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I've NEVER condoned this murder, and have said repeatedly that these 4 kids need to face the consequences of their actions. What I find disingenuous is your penchant for claiming they learned this 'hatred' from their parents. The fact is, if there weren't 20 million or more illegal aliens in this country creating the havoc they've created, there wouldn't be millions of American citizens up in arms about it.
As long as you and others are willing to overlook the basic premise that what these illegals have done is WRONG, the anger and, dare I say it, the BLOWBACK, is going to get WORSE, not better.
Agreed! Illegal immigration is an epidemic that effects this whole country. Of course some people are going to take their frustrations out the wrong way and I doubt this will be the last time something like this happens. I think it will only get worse.
My children know about illegal immigration, they watch the news, they listen to the radio, they know it's wrong, they also know taking the law in their own hand is wrong.
Because I am against illegal immigration and my children know my feelings on the subject, does not mean I am raising "murderers in progress".
Really, this thread is being beaten to death. Let's say, for the sake of argument, that these punks had no idea of the victim's immigration status, and that they really did "kill him because he was a Mexican" (which presupposes that they somehow 'knew' he was a Mexican, and not a Guatemalan, or a Hispanic American). So in a nation of 300 million people, one person that we know of was, without any doubt, killed because someone 'thought he was a Mexican'. OK? Agreed then. If you want to go further 'out on a limb', let's say he was killed because he 'looked' Mestizo, which to these clowns meant he 'must' be a Mexican..just for argument's sake, you understand.
This thread has gone on now for days. The event was tragic, but in the overall 'big picture', how significant, really, is it? Are we suggesting that it's no longer 'safe' to be a Mexican...or to LOOK like one? (As a matter of fact, yes, that's what some people are hinting at).
Really? So if you're a Mexican, any Mexican, or even descended from Mexicans, anywhere in the US, you now have to 'keep an eye out', stay in groups, and don't travel at night? Somehow, I think some people are using this unfortunate but isolated event to make 'political hay'.
Remember, we're a nation of over 300 million people. How many people are killed each day..or each week...or each year...because they're believed to be Mexicans? For THAT matter, how many people are killed in these periods of time, because they're believed to belong to the 'wrong' gang? Or because they're believed to be carrying a lot of money? Or because they're in the middle of an argument, or a domestic dispute? Or because they refused to 'give up' their car to a carjacker?
Nobody should be murdered, ever, by anyone..in this country, or in any other. My only point is that we do have a significant murder rate in this nation, and I refuse to believe that 'seeing a Mexican walking by' is a motive for very many of them...in fact' I'd say it's probably a very RARE occurrence, in the overall 'murder game'. That's probably why we're still on this murder after this much time, and not the many dozens of OTHER murders that have occurred in the weeks following it. It's in the news because it's a relatively rare event.
Really, this thread is being beaten to death. Let's say, for the sake of argument, that these punks had no idea of the victim's immigration status, and that they really did "kill him because he was a Mexican" (which presupposes that they somehow 'knew' he was a Mexican, and not a Guatemalan, or a Hispanic American). So in a nation of 300 million people, one person that we know of was, without any doubt, killed because someone 'thought he was a Mexican'. OK? Agreed then. If you want to go further 'out on a limb', let's say he was killed because he 'looked' Mestizo, which to these clowns meant he 'must' be a Mexican..just for argument's sake, you understand.
This thread has gone on now for days. The event was tragic, but in the overall 'big picture', how significant, really, is it? Are we suggesting that it's no longer 'safe' to be a Mexican...or to LOOK like one? (As a matter of fact, yes, that's what some people are hinting at).
Really? So if you're a Mexican, any Mexican, or even descended from Mexicans, anywhere in the US, you now have to 'keep an eye out', stay in groups, and don't travel at night? Somehow, I think some people are using this unfortunate but isolated event to make 'political hay'.
Remember, we're a nation of over 300 million people. How many people are killed each day..or each week...or each year...because they're believed to be Mexicans? For THAT matter, how many people are killed in these periods of time, because they're believed to belong to the 'wrong' gang? Or because they're believed to be carrying a lot of money? Or because they're in the middle of an argument, or a domestic dispute? Or because they refused to 'give up' their car to a carjacker?
Nobody should be murdered, ever, by anyone..in this country, or in any other. My only point is that we do have a significant murder rate in this nation, and I refuse to believe that 'seeing a Mexican walking by' is a motive for very many of them...in fact' I'd say it's probably a very RARE occurrence, in the overall 'murder game'. That's probably why we're still on this murder after this much time, and not the many dozens of OTHER murders that have occurred in the weeks following it. It's in the news because it's a relatively rare event.
Maybe we're worried about escalation? The anger is certainly there, don't you think?
Just from the attitudes on this board, we know that many people feel that the country is being "invaded" by the worst kind of scum on Earth. A race, if you will, of murderers, child rapists, thieves, freeloaders, catcallers, gangbangers, fake diploma receiving, government cheese eating, boogeymen.
And we can see on this board that theres not as many people thinking this is a VERY bad thing than there rightfully should be. Too many people think this is just a sign of frustration, and that illegals are bringing this kind of events on themselves. In other words justified.
If another country fires a bullet at an American soldier, we should just ingore that too, huh? Theres lots of bullets being fired in the world, lots of people getting killed. Lots of soldiers are being killed every month in Iraq and Afghanistan, and hey, even more soldiers die in accidents.
Lets not make a big deal about that American soldier who got a bullet fired at him.
Also, I didnt see this argument when people were posting about Jamiel Shaw(please God lets not go into that again, I'm just making a reference) over and over. That would have been a good time to pull out the whole, "hey, lots of Blacks and Mexicans get killed in LA every week. Why make a big deal of this one?"(Again, lets not go into that again, people, just bringing it up).
Maybe we're worried about escalation? The anger is certainly there, don't you think?
As I said earlier, I've been worried about escalation for some time.
Quote:
Just from the attitudes on this board, we know that many people feel that the country is being "invaded" by the worst kind of scum on Earth. A race, if you will, of murderers, child rapists, thieves, freeloaders, catcallers, gangbangers, fake diploma receiving, government cheese eating, boogeymen.
If 20 million people doesn't qualify as an invasion, what does?
Quote:
And we can see on this board that theres not as many people thinking this is a VERY bad thing than there rightfully should be. Too many people think this is just a sign of frustration, and that illegals are bringing this kind of events on themselves. In other words justified.
No one is saying that this mans murder was 'justified'. However, the anger over illegal immigration is certainly justified, as is the frustration we feel when our government ignores our calls for them to enforce existing laws.
Quote:
If another country fires a bullet at an American soldier, we should just ingore that too, huh? Theres lots of bullets being fired in the world, lots of people getting killed. Lots of soldiers are being killed every month in Iraq and Afghanistan, and hey, even more soldiers die in accidents.
Lets not make a big deal about that American soldier who got a bullet fired at him.
Wow, I think you're finally starting to get it. Mexico is firing bullets at us.
Quote:
Also, I didnt see this argument when people were posting about Jamiel Shaw(please God lets not go into that again, I'm just making a reference) over and over. That would have been a good time to pull out the whole, "hey, lots of Blacks and Mexicans get killed in LA every week. Why make a big deal of this one?"(Again, lets not go into that again, people, just bringing it up).
Maybe we're worried about escalation? The anger is certainly there, don't you think?
Just from the attitudes on this board, we know that many people feel that the country is being "invaded" by the worst kind of scum on Earth. A race, if you will, of murderers, child rapists, thieves, freeloaders, catcallers, gangbangers, fake diploma receiving, government cheese eating, boogeymen.
And we can see on this board that theres not as many people thinking this is a VERY bad thing than there rightfully should be. Too many people think this is just a sign of frustration, and that illegals are bringing this kind of events on themselves. In other words justified.
If another country fires a bullet at an American soldier, we should just ingore that too, huh? Theres lots of bullets being fired in the world, lots of people getting killed. Lots of soldiers are being killed every month in Iraq and Afghanistan, and hey, even more soldiers die in accidents.
Lets not make a big deal about that American soldier who got a bullet fired at him.
Also, I didnt see this argument when people were posting about Jamiel Shaw(please God lets not go into that again, I'm just making a reference) over and over. That would have been a good time to pull out the whole, "hey, lots of Blacks and Mexicans get killed in LA every week. Why make a big deal of this one?"(Again, lets not go into that again, people, just bringing it up).
Not arguing with your points, I'm only saying they're WAY out of balance. Strange indeed, wouldn't you say, that this murder means so much, and is indicative of bad things, and worse to come...while the HUGE problem of that significant portion of illegals who ARE violent criminals (not most, not half...but MANY), many of whose crimes are directed at the property and even the 'persons' of American citizens...all these 'illegal' crimes signify 'nothing'...they're just isolated facts....right?
Yet I'm sure there are MANY more of these crimes (of violence by illegals directed at each other, but mostly at the American public) than there are, or ever WILL be, crimes of violence directed at "Mexicans", for reasons of their perceived immigration status, OR their race. Why is one crime so 'significant' and worthy of endless discussion, while the other, much more frequent type crime gets downplayed?
Not to sound 'trite' here, but I'll even argue with your 'soldier' example. Off hand, I'd say that this Pennsylvania race murder has gotten SIGNIFICANTLY more attention that most deaths of American soldiers in combat. Hate to have to feel that way, but it's true.
Not arguing with your points, I'm only saying they're WAY out of balance. Strange indeed, wouldn't you say, that this murder means so much, and is indicative of bad things, and worse to come...while the HUGE problem of that significant portion of illegals who ARE violent criminals (not most, not half...but MANY), many of whose crimes are directed at the property and even the 'persons' of American citizens...all these 'illegal' crimes signify 'nothing'...they're just isolated facts....right?
Yet I'm sure there are MANY more of these crimes (of violence by illegals directed at each other, but mostly at the American public) than there are, or ever WILL be, crimes of violence directed at "Mexicans", for reasons of their perceived immigration status, OR their race. Why is one crime so 'significant' and worthy of endless discussion, while the other, much more frequent type crime gets downplayed?
Not to sound 'trite' here, but I'll even argue with your 'soldier' example. Off hand, I'd say that this Pennsylvania race murder has gotten SIGNIFICANTLY more attention that most deaths of American soldiers in combat. Hate to have to feel that way, but it's true.
Trust me, the crimes committed by illegals get more attention than crimes committed by citizens toward illegals.
Not arguing with your points, I'm only saying they're WAY out of balance. Strange indeed, wouldn't you say, that this murder means so much, and is indicative of bad things, and worse to come...while the HUGE problem of that significant portion of illegals who ARE violent criminals (not most, not half...but MANY), many of whose crimes are directed at the property and even the 'persons' of American citizens...all these 'illegal' crimes signify 'nothing'...they're just isolated facts....right?
Yet I'm sure there are MANY more of these crimes (of violence by illegals directed at each other, but mostly at the American public) than there are, or ever WILL be, crimes of violence directed at "Mexicans", for reasons of their perceived immigration status, OR their race. Why is one crime so 'significant' and worthy of endless discussion, while the other, much more frequent type crime gets downplayed?
Not to sound 'trite' here, but I'll even argue with your 'soldier' example. Off hand, I'd say that this Pennsylvania race murder has gotten SIGNIFICANTLY more attention that most deaths of American soldiers in combat. Hate to have to feel that way, but it's true.
I dont know. All crime is bad. But I'm more worried about a crime where hate is a big factor as opposed to a crime where greed is a big factor.
Crimes based on greed are a little more random. Crimes based on hate are pretty selective.
Vehicular manslaughter is not a race based crime. This crime was committed solely because the kid was Hispanic.
Okay then, what about the innocent African American, NON gang members and NON gang affiliated just regular blacks, being harassed, beaten, and murdered by Hispanic/Latino/Illegal Alien gang members almost constantly throughout Los Angeles/SoCal? Though AMC don't want to hear about it.
What about the innocent father and 2 sons who were gunned down by an AK47 wielding, illegal alien member of MS13 in San Francisco a few weeks ago, simply because they got backed up in traffic and blocked an intersection?
Is that vehicular manslaughter? Or maybe it doesn't really count since it wasn't "race based" to the best of our knowledge.
Also, since when are "Latinos" or "Hispanics" or "Mexicans" a race, thereby making your incident a race based assault? What race do they belong to, since you can be anything from white to black to Asian to mixed race and still be Latino/Hispanic/Mexican?
As for not hearing about crimes committed against illegals, give me a break. What crimes are being committed against them? This was one crime, horrible yes, but a single, individual act. It's not going on rampantly across the nation. The same cannot be said for the reverse.
What, are illegals getting stiffed a few bucks when paid cash under the table for mowing someone's lawn, bussing tables or cleaning houses? They're not paying any taxes on their income, thereby breaking the law and committing a crime themselves. Where is this plethora of crimes not being reported? Surely illegal alien advocates such as La Raza, Mecha, Aztlan groups, SPLC etc. would be all over them.
Last edited by Delron; 07-31-2008 at 06:20 PM..
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