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Since the the other thread got locked for going off topic I will make this the topic of the thread.
How do you guys think this the crisis of Haredi men not working and becoming an economic drain for Israel (and certain areas of the U.S.) can be solved?
It's my understanding the Israel is now pushing for both parents in a household being employed in order to get off welfare, but I'm not convinced that will actually get ultra orthodox men to start working, as it's obviously going to anger the majority of Haredi and relations will further deteriorate.
Somehow you have to convince the Haredi leadership it's a good idea for adults in their communities to work, I just don't have any ideas on how to achieve that. Anyone have any ideas?
Let me make this crystal clear: this thread is about how to get torah observant, haredi, or ultra orthodox adults in Israel to achieve the employment goal of 63% by 2020 set by the Israeli government. http://brookdale.jdc.org.il/_Uploads...im--May-13.pdf
Please do not go off topic and discuss whether this is a valid goal.
Last edited by HyperionGap; 11-07-2013 at 08:28 AM..
Since the the other thread got locked for going off topic I will make this the topic of the thread.
How do you guys think this the crisis of Haredi men not working and becoming an economic drain for Israel (and certain areas of the U.S.) can be solved?
It's my understanding the Israel is now pushing for both parents in a household being employed in order to get welfare, but I'm not convinced that will actually get ultra orthodox men to start working, as it's obviously going to anger the majority of Haredi and relations will further deteriorate.
Somehow you have to convince the Haredi leadership it's a good idea for adults in their communities to work, I just don't have any ideas on how to achieve that. Anyone have any ideas?
Let me make this crystal clear: this thread is about how to get torah observant, haredi, or ultra orthodox adults in Israel to achieve the employment goal of 63% by 2020 set by the Israeli government. http://brookdale.jdc.org.il/_Uploads...im--May-13.pdf
Please do not go off topic and discuss whether this is a valid goal.
I personally think this is horrible, but for different reasons. I know that in this case the complaint is that the men don't work and are supported by a combination of government and their wives salaries (is this correct?) But as someone who has sacrificed an awful lot to be home and raise my children this really irritates me. If both parents are working, who is raising the children? An institution? Not acceptable, IMO. Children need intimate relationships with their parents in order to learn to be productive, compassionate, members of society. We can clearly see in the US the effect of the day care phenomenon on our culture. In my own perfect world, I would have both parents actively participating in the role by being self-employed and apprenticing their children in the family business or farm.
How do you guys think this the crisis of Haredi men not working and becoming an economic drain for Israel (and certain areas of the U.S.) can be solved?
It's my understanding the Israel is now pushing for both parents in a household being employed in order to get off welfare, but I'm not convinced that will actually get ultra orthodox men to start working, as it's obviously going to anger the majority of Haredi and relations will further deteriorate.
Somehow you have to convince the Haredi leadership it's a good idea for adults in their communities to work, I just don't have any ideas on how to achieve that. Anyone have any ideas?
Let me make this crystal clear: this thread is about how to get torah observant, haredi, or ultra orthodox adults in Israel to achieve the employment goal of 63% by 2020 set by the Israeli government. http://brookdale.jdc.org.il/_Uploads...im--May-13.pdf
Please do not go off topic and discuss whether this is a valid goal.
Firstly, your OP needed a correction so its bolded. Israel doesn't have a marriage penalty like the US does. Israeli society is setup so there is plenty of family time in a given week. Secondly I'll start off with a link.
Quote:
Maimonides warns sternly, “one who studies Torah professionally and fails to
work – counting on charity for a livelihood – desecrates God’s name, shames the
Torah, extinguishes the flame of religion, harms himself and abdicates his
place in the World to Come... Torah that is not accompanied by work has no
staying power and inevitably draws one into sin. As Rabbi Yehuda taught in the
Talmud (ibid.), the man who fails to learn a profession or to work – ultimately
will come to steal from others.â€
I changed the OP, but I thought I read that Israel was considering requiring both parents to work in order to receive government assistance. I'll see if I can find it.
Personally, I think the priority should be on changing the education. Even if they want to actually work, how can kids graduating from HS get a good job if they don't have the proper education or training. I think boys stop learning science, english, and math at 8th grade to focus more on religious study. This has to change imo.
That was a very interesting article. Clearly this is a huge problem as well:
"The minute a 35-year-old kollel man attempts to enter the working world, municipal taxes triple, health care and education costs double, and the study stipends end. What high-enough-paying job can he possibly obtain, without any skills relevant to today’s hi-tech workplace, to offset these automatic leaving-yeshiva losses?"
This is something the rest of society DOES have control over. You can't really complain about a problem if you're the one enabling it.
I personally think this is horrible, but for different reasons. I know that in this case the complaint is that the men don't work and are supported by a combination of government and their wives salaries (is this correct?) But as someone who has sacrificed an awful lot to be home and raise my children this really irritates me. If both parents are working, who is raising the children? An institution? Not acceptable, IMO. Children need intimate relationships with their parents in order to learn to be productive, compassionate, members of society. We can clearly see in the US the effect of the day care phenomenon on our culture. In my own perfect world, I would have both parents actively participating in the role by being self-employed and apprenticing their children in the family business or farm.
You're judging Israel by Western values instead of Asian values. Israel has a strong family ethic and leaves plenty of time in a given week for family time. Israeli children get plenty of TLC.
You're judging Israel by Western values instead of Asian values. Israel has a strong family ethic and leaves plenty of time in a given week for family time. Israeli children get plenty of TLC.
Good to hear. What does a typical week schedule look like?
It looks to me like ~ 35% of the Israel's population is of Ashkenazi descent. Did they assimilate and adopt Asian values, or did they retain their western value system, but are simply a minority?
It looks to me like ~ 35% of the Israel's population is of Ashkenazi descent. Did they assimilate and adopt Asian values, or did they retain their western value system, but are simply a minority?
Yes the Ashkenazi population is that low and it was extremely lower 65 years ago. It goes to show you that the majority was (and still is) Sephardic/Mizrahi. But since there are nearly no Sephardic/Mizrahi to pull from anymore their numbers will continue to grow. Thus further generations will look more and more Ashkenazi. That number goes to show you that the vast majority were from the area in and around Israel and not Europe. The family ethic has always been there, but was made stronger with Socialism brought with the Zionists who came from Germany.
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