new entertainment complex hopefully will revive some of the original intended crowd. We need an entertainment area geared to youth (18-21) and another for those more mature and completed with their college years. The two groups don't mix well and don't draw the same crowds.

[mpope409]

Originally Posted by worldlyman

There is upscale shopping not in box malls, and similar to, in a way, to Rodeo Drive, such as Highland Village and Rice Village. Now there is Town Center in Sugarland and the Woodlands to sort of reinforce those niches somewhat.

Those areas are only somewhat "upscale", but the high end names in fashion and retail are located in the Galleria area (Tiffany & Co., Bvlgari, Prada, Jimmy Choo, Hermes, etc.)

The Houston Galleria is sort of a majestic place. It is a climate-controlled Rodeo Drive...and that is the novelty of it. It was once the most Yahoo-searched mall in the world for awhile. The architecture is interesting and much more so than very popular malls in the L.A. area such as the Beverly Center and South Coast Plaza. It is the sophisticated yin to the earthy and asymmetric yan of San Diego's wonderful Horton Plaza. Both are equally interesting places to wander and people watch even if their designs are diametrically opposed, aesthetically.

And even with all that greatness, it's also one of the reasons Houston is seen as a sprawling, autocentric town.

By the way, I'm not against busy 7 days a week retail in downtown Houston...but I don't lose sleep comparing it to that of other cities.

Neither do I, but if we want a better downtown, we have to realize what it's obviously going to take to get us there.

Look at L.A.'s variety of streets. Don't Robertson, Melrose, Colorado, Santa Monica Blvd and all the other shopping streets...have the same exact street signage, traffic lights and sidewalks even if there are tons of different storefronts and names? Rodeo Drive looks like an uber upscale version of a Robertson or Melrose...but the street template looks the same to me.

...maybe it's the oak trees mixed with palms which help vary Houston's stuff.

Don't remind of that "mix".

[mpope409]

Originally Posted by pwright1

Of course I'm for downtown retail. Its just that over the years many thought, why should there be shopping downtown when there's the Galleria.

Because it's all about having options and it will help our downtown.

[mpope409]

Originally Posted by texas7

Houston's downtown area has always been a 9-5 kind of place. They tried to revive it with the rail and some nightclubs/restaurants (of course really not for our benefit but solely to attract the superbowl and an attempt at grabbing an Olympic game year). The clubs/restaurants did well for a while until a younger, less desirable crowd began driving it at night. The mature, upscale crowds don't want to deal with thuggy, suburban kids and end up going elsewhere and that ends the nightlife development. The new entertainment complex hopefully will revive some of the original intended crowd. We need an entertainment area geared to youth (18-21) and another for those more mature and completed with their college years. The two groups don't mix well and don't draw the same crowds.

What thuggy, suburban kids?

[texas7]

Go down to some of the nightclubs in the Downtown area at night and see what's roaming around - the 18-21's some decent suburban kids mixed with the baggy pants wearing thuggy types. That is why most of the upscale, mid-20 and up clubs have moved to midtown. The same types that cruised Richmond avenue moved to downtown when Richmond Avenue began shuttering up.

[mpope409]

Originally Posted by texas7

Go down to some of the nightclubs in the Downtown area at night and see what's roaming around - the 18-21's some decent suburban kids mixed with the baggy pants wearing thuggy types. That is why most of the upscale, mid-20 and up clubs have moved to midtown. The same types that cruised Richmond avenue moved to downtown when Richmond Avenue began shuttering up.

Well I don't think we have to pick on the "thuggy types". After all, it's their city, too. Downtown's big enough for everybody to share it.