Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 12-10-2012, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Saudi Arabia
617 posts, read 696,963 times
Reputation: 56

Advertisements

The unequivocal and emphatic answer is NO! The Qur'an declares:
"Let there be no compulsion (or coercion) in the religion (Islam). The right direction is distinctly clear from error." (2:256)

\
Here is a good study of the question of the spread of Islam by a Christian missionary, T. W. Arnold:
"...of any organized attempt to force the acceptance of Islam on the non-Muslim population, or of any systematic persecution intended to stamp out the Christian religion, we hear nothing. Had the caliphs chosen to adopt either course of action, they might have swept away Christianity as easily as Ferdinand and Isabella drove Islam out of Spain, or Louis XIV made Protestantism penal in France, or the Jews were kept out of England for 350 years. The Eastern Churches in Asia were entirely cut off from communion with the rest of Christiandom throughout which no one would have been found to lift a finger on their behalf, as heretical communions. So that the very survival of these Churches to the present day is a strong proof of the generally tolerant attitude of Mohammedan [sic] governments towards them" (8).


Jihad Explained
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-10-2012, 04:37 PM
 
762 posts, read 1,216,867 times
Reputation: 238
Quote:
Originally Posted by weaam View Post
The unequivocal and emphatic answer is NO! The Qur'an declares:
"Let there be no compulsion (or coercion) in the religion (Islam). The right direction is distinctly clear from error." (2:256)

\
Here is a good study of the question of the spread of Islam by a Christian missionary, T. W. Arnold:
"...of any organized attempt to force the acceptance of Islam on the non-Muslim population, or of any systematic persecution intended to stamp out the Christian religion, we hear nothing. Had the caliphs chosen to adopt either course of action, they might have swept away Christianity as easily as Ferdinand and Isabella drove Islam out of Spain, or Louis XIV made Protestantism penal in France, or the Jews were kept out of England for 350 years. The Eastern Churches in Asia were entirely cut off from communion with the rest of Christiandom throughout which no one would have been found to lift a finger on their behalf, as heretical communions. So that the very survival of these Churches to the present day is a strong proof of the generally tolerant attitude of Mohammedan [sic] governments towards them" (8).


Jihad Explained
Can you really make that claim.. most religions have episodes of violence in their past, and committed atrocities on others of different faiths in the belief they did so by Gods grace.

From a Christian perspective I can say that those who seek to commit acts of violence or convert others against their will are NOT true Christians. To be a Christian means to follow Christ's guidance, no where did Christ tells us to kill in Gods name. The only way to bring a person to God has to be through peace and love, and the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

The problem Islam has, when it is misunderstood, is when you have verses such as those below, which do appear to all intents and purposes to advocate the use of violence as a means of persuasion. If the words are there ... There will always be those who will interpret them to justify their violent acts.

Qur’an:9:88 – “The Messenger and those who believe with him, strive hard and fight with their wealth and lives in Allah’s Cause.”

Qur’an:9:5 - “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”

Qur’an:9:112 “The Believers fight in Allah’s Cause, they slay and are slain, kill and are killed.”

Qur’an:9:29 “Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission.”

Qur’an:8:39 “Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.”

Qur’an:8:39 “So fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief [non-Muslims]) and all submit to the religion of Allah alone (in the whole world).”

Qur’an:8:65 “O Prophet, urge the faithful to fight. If there are twenty among you with determination they will vanquish two hundred; if there are a hundred then they will slaughter a thousand unbelievers, for the infidels are a people devoid of understanding.”

Qur’an:9:123 “Fight the unbelievers around you, and let them find harshness in you.”
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-11-2012, 07:25 AM
 
Location: Saudi Arabia
617 posts, read 696,963 times
Reputation: 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nefol View Post
Can you really make that claim.. most religions have episodes of violence in their past, and committed atrocities on others of different faiths in the belief they did so by Gods grace.

From a Christian perspective I can say that those who seek to commit acts of violence or convert others against their will are NOT true Christians. To be a Christian means to follow Christ's guidance, no where did Christ tells us to kill in Gods name. The only way to bring a person to God has to be through peace and love, and the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

The problem Islam has, when it is misunderstood, is when you have verses such as those below, which do appear to all intents and purposes to advocate the use of violence as a means of persuasion. If the words are there ... There will always be those who will interpret them to justify their violent acts.

Qur’an:9:88 – “The Messenger and those who believe with him, strive hard and fight with their wealth and lives in Allah’s Cause.”

Qur’an:9:5 - “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”

Qur’an:9:112 “The Believers fight in Allah’s Cause, they slay and are slain, kill and are killed.”

Qur’an:9:29 “Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission.”

Qur’an:8:39 “Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.”

Qur’an:8:39 “So fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief [non-Muslims]) and all submit to the religion of Allah alone (in the whole world).”

Qur’an:8:65 “O Prophet, urge the faithful to fight. If there are twenty among you with determination they will vanquish two hundred; if there are a hundred then they will slaughter a thousand unbelievers, for the infidels are a people devoid of understanding.”

Qur’an:9:123 “Fight the unbelievers around you, and let them find harshness in you.”

violence = " Fighting the enemy" in Islam so all these verses above is Directed to aggressors who Stand against Convey Islam to people and Fighting its message Otherwise NOT attack in Islam
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-12-2012, 03:38 AM
 
762 posts, read 1,216,867 times
Reputation: 238
Quote:
Originally Posted by weaam View Post
violence = " Fighting the enemy" in Islam so all these verses above is Directed to aggressors who Stand against Convey Islam to people and Fighting its message Otherwise NOT attack in Islam
Weaam, with all due respect, I find your answer confusing

Words like.. Fight, kill, slay, ambush, harass...do not give me the impression of defensive violence. Even if it did violence is violence and is I believe unacceptable to God.

They are words from a mans mind..not God.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-12-2012, 10:51 AM
 
8 posts, read 8,970 times
Reputation: 22
Quran (3:56) - "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help."

Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"

Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 992: - "Fight everyone in the way of Allah and kill those who disbelieve in Allah."

Ishaq:364 “Muslims, take not Jews and Christians as friends. Whoever protects them becomes one of them, they become diseased, and will earn a similar fate.”
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-12-2012, 11:57 AM
 
Location: Saudi Arabia
617 posts, read 696,963 times
Reputation: 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nefol View Post
Weaam, with all due respect, I find your answer confusing

Words like.. Fight, kill, slay, ambush, harass...do not give me the impression of defensive violence. Even if it did violence is violence and is I believe unacceptable to God.

They are words from a mans mind..not God.

How is that !!!

don't you think that anyone fights you makes you fight his aggression or just you stay hand caught ???!!! God in the Quran commands his prophet to fight the aggressors, who are fighting the religion of Allah and that for Protect the religion of Allah so after all the injustices and torture they went through, the Muslims were permitted to fight in order to defend themselves. Allaah, the Almighty, said (what means):

{Permission to fight is given to those (i.e. believers against disbelievers), who are fighting them, (and) because they (believers) have been wronged, and surely, Allaah is Able to give them (believers) victory Those who have been expelled from their homes unjustly only because they said: "Our Lord is Allaah.} [Quran 22:39-40]

Source :
Islamweb - kids corner -Battles of the Prophet



Quran is god's words so you can Watch this Video



HQ: Is the Quran God's Word? Peace Conference 2007 - Dr. Zakir Naik [Peace TV] Part 1/21 - YouTube
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-12-2012, 12:20 PM
 
Location: Saudi Arabia
617 posts, read 696,963 times
Reputation: 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaliNY View Post
Quran (3:56) - "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help."

Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"

Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 992: - "Fight everyone in the way of Allah and kill those who disbelieve in Allah."

Ishaq:364 “Muslims, take not Jews and Christians as friends. Whoever protects them becomes one of them, they become diseased, and will earn a similar fate.”


Every verse in the Koran has a specific occasion and interpretation so if as you think that Quran call to fight everyone non-muslim why you and Millions of Jews and Christians today we did not fight them Whether in Muslim countries or Western they Still are living with each other, each and every verse has been clarified in the Quran for a reason for that you must learn about Quran's verses
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-12-2012, 01:21 PM
 
762 posts, read 1,216,867 times
Reputation: 238
Quote:
Originally Posted by weaam View Post
How is that !!!

don't you think that anyone fights you makes you fight his aggression or just you stay hand caught ???!!! God in the Quran commands his prophet to fight the aggressors, who are fighting the religion of Allah and that for Protect the religion of Allah so after all the injustices and torture they went through, the Muslims were permitted to fight in order to defend themselves. Allaah, the Almighty, said (what means):

{Permission to fight is given to those (i.e. believers against disbelievers), who are fighting them, (and) because they (believers) have been wronged, and surely, Allaah is Able to give them (believers) victory Those who have been expelled from their homes unjustly only because they said: "Our Lord is Allaah.} [Quran 22:39-40]

Source :
Islamweb - kids corner -Battles of the Prophet



Quran is god's words so you can Watch this Video



HQ: Is the Quran God's Word? Peace Conference 2007 - Dr. Zakir Naik [Peace TV] Part 1/21 - YouTube
Jesus taught us to deal with our enemies thus...now it may be the hardest thing to forgive a person who has wronged, but ultimately it is the most rewarding path and the one I feel closer to what God would wish for us.

Matthew 5:38-48

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40 If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also. 41 And whoever compels you to go one mile, go with him two. 42 Give to him who asks you, and from him who wants to borrow from you do not turn away.

Love Your Enemies

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you, 45 that you may be sons of your Father in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. 46 For if you love those who love you, what reward have you? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? 47 And if you greet your brethren only, what do you do more than others? Do not even the tax collectors do so? 48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-15-2012, 02:58 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,612 posts, read 4,895,179 times
Reputation: 1408
Quote:
Originally Posted by weaam View Post
The unequivocal and emphatic answer is NO!

The Qur'an declares: "Let there be no compulsion (or coercion) in the religion (Islam). The right direction is distinctly clear from error." (2:256)
Weaam, to answer your question, you have to look at the history of Islam, not just what some book says.

It soesn't matter what the Quran says. What matters is what the Muslims did.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-15-2012, 06:27 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,501 posts, read 17,078,401 times
Reputation: 7539
Quote:
Originally Posted by hiker45 View Post
Weaam, to answer your question, you have to look at the history of Islam, not just what some book says.

It soesn't matter what the Quran says. What matters is what the Muslims did.
Having grown up Christian, I was taught that Islam was "Spread by the Sword" But then when I got old enough to begin traveling I was somewhat surprised to discover how few nations were ever conquered by force.

Historically nearly all Islamic expansion has been Eastward into the Asiatic and oriental nations. All peaceful.

The Tatars came into the Baltic Nations very peacefully and lived in peace until the crusades of the North which nearly exterminated them.

The history of Islam in Spain is quite typical of the Islamic "Conquests" See "ISLAM IN SPAIN"

The events of the past 50 years do not seem to be typical of the history of Islam.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top