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True - and this issue proves how little logic they have and how very little they care about the environment or protection of natural habitats.
It makes no sense to bring in hundreds of millions of people and encourage them to reproduce - but that's exactly what many liberals promote.
The thing to keep in mind is the "liberals" are NOT the vast majority of democrats. Historically the democrats are the most anti-illegal from a political point of view.
As for the racist thing, it's the same as the right calling the left a "liberal" It's just a generic statement that is thrown when they have no intelligent explanation or anything to rebuttal in the debate, or are just ignorant. They just throw "racist" the right just throw "liberal"
Right, because one cannot do one and the other, both. Not that I owe you any explanation, but I build homes for both Corazón (http://www.corazon.org/HTMLPages/ConstructionProjects.asp - broken link) in Mexico and Habitat for Humanity here in the U.S.
Very good cause on both fronts. Now, I'm all for non-profits and organizations so long as my tax money isn't used for these causes. I want my tax dollars to go to poor Americans. My donations go South of the border in addition to Amvets, etc.
I do take issue to people stealing social services.
The reason I asked is that you seem to have issues differentiating between those that are here illegally and those that are not. How does my question drag race into the issue? I simply asked why someone would be referred to as a racist for wanting criminals dealt with properly. You seem very hostile and angry.
You're right. It truly is none of my business what your race is. It was a rhetorical question. I could care less if you were a transsexual nazi eskimo.
I agree 100%. Wish I could give you more rep but I have to spread some around first.
Generally, I can tell quickly whether or not a person on this forum has an issue with illegal immigration as opposed to an issue with race. There are plenty of both. When somebody posts, "Why can't we enforce the border, the cost is much too great, they are taking jobs from America" I assume their main issue is with illegal immigration. When somebody posts, "They should go back to Mexico and shove their flags up their ass, they are dirty people bringing the country down, they are full of diseases" then I assume their main issue is with Mexicans.
Debating how we should deal with illegals is not racist at all. Debating how we should deal with these filthy people ruining our country, on the other hand, is.
Generally, I can tell quickly whether or not a person on this forum has an issue with illegal immigration as opposed to an issue with race. There are plenty of both. When somebody posts, "Why can't we enforce the border, the cost is much too great, they are taking jobs from America" I assume their main issue is with illegal immigration. When somebody posts, "They should go back to Mexico and shove their flags up their ass, they are dirty people bringing the country down, they are full of diseases" then I assume their main issue is with Mexicans.
Debating how we should deal with illegals is not racist at all. Debating how we should deal with these filthy people ruining our country, on the other hand, is.
And it can be a bit of both. When Americans see these hordes of protestors out shoving their flags in their faces and chanting in some foreign language and signs telling Americans this is reconquista and that Americans must get out - yes - obviously many will note what flag is being obnoxiously waved around. When the American flag is torn down and another flag put up to replace it - you can bet Americans are going to look up what flag that is that was raised.
It's true that illegals come from many nations. But you don't have the president of Haiti or Ireland insisting that Americans are too lazy to work and demand that unlimited numbers of his citizens be allowed to come and insist that they are not to be expected to respect the immigration and/or other laws. In fact - how many governments are interjecting themselves into our domestic laws? One is very aggressive but the rest stay out of this matter. Many Americans wouldn't recognize the flags of many nations of illegals because those illegals aren't as obnoxious about using their flags to demand they be rewarded for breaking our laws.
And of course the sheer numbers - there could be 2 illegals from some obscure country, and 120 from another. Another country may have 20 million illegals here and it's government angrily insists that no limitations of any kind can be placed and becomes very agitated and hostile when any attempt is made to deport any.
But as far as issue with race? Not too many nations consist of solely one race - and Mexico like the USA is a very mixed race nation. I'm sure you don't mean to insinuate "Mexican" is a race as it is nothing but a nationality. And also as far as race, it's interesting the hispanics of Miami and La Raza never seem to bat an eye when Haitian boat people are turned away or rounded up in Miami and deported. Haitians are black - maybe that's why the La Raza types don't get out and protest in the streets over their deportations.
The thing to keep in mind is the "liberals" are NOT the vast majority of democrats. Historically the democrats are the most anti-illegal from a political point of view.
As for the racist thing, it's the same as the right calling the left a "liberal" It's just a generic statement that is thrown when they have no intelligent explanation or anything to rebuttal in the debate, or are just ignorant. They just throw "racist" the right just throw "liberal"
Yes - actually I realize that - and I know that Walter Mondale, and Ralph Abernathy joined Cesar Chavez in a march to protest illegal immigration and to bring attention on the issue of the border way back when. At one time liberals were more clearly on the side of labor and like Cesar Chavez and the UFW were against the bringing in of large amounts of illegal labor to keep wages rock bottom and benefits non-existent.
If anything back when the big growers were bringing in illegals, and there was violence when the Teamster union was brought in to beat up farm workers trying to block the illegals from taking their job, it was almost reversed - more democrats sided with labor, and the republicans with the big greedy growers.
Somewhere something changed and the democrats are no longer going to march to protest lack of border enforcement - like Walter Mondale and Ralph Abernathy and Cesar Chavez did. Now the democrats are with the big greed types and insist that supply and demand as far as labor be completely disrupted through unlimited supply of ultra cheap labor.
The UFW during Chávez's tenure was committed to restricting immigration. César Chávez and Dolores Huerta fought the Bracero Program that existed from 1942 to 1964. Their opposition stemmed from their belief that the program undermined US workers and exploited the migrant workers. Since the Bracero program ensured a constant supply of cheap immigrant labor for growers, immigrants could not protest any infringement of their rights, lest they be fired and replaced. Their efforts contributed to Congress ending the Bracero Program in 1964.
In its early years, Chávez and the UFW went so far as to report undocumented immigrants who served as strikebreaking replacement workers, as well as those who refused to unionize, to the Immigration and Naturalization Service.[7][8][9][10][11]
In 1973, the United Farm Workers set up a "wet line" along the United States-Mexico border to prevent Mexican immigrants from entering the United States illegally and potentially undermining the UFW's unionization efforts.[12] During one such event in which Chávez was not involved, some UFW members, under the guidance of Chávez's cousin Manuel, physically attacked the strikebreakers, after attempts to peacefully persuade them not to cross the border failed.[13][14][15]
Right, because one cannot do one and the other, both. Not that I owe you any explanation, but I build homes for both Corazón (http://www.corazon.org/HTMLPages/ConstructionProjects.asp - broken link) in Mexico and Habitat for Humanity here in the U.S.
I tried my best to let you know I meant no offense, I really wanted to understand someones viewpoint on helping other countries & not our own. If you help here too, 1 I didnt know, and I appauld you...but there are people who Only help out of the USA. That I dont get. My volunteer work is with the elderly, the mentally ill & animals, my donations go to St. Jude. We all make our own choices on how we give our time, money & help. I wasnt judging you, just trying to figure out how someone here, can see such need right next door, but choose to help far away. I have to admit I wish each country would take care of their own, and even though I have great empathy for anyone in need, I believe in doing all I can for my "neighbors". I cant feed or house the world, no one can, but I cant overlook those in my own coutry to help anothers. Sorry you seem so angry, and no, you dont owe me anything, but if we post in a public forum, I thought us learning from each other was the name of the game...so I wont bug you again.
If someone really cared about helping the people of Mexico, they'd have realized by now that the massive exodus of people out of there isn't benefitting anyone. When the only thing Mexicans can think to do is run to the USA, nothing is going to improve over there.
And you would look at why the people are running to the USA - even while we have double digit unemployment and they have less than 5% unemployment. It's the money. But how does that help those who are still back in Mexico? Look at the inflation brought on by the families receiving all this big easy money from the USA but those who don't have someone illegally in the USA are having a far worse time because of higher costs for everything.
And the children abandoned back in Mexico - even if they get some money, there's more to raising children than a remittance check. It is not helping Mexico in the least that it's children don't have parents because they parents are 3000 miles away lusting after dollars when the children need parents home raising them and caring for them.
Money isn't everything - and the open borders crowd doesn't realize that. It would be better for all these people claiming they want their better life to stay home and make the needed changes, stay home and raise their children, create jobs in their own country, build the infrastructure and improve their towns and villages and neighborhoods, build a future for Mexico.
That might mean some self-control and responsibility. Stay in school, don't start having children before you can afford them, wait until you've finished your education, obtained a few job skills, married before bringing all the babies into the world. That's what Mexico's growing middle class does. That's what Americans who don't live off welfare handouts must do. The American dream isn't just a big easy money and food stamp grab - it's about personal responsibility, education, work.
I am a liberal, and I am totally against illegals, and blanket amnesty. I would like to say that some of them could be allowed to remain, and apply for citizenship, but that isn't at all fair to those who have applied legally to get in, and are still waiting. The usual arguments don't sway me. "He's a nice guy, has a family to support, and works hard. Coming in legally would take too long. Mexico is corrupt." I have seen the illegals around here, but most have vanished. Most of them had the attitude that it was "funny" to evade the law, and remain undetected. All of my liberal and conservative friends are against illegals, and we feel that immigrants should be legal, and have something to offer aside from the ability to go on welfare, and trim a hedge, or clean a toilet. Anyone can do that.
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