Snow removal in Hays (Russell, Madison: dorm, college, taxes)

[mshultz]

I was just reading The Hays Daily News where it said that the City of Hays only clears snow routes and secondary routes: "We don't do residential streets, and they're snowpacked." They currently have 5"-7" of snow.

How does that work? Do the clear sunny days in Western Kansas melt the snow in a reasonable amount of time? Our partly sunny day today was the first one in weeks, I think. Is the snow dry enough that cars can plow through this much snow? 5"-7" of wet Ohio snow would high-center passenger cars. Do the neighbors get together and clear their own streets?

Hays pretreats their streets with brine. Do they do all of the streets, or just the snow routes and secondary routes?

I know the relative flatness of Hays is an advantage. If you have not tried to drive uphill with a 2 wheel drive vehicle on a snow covered road, you have no idea just how hard this can be.

[denverian]

I don't know about Hays, but here in Denver they don't plow residential streets unless we get a foot or more of snow in the actual winter months. If it snows a foot in late October or late March/April, it's wet slush that melts very fast on its own. Denver is higher altitude (stronger sun) and is very sunny in winter, so they rely on the sun to melt it down. So far this season, the most snow we've had is about 3" and that was in late October, so it didn't even stick to the streets. We had a couple inches just before Christmas, so they didn't plow and the residential streets are pretty much clear now, even though it's been colder than average the past week. Maybe Hays is high enough in altitude that they do the same thing as Denver?

[AnywhereElse]

It is probably related to the finances of the city. The citizens probably didn't want the taxes raised and the city hit them with not plowing the roads in order to try to get them to approve a tax hike. Kansas is terrible when it comes to taxes and you get very little in services when it comes to what you are paying. Generally, they keep the admin workers and get rid of service workers who actually perform services the citizens need. It is sorry situation and getting worse all the time. At least when there is snow on the road, the potholes aren't as deep. Hays is a college town and enrollment may be dropping as it is here where we are and Hays is quite dependent on the college as I don't think there is much industry there at all. It is hard to describe the mindset here.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by AnywhereElse

It is probably related to the finances of the city. The citizens probably didn't want the taxes raised and the city hit them with not plowing the roads in order to try to get them to approve a tax hike. Kansas is terrible when it comes to taxes and you get very little in services when it comes to what you are paying. Generally, they keep the admin workers and get rid of service workers who actually perform services the citizens need. It is sorry situation and getting worse all the time. At least when there is snow on the road, the potholes aren't as deep. Hays is a college town and enrollment may be dropping as it is here where we are and Hays is quite dependent on the college as I don't think there is much industry there at all. It is hard to describe the mindset here.

Hays much prefers to be a college town instead of relying on "industry" like the rest of the towns in western Kansas. Oh, they also prefer to CONSERVE their water resources unlike the massive problems the SW Kansas towns will face in the coming decades. It isn't going to end very well I'm afraid.

[mshultz]

I have been following the 17" snowfall in Hays. They reiterated in The Hays Daily News that they are not plowing residential streets. I understand now why the realtor I rode with to look at some property was driving a Lexus SUV.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by mshultz

I have been following the 17" snowfall in Hays. They reiterated in The Hays Daily News that they are not plowing residential streets. I understand now why the realtor I rode with to look at some property was driving a Lexus SUV.

That sounds rather idiotic. What happens if they get two large storms of that magnitude in a row? HOW WOULD EMERGENCY vehicles be able to navigate the residential roads? I'm sure exceptions would be made.

[denverian]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

That sounds rather idiotic. What happens if they get two large storms of that magnitude in a row? HOW WOULD EMERGENCY vehicles be able to navigate the residential roads? I'm sure exceptions would be made.

Well, that's exactly what happened in Denver back in 2006/07. Just before Christmas, we got 24" of snow, and they didn't plow the residential streets. So basically, people with SUVs drove around and packed it down. Then a week later, we got another 12", plus a couple more storms in January. The end result was that by Feb., residential streets had deep ruts in the packed ice. Lower cars, like mine, could hardly get around, often getting stuck on the ice. It happened to me shere my car was resting on the ice with wheels hanging in the ruts, not touching the pavement! It got so bad, the city finally had to pay outside companies to come in and literally scrape the deep, compacted ice off the residential streets and haul it away in trucks, costing the taxpayers millions more than if they'd plowed. So after that, Denver will plow residential streets in Winter months if it snows a foot or more.

[empires228]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

Hays much prefers to be a college town instead of relying on "industry" like the rest of the towns in western Kansas. Oh, they also prefer to CONSERVE their water resources unlike the massive problems the SW Kansas towns will face in the coming decades. It isn't going to end very well I'm afraid.

If they "conserved water" as well as they claim they do they wouldn't be having the problems they are facing and fighting over water from a dry river with Russell. The college campus alone doesn't take any steps to "conserve water" as they were still running the sprinklers at all hours of the day though early December. They also empty and refill several fountains of various sizes several times though the year even though they usually only run during the summer while campus isn't even open. The snow removal here in Hays has been slow and Horrible even in main areas. The enrollment at the college is increasing, but they're doing it without hiring new staff, cramming large classes in classrooms that can't contain them, and fixing increasing parking issues. They count the large jump in online enrollment as an increase too so I don't know what the figures on campus are. 2 of the dorm buildings on campus aren't even in decent shape and the other 2 don't even have storm shelters.

[mshultz]

Originally Posted by empires228

If they "conserved water" as well as they claim they do they wouldn't be having the problems they are facing and fighting over water from a dry river with Russell. The college campus alone doesn't take any steps to "conserve water" as they were still running the sprinklers at all hours of the day though early December. They also empty and refill several fountains of various sizes several times though the year even though they usually only run during the summer while campus isn't even open. The snow removal here in Hays has been slow and Horrible even in main areas. The enrollment at the college is increasing, but they're doing it without hiring new staff, cramming large classes in classrooms that can't contain them, and fixing increasing parking issues. They count the large jump in online enrollment as an increase too so I don't know what the figures on campus are. 2 of the dorm buildings on campus aren't even in decent shape and the other 2 don't even have storm shelters.

The water for the FHSU sprinklers and fountains is probably treated sewage effluent, not potable water. When I visited in June 2012, all of the sewage plant discharge was being reused for irrigation.

[mshultz]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

That sounds rather idiotic. What happens if they get two large storms of that magnitude in a row? HOW WOULD EMERGENCY vehicles be able to navigate the residential roads? I'm sure exceptions would be made.

The 17" February snowfall came in at 2nd place to the 1903 February snowfall, so another snowfall of this magnitude occurring in close succession would be quite unlikely.

According to Weather America, Hays averages 20.5" of snow a year. By comparison, Denver averages 61.6" and Madison averages 45.7". Even worse for Madison, the daily high for December, January, and February is below 32 degrees. This, coupled with overcast skies, means that any snow is likely to stay around a while. Madison has 76 days of 1" or more snow depth, while Hays has 30 days and Denver has 51 days.

This data is from the First Edition. I also own the Third Edition, but many weather stations of interest are no longer reported. Hays is listed as averaging 18.6" of snow in the Third Edition, Denver 55" and Madison 50.2".