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View Poll Results: What should the United States do regarding the issue of legal immigration?
Slowly reduce the number of legal immigration. 11 25.58%
Naturally decrease legal immigration by raising our educational standards for most immigrants who are to come to the U.S. 23 53.49%
Allow legal immigration to continue at the pace of the status quo. 15 34.88%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 43. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-03-2008, 11:14 AM
 
Location: Bakersfield, CA
97 posts, read 274,917 times
Reputation: 37

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyc0127 View Post
I have an idea. I don't know how supported it will be nor how interested people are, but it's worth a try. It's about legal immigration. No, not illegal immigration. So let's all do a favor and discuss illegal immigration as little as possible on here. Illegal immigration is a problem too, but doesn't pose the same problem we are to endure.

The media wants your finds to focus on illegal immigration more because it blurs the real problem of an over abundance of United States citizens. That word ''illegal'' is a good example of how stridency sells. Truthfully, once you're here and have a child here or marry a U.S. citizen - you're here for good. There's no such thing as being legal or illegal. Anyone who refutes that idea is simply not wanting to understand reality for what it is.

The issue is legal immigration. The question is should we limit it? And if we do, how do we do this? Now, I don't want anyone to take this thread the wrong way. I know plenty of immigrants who are great people. In fact, many are more educated and classy than Americans. We don't go to their countries at exploding rates though. I don't purpose for any legal immigrant to be deported or deprived of future citizenship rights. For who's already here, they should be treated as people.

However, that is for who we know before March 1st, 2008. What about after? We don't take it so personal for who we haven't met. I know this couldn't be done immediately either. It'd take time, but may be a wise plan. To those who make that irritating quote ''we are a country of immigrants'', you're right. And this country was built by immigrants. But there has to come a time when we end this. Because in the end, we're all Americans and have to cultivate a way so for all of our citizens to live as best as possible. I think we should limit the number because our resources will deplete if we don't. Compensating for people's non-interest of joining the military is not a good enough reason to want more citizens.

The reason why is because we currently have slightly over 303.5 million people. We're projected to have 428 million citizens in 2050. 2050 is projected to be the year when immigration naturally slows down on it's own for several reasons. Here's what I say. Would multiplying our population by slightly a little less than 1.5 be such a wise thing to do? Places like New Jersey seem compacted as they are. Would it look right for Montana to become the next Jersey?

I don't believe it is wise at all. As for all those conservatives out their that actually thinks our current health care system works, whether they like it or not - we'll eventually end up with Universal Health Care. Countries that don't even have much money have it already. We'll eventually catch up to the ideas of plenty of modern-world countries. Plus, through that - I'm sure many immigrants will naturally become uninterested in our country since the medical field will pay less.

What happens when we have more socialized program in the future similar to the EU? We need to ration our resources properly. Our economy is sluggish. People are losing jobs. How do we know there will continue to be enough jobs for everyone? Everyone continues to try to figure out why we see a decline in America. When all said is done, none of you should be surprised at the overpopulation of our country.

Legal immigrants are good people and work hard. However, we just don't have the room for them. At least not poor ones. If we demanded a higher education level and better medical history of our immigrants, we'd naturally lower immigration numbers, have people immediately middle-class residents (rather than waiting a generation) and this would be more cost friendly. We'd be able to focus our money and energy into the plenty of impoverished Americans we have now. Regardless of whether we provide a path to legalization or deport illegal immigrants, one of these options needs to come about soon.

We can't allow people to sit in the gray territory for the rest of their lives. The problem we have now can't be avoided, but future ones could. We have plenty of people that will not just maintain, but allow our population to gradually increase at a healthy rate. Americans average about two babies. That's not bad compared to much of the modern world. If you don't believe me, ask Europeans and people in Montreal for yourself.

I believe that if we did reduce the amount of uneducated immigrants who are allowed in this country along with the ending of the Iraq war, we'd have a lot of money to do great things. Besides reforming health care and fixing illegal immigration, a decade or two from now - we may even be able to create a way for people to get free community college. Than increase it to regular colleges. If there is one country that works greatly for it's Great Britain.
It's too bad we can't continue to follow some of their great ideals. The states already contribute much more. If the federal government provided the rest, it could become more affordably reasonable to go to college. Many who are working-class who are above the status to qualify for Financial AID often purposely go slow and don't finish college. By socializing college education, we'd slowly diminish our large economic divisions.

Real good things could come about if we focus within our own lines. I think this is just one idea that could really do use for our country. I'm going to post a polling question asking what should we do about legal immigration.

this thread is a joke- so basically let the illegals flow in at alarming rates but stop the small percent of educated legals who've worked hard and gone through the process that is in place- wonderful, im sure that would make everything perfect
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Old 03-03-2008, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,157 posts, read 26,606,773 times
Reputation: 3668
Quote:
Originally Posted by viraj View Post
this thread is a joke- so basically let the illegals flow in at alarming rates but stop the small percent of educated legals who've worked hard and gone through the process that is in place- wonderful, im sure that would make everything perfect
I agree with you.
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Old 03-03-2008, 11:36 AM
 
Location: Small patch of terra firma
1,275 posts, read 1,563,000 times
Reputation: 527
Quote:
Originally Posted by High Springs Gator View Post
Good for you. Just because you take a stand against illegal immigration does make you a racist. People need to wise up.
There is a difference between taking a stand against illegal immigration and making ignorant statements about people. Yes, there needs to be something done about curbing and controlling the flow of illegal immigration but it means coming up with workable and reasonable solutions. Just calling them animals, claiming they are a bunch of ruthless murders and lack no compassion because of some crimes committed by illegals is ignorant, bigoted, and often times racists. Solutions are not racists in nature, but name calling a bunch of people is. That is the difference.

As far as controlling legal immigration, well the problem is the 2nd largest class of illegal immigrants is the legal immigrant who overstayed their visa. So it is a worthy discussion.
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Old 03-03-2008, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Arizona
2,070 posts, read 2,293,707 times
Reputation: 382
Quote:
Originally Posted by madicarus2000 View Post
As far as controlling legal immigration, well the problem is the 2nd largest class of illegal immigrants is the legal immigrant who overstayed their visa. So it is a worthy discussion.
And what percentage might that be of the total? 10? 15? 20? Based on numbers cited in other posts I would guess about 12.5%, or 1 in 8. Let's deal with the FLOOD first and worry about the mop-up later.
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Old 03-03-2008, 11:48 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 24,518,421 times
Reputation: 4812
My solution:

Seal the borders: Actual fencing and virtual fencing.

Increase patrols: Both the Border Patrol and the United States Military should be put on the borders. We should also increase the number of vessels that are searched coming into our ports. Increase the prescence of the United States Coast Guard.

Increase penalties: Illegal crossing should not be a "slap on the wrist". First offense should result in hard time - 15 to 20 years imprisionment. For the coyotes - those involved in human smuggling - the death penalty should be applied.
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Old 03-03-2008, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Small patch of terra firma
1,275 posts, read 1,563,000 times
Reputation: 527
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyPinestra View Post
And what percentage might that be of the total? 10? 15? 20? Based on numbers cited in other posts I would guess about 12.5%, or 1 in 8. Let's deal with the FLOOD first and worry about the mop-up later.
So as your house is being flooded by the cracks in the roof during a storm, you just keep the faucet on and overflow the sink, no worries, youíll deal with it after you patch up all the holes in the roof? And when does that happen?
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Old 03-03-2008, 11:57 AM
 
Location: Arizona
2,070 posts, read 2,293,707 times
Reputation: 382
Quote:
Originally Posted by madicarus2000 View Post
So as your house is being flooded by the cracks in the roof during a storm, you just keep the faucet on and overflow the sink, no worries, youíll deal with it after you patch up all the holes in the roof? And when does that happen?
That's rich! You make it sound like stopping the 12% would be as easy as turning a faucet. I don't think so. Focus on stopping the 88% FIRST.
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Old 03-03-2008, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Small patch of terra firma
1,275 posts, read 1,563,000 times
Reputation: 527
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyPinestra View Post
That's rich! You make it sound like stopping the 12% would be as easy as turning a faucet. I don't think so. Focus on stopping the 88% FIRST.
Yes it would, that’s why it is called legal immigration because they have to go through the proper channels. If you put a freeze on it, it stops the legal immigration. Or if you limit the requirments, it controls it. You know that is how legal immigration works right? You actually have to apply to come here and go though the necessary steps.
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Old 03-03-2008, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Arizona
2,070 posts, read 2,293,707 times
Reputation: 382
Quote:
Originally Posted by madicarus2000 View Post
Yes it would, thatís why it is called legal immigration because they have to go through the proper channels. If you put a freeze on it, it stops the legal immigration. Or if you limit the requirments, it controls it. You know that is how legal immigration works right? You actually have to apply to come here and go though the necessary steps.
While I do believe that our legal immigration system has been perverted since Swimmer Kennedy's 1965 fiasco, and I think that we need a moratorium on ALL immigration, I consider the human tsunami illegally crossing our borders as the more immediate threat.
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Old 03-03-2008, 12:15 PM
 
Location: Sacramento
13,473 posts, read 16,325,477 times
Reputation: 5314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
My solution:

Seal the borders: Actual fencing and virtual fencing.

Increase patrols: Both the Border Patrol and the United States Military should be put on the borders. We should also increase the number of vessels that are searched coming into our ports. Increase the prescence of the United States Coast Guard.

Increase penalties: Illegal crossing should not be a "slap on the wrist". First offense should result in hard time - 15 to 20 years imprisionment. For the coyotes - those involved in human smuggling - the death penalty should be applied.
Too many folks in prison today, the penalties should be oriented towards employers hiring illegal aliens.

I would deport the illegals almost immediately, after a brief prison stay. They should be given a stiffer sentence if found to have crossed the border again. But to put them in prison for the term you suggest is something we cannot afford, nor would it be appropriate.
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