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I don't, but I also don't think we should create police states that mandate everyone carry a National ID, I don't think we need racial profiling or anything like that, I don't think we need raids.
We just need to make some key changes to a few things like social services for illegals, birthright citizenship and come down hard on employers of illegals.
Although I agree with your last paragraph what is wrong with a National I.D.? It is no different than carrying a DL. I don't see how something similar to a state DL equates to a police state. No, we don't need racial profiling but that isn't what is happening in most instances. What is wrong with raids? I think we need to pull out ALL of the stops to deter illegal immigration within the law of course.
Ah!...what the hell, I'll give it a try but I'm getting sick and tired of arguing with a bunch of fanatical, right wing, radicals who smell blood over this issue and are foaming at the keyboard.
You first point, "You are against illegals". Well good for you, so is everybody. The hispanic American community is against illegal immigratin also. So am I. Let's all work together and get Washington to close the borders once and for all. There is nobody who is Pro-illegal immigration. This term is another right wing attempt to create enemies where none exist and inflame the people against anyone who is not for rounding up every hispanic at the point of a gun and putting them in cattle cars bound for the sonoran desert.
Your second point, "You are for legal immigration". That's nice, a baby born in America is a legal citizen. It's the law. Are you for that? I thought not.
Rioting in Arizona???? What a load of *******s. The demonstrations have all been peaceful and well organized. The only incident was when a trailer trash redneck tried to walk through the middle of the demonstrators physically pushing them away to let him pass. Inflaming the situation, just as you are trying to do now. At least the Hispanics don't bring guns to their political rallies like tea baggers do. (Oh, the jury's out on the refried beans and swastika caper as to which faction did this. Tapes are being reviewed now)
Nobody is saying the illegals should have amnesty. Amnesty is a term used by right wing foamers like you to inflame the situation and target every Hispanic as the enemy. You assume that all Hispanics are for Amnesty so they are the enemy. You will not stop until your racist agenda is fullfilled. As far as I'm concerned you and your kind are the biggest threat to a free America that exists. I, and others are getting sick of your f**king lies and distortions. As far as being able to stay in this country, how about you explaining to me how you would propose culling and forcibly removing 15 to 20 million people from the fabric of American society. I already know your answer, bubba. "Ship em all back to where they came from." And that's as far as your little mind can think. As I stated earlier, you and your ilk are the real problem as far as I'm concerned.
There are seasonal crops that need to be harvested all over the country. Legal Americans could apply for these jobs if they wanted too, but they don't. Not all illegals work in the fields. Many work in the service industry and have witholding taken out but because they are illegal they can never get a refund. Besides, 47% of Americans do not pay taxes, so whats the big deal?
The illegal immigration problem has been going on for decades in this country. It didn't start yesterday. There are common sense solutions to the immigration problem.
1. Immediately close the borders using federal troops if necessary.
2. Demand that all illegals in this country be required to register with an immigration board set up for the purpose. Anyone not registering should be immediately deported.
3. Any with an American criminal record should be deported immediately.
4. Issue temp. work permits for any illegals who are here and can show employment. They will have to have their permit renewed every year by showing continued employment other wise they will be deported.
5. Crack down on employers who hire undocumented people.
6. Overturn the "baby born here" loophole.
There are other measures that can be taken once the borders are secure but I'm not going to write the whole measure here, in this post. But realisticly, this above measures should cull 25-35% of the illegals here in the country and send them back where they came from over time. The rest should have to take a number and get in the back of the line behind legal immigrants and wait their turn. Because of the volume. many will never see their number come up.
But after all is said and done you and your kind don't want any reasonable solution to this issue. You are dying to see the black vans with swat teams raiding neighborhoods and rounding up every Hispanic in the area and throwing the ones without papers in the back of the van, never to be seen again while harrassing and humiliating the rest. I, for one do not want to see my once great nation come to this. That's why I say again, you.....and your kind are the real enemies of our country. Frankly, I'm sick of the fascist idiots who are coming out from under their rocks and trailer homes over this issue, trying to inflame the country into a full blown race war.
Soon enough, bubba, the talking will stop and you can bet your fat butt that the Hispanic community will not take this lying down or go peacefully into the night while a bunch of red neck honkies try and denigrate them to second class citizens.
BTW, I'm not Hispanic but as far as I'm concerned you and your right wing, fascist, racist, low brow a**holes can take your mean spirited agenda and shove it where the sun don't shine. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. And no.....I'm not in the least bit sorry for the rant.
Sick of it!!!!, Do you hear? Sick of it!!!!
(I guess I'll take a break from this crap. Not good for the blood pressure)
Ya know, I thought there was hope for you after yesterdays solution try but I agree with you, you need a break. Number one, you never could come up with a solution of the most abused loophole, visa over stayers with your continued appeal to allow them to come. Nor a fathomable solution to those "manning up" to take responsibility, they won't! Calling Americans "fat butt redneck honkies" is deplorable and has thrown anything you say out the window. We don't need racists in here, we have enough from the pro-illegal (yes, i said it) side.
Ah!...what the hell, I'll give it a try but I'm getting sick and tired of arguing with a bunch of fanatical, right wing, radicals who smell blood over this issue and are foaming at the keyboard.
You first point, "You are against illegals". Well good for you, so is everybody. The hispanic American community is against illegal immigratin also. So am I. Let's all work together and get Washington to close the borders once and for all. There is nobody who is Pro-illegal immigration. This term is another right wing attempt to create enemies where none exist and inflame the people against anyone who is not for rounding up every hispanic at the point of a gun and putting them in cattle cars bound for the sonoran desert.
Your second point, "You are for legal immigration". That's nice, a baby born in America is a legal citizen. It's the law. Are you for that? I thought not.
Rioting in Arizona???? What a load of *******s. The demonstrations have all been peaceful and well organized. The only incident was when a trailer trash redneck tried to walk through the middle of the demonstrators physically pushing them away to let him pass. Inflaming the situation, just as you are trying to do now. At least the Hispanics don't bring guns to their political rallies like tea baggers do. (Oh, the jury's out on the refried beans and swastika caper as to which faction did this. Tapes are being reviewed now)
Nobody is saying the illegals should have amnesty. Amnesty is a term used by right wing foamers like you to inflame the situation and target every Hispanic as the enemy. You assume that all Hispanics are for Amnesty so they are the enemy. You will not stop until your racist agenda is fullfilled. As far as I'm concerned you and your kind are the biggest threat to a free America that exists. I, and others are getting sick of your f**king lies and distortions. As far as being able to stay in this country, how about you explaining to me how you would propose culling and forcibly removing 15 to 20 million people from the fabric of American society. I already know your answer, bubba. "Ship em all back to where they came from." And that's as far as your little mind can think. As I stated earlier, you and your ilk are the real problem as far as I'm concerned.
There are seasonal crops that need to be harvested all over the country. Legal Americans could apply for these jobs if they wanted too, but they don't. Not all illegals work in the fields. Many work in the service industry and have witholding taken out but because they are illegal they can never get a refund. Besides, 47% of Americans do not pay taxes, so whats the big deal?
The illegal immigration problem has been going on for decades in this country. It didn't start yesterday. There are common sense solutions to the immigration problem.
1. Immediately close the borders using federal troops if necessary.
2. Demand that all illegals in this country be required to register with an immigration board set up for the purpose. Anyone not registering should be immediately deported.
3. Any with an American criminal record should be deported immediately.
4. Issue temp. work permits for any illegals who are here and can show employment. They will have to have their permit renewed every year by showing continued employment other wise they will be deported.
5. Crack down on employers who hire undocumented people.
6. Overturn the "baby born here" loophole.
There are other measures that can be taken once the borders are secure but I'm not going to write the whole measure here, in this post. But realisticly, this above measures should cull 25-35% of the illegals here in the country and send them back where they came from over time. The rest should have to take a number and get in the back of the line behind legal immigrants and wait their turn. Because of the volume. many will never see their number come up.
But after all is said and done you and your kind don't want any reasonable solution to this issue. You are dying to see the black vans with swat teams raiding neighborhoods and rounding up every Hispanic in the area and throwing the ones without papers in the back of the van, never to be seen again while harrassing and humiliating the rest. I, for one do not want to see my once great nation come to this. That's why I say again, you.....and your kind are the real enemies of our country. Frankly, I'm sick of the fascist idiots who are coming out from under their rocks and trailer homes over this issue, trying to inflame the country into a full blown race war.
Soon enough, bubba, the talking will stop and you can bet your fat butt that the Hispanic community will not take this lying down or go peacefully into the night while a bunch of red neck honkies try and denigrate them to second class citizens.
BTW, I'm not Hispanic but as far as I'm concerned you and your right wing, fascist, racist, low brow a**holes can take your mean spirited agenda and shove it where the sun don't shine. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. And no.....I'm not in the least bit sorry for the rant.
Sick of it!!!!, Do you hear? Sick of it!!!!
(I guess I'll take a break from this crap. Not good for the blood pressure)
Well inspite of your claim that nobody is for amnesty what you advocate is an amnesty.
Here illegally. Sign up for your work permit. Oh all the laws you broke before this point as long as you were never caught and have no criminal record? We'll just pretend it never happened. Thats an amnesty.
What about all those good people who have submitted an application for a VISA? You know the honest people who obeyed the law?
No way should illegals get a head of line pass. No way should they go unpunished for the host of laws that they have violated. In short no way should they be rewarded for their criminal behavior.
We tried the reward system back in the 80's the result has been anything but pretty.
Although I agree with your last paragraph what is wrong with a National I.D.? It is no different than carrying a DL. I don't see how something similar to a state DL equates to a police state. No, we don't need racial profiling but that isn't what is happening in most instances. What is wrong with raids? I think we need to pull out ALL of the stops to deter illegal immigration within the law of course.
We have been through this ad nauseum chicagonut. We are not required to carry around an I.D. on us right now. It's a slippery slope also, what's next? Embedding chips in our head?
I just personally don't like raids, they waste a lot of money on tanks and helicopters, the government doesn't know how to do raids right. Raids put too much emphasis on catching the peon workers and not the employers. All we see in raids are workers being carried out. There are better, less intrusive, less expensive ways of achieving the same results.
Tinman01, I just don't see any one in the anti-illegal immigration crowd offering any solutions to the problem other than "ship em all back where they came from." How do you realisticly expect to do that? I tried to engage in a dialogue that realisticly looked at the problems and concerns from both sides and come up with common sense solutions, yesterday. Since then I've seen post after post of falsehoods, propaganda and downright lies from the anti everything crowd doing nothing but inflame the whole situation to further their own and the right wing republican political agenda. There has to be a better way than rounding them all up and shipping them all back. But nothing less than that will satisfy your crowd. At least show some balls and admit that much.
Well inspite of your claim that nobody is for amnesty what you advocate is an amnesty.
Here illegally. Sign up for your work permit. Oh all the laws you broke before this point as long as you were never caught and have no criminal record? We'll just pretend it never happened. Thats an amnesty.
What about all those good people who have submitted an application for a VISA? You know the honest people who obeyed the law?
No way should illegals get a head of line pass. No way should they go unpunished for the host of laws that they have violated. In short no way should they be rewarded for their criminal behavior.
We tried the reward system back in the 80's the result has been anything but pretty.
For you it's obviously black and white. If one illegal immigrant is allowed to stay under any circumstances it is amnesty. I find this attitude unrealistic and unworkable.
I just don't see any one in the anti-illegal immigration crowd offering any solutions to the problem other than "ship em all back where they came from." How do you realisticly expect to do that? I tried to engage in a dialogue that realisticly looked at the problems and concerns from both sides and come up with common sense solutions, yesterday. Since then I've seen post after post of falsehoods, propaganda and downright lies from the anti everything crowd doing nothing but inflame the whole situation to further their own and the right wing republican political agenda. There has to be a better way than rounding them all up and shipping them all back. But nothing less than that will satisfy your crowd. At least show some balls and admit that much.
Show me propaganda from those opposing illegal immigration? Or whatever wing you always exclaim. If anything, this days flavor has been the protest (fear) of racial profiling by those who refuse to read the law and those who have been trying to explain it and show there is no merit in their squawk.. What are you talking about? (by respected posters, please, we do have trolls you know).
Nothing you say after your last post excuses your racist remarks and really want no further contact with you. It spoke volumes as to where your mind dwells. Ta!
I just don't see any one in the anti-illegal immigration crowd offering any solutions to the problem other than "ship em all back where they came from." How do you realisticly expect to do that? I tried to engage in a dialogue that realisticly looked at the problems and concerns from both sides and come up with common sense solutions, yesterday. Since then I've seen post after post of falsehoods, propaganda and downright lies from the anti everything crowd doing nothing but inflame the whole situation to further their own and the right wing republican political agenda. There has to be a better way than rounding them all up and shipping them all back. But nothing less than that will satisfy your crowd. At least show some balls and admit that much.
Solutions abound. All of them start and end with enforcing our laws.
Nail the scumbags who use illegal labor. Huge fines and jail terms.
Nail the land lords who knowingly rent to illegals. Same as above.
Nail the illegals. Sieze all of their assets to help offset the cost of deportation.
Remove any reward from the adventure. Make it too difficult to live here and they will self deport.
So which falsehoods do you call out?
Which propoganda? How about Illegals only do jobs americans are too lazy to do?
How about Illegals are honest hard working people?
I am against illegals....got it!
I am for legal immigration.
That said...
Help me understand why,illegals should be allowed to stay in this country?
I dont want to hear the usual B.S...."They do jobs Americans will not"..cause thats a lie.
I dont want to hear "they pay taxes"...cause they dont!
Also explain: Why should illegals get amnesty, while others wait on line to get in this wonderful country legally.
Cause at the rate we are going...we will be allowing low wage/non-tax payers/low ed people in and keeping higher ed/better tax payers/better to contribute to the welfare of this country OUT.
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Over the weekend I seen roiting in Arizona and I find it to be so disgusting that people who are "Illegal" have the nerve to cause chaos in a country that they dont belong in!
Anyone that rioting and illegal should have been thrown out of this country forthwith!!!!!
Who is allowing them? the Federal Government and the State of Arizona are deporting them, whats the problem?
For you it's obviously black and white. If one illegal immigrant is allowed to stay under any circumstances it is amnesty. I find this attitude unrealistic and unworkable.
Well I find that when you reward illegal behavior that it only serves to encourage more of the same.
No its not black and white for me. What it is however is a matter of right and wrong.
This is a great nation. We need to be selective about who we grant entry.
If a persons first statement is heck with you and your laws then quite honestly they are not good enough for this country.
Not 1 illegal is worthy of the gift we offer.
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