Why is the MBTA so incompetent? (insurance, wages, law)

[ormari]

Originally Posted by Guineas

Life expectancy is pushing 80. There's no sustainable economy where you can work 20-25 years and expect pension at near peak salary for the remainder 30-40 years of your life in an era when our population growth is barely at replacement. And this is exactly what many of our public employees get, they have become a class upon themselves, at the private sector's dime.

It's not a race to the bottom to state basic mathematical reality.

That's exactly right.

[Dm84]

Originally Posted by Guineas

Life expectancy is pushing 80. There's no sustainable economy where you can work 20-25 years and expect pension at near peak salary for the remainder 30-40 years of your life in an era when our population growth is barely at replacement. And this is exactly what many of our public employees get, they have become a class upon themselves, at the private sector's dime.

It's not a race to the bottom to state basic mathematical reality. Putting your head in the sand, and wishing it weren't so doesn't make the problem go away.

Exactly. The reason the private sector abandoned that model years ago is because it's not sustainable. Just saying that public sector employees have what private sector employees should have isn't a solution.

There are very low level MBTA employees making 6 figures. Insane.

[wxjay]

Zone fares would be a step in the right direction. They do it for the commuter rail, and they should institute it for the subway lines as well. It is insane that you can ride from Alewife to Braintree for the same rate as people that ride from Porter Square to Downtown Crossing. Not to mention, what it is actually becomes is that the people who live in Boston itself (and many of them are on the lower to middle part of "middle class") subsidize the suburban riders of the T from Lexington/Arlington, Braintree, and parts of the North Shore.

[Dm84]

Originally Posted by wxjay

Zone fares would be a step in the right direction. They do it for the commuter rail, and they should institute it for the subway lines as well. It is insane that you can ride from Alewife to Braintree for the same rate as people that ride from Porter Square to Downtown Crossing. Not to mention, what it is actually becomes is that the people who live in Boston itself (and many of them are on the lower to middle part of "middle class") subsidize the suburban riders of the T from Lexington/Arlington, Braintree, and parts of the North Shore.

Until a few years ago there was an exit fare at Quincy and Braintree. It was eliminated out of the concept of fairness.

[Whatsnext75]

'There are very low level MBTA employees making 6 figures. Insane.'

that is pretty insane...but I imagine these people did a lot of overtime and that's how they made 6 figures.

Also it's pretty hard to take away someone's pension plan once they've been given one so the likely hood of that happening is nil. If anything they need to stop offering these types of packages to new people.

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by Guineas

Life expectancy is pushing 80. There's no sustainable economy where you can work 20-25 years and expect pension at near peak salary for the remainder 30-40 years of your life in an era when our population growth is barely at replacement. And this is exactly what many of our public employees get, they have become a class upon themselves, at the private sector's dime.

It's not a race to the bottom to state basic mathematical reality. Putting your head in the sand, and wishing it weren't so doesn't make the problem go away.

No, they don't. Sorry. You're misinformed. That is not the current system. It's nothing like that.

Past systems are past systems, and they've been heavily reformed. They're nothing like they were 15, 20, 30 years ago.

And I don't know if you've worked in the public sector, ever, I have, in two states. I couldn't afford to stay in it. Even when I started at 23 in a public sector job (in the mid 90s, 20 years ago) I would have been there to mid to late 50s, at a minimum, to even think about being able to retire and just get by on the pension at that time (I really would have had to get another job or stay in). Things are harder now.

But why couldn't I stay? The pay sucked. Both times I left the public sector I immediately received a 33%+ salary increase, and the benefits were just as good, and the starting vacation time were better (in the private sector). I like public service, I believe in it, but I can't afford the pay cuts. This is what I saw time and time again among my peers.

The benefits and pension system is nothing like what it was generations ago. Yet people want to harp on it like it is.

Originally Posted by Whatsnext75

Also it's pretty hard to take away someone's pension plan once they've been given one so the likely hood of that happening is nil. If anything they need to stop offering these types of packages to new people.

They don't. I considered going back in awhile ago. I really wanted the job, but with the pay cut from the private sector, there is no way the very very modest pension would have compensated for it, even staying in 20+ years.

[mdovell]

Originally Posted by Dm84

Until a few years ago there was an exit fare at Quincy and Braintree. It was eliminated out of the concept of fairness.

I remember that..the "warrant" still don't get the point.

There was also a time where I saw three drunk guys not have a warrant and man where they pissed at the t booth worker.

[ormari]

Originally Posted by timberline742

No, they don't. Sorry. You're misinformed. That is not the current system. It's nothing like that.

Past systems are past systems, and they've been heavily reformed. They're nothing like they were 15, 20, 30 years ago.

Right, it's nothing like that. It's worse. The public employee systems are rife with abuse:

Results of Pension Fraud Investigations, February 2012

Coventry fire chief under new scrutiny over pension benefits from North Providence - News - providencejournal.com - Providence, RI

Former North Smithfield police officer on disability pension arrested on fraud charges - News - providencejournal.com - Providence, RI

SAVANNAH, Ga.: Convicted Georgia police chief to collect pension in prison | National | News Democrat

There are lots more examples. So called reform hasn't gone nearly far enough.

[mdovell]

Any time you hear about something you have to keep in mind who negotiated the benefits, pay, working conditions and schedule.

Channel 5 just had a whole piece on a guy that's working nearly part time making a pretty high amount. However once you look at the fact that this guy worked holidays and overtime earning comp time it isn't that unheard of. When I was in the private sector I worked for one company where sick time cannot be sold back. I know people personally that easily have a year to year and a half of sick time. It can be used for short and long term disability. At the same point they had a 15% discount on their ESOP. Government employees don't have a ESOP, many do not have social security either as that goes back to the '83 Greenspan commission.

Yes some are in unions but the unions cannot legally go on strike. It isn't that uncommon to hear of some of them going a year if not two years out of contract.

I'd argue that pay is still mostly in the private sector. But benefits and scheduling and sometimes working conditions are in the public. Non profits well it varies all over the place.

"There's no sustainable economy where you can work 20-25 years and expect pension at near peak salary for the remainder 30-40 years of your life in an era when our population growth is barely at replacement. And this is exactly what many of our public employees get, they have become a class upon themselves, at the private sector's dime. "

Population growth is growing at replacement once you factor in immigration. As for the private sectors dime frankly 75% of infrastructure spending is public sector. If the private sector wants to do more by all means go ahead. But when I see companies that produce nothing of value and rely on the government as a proxy force for patents, trademarks, copyrights, zoning and licenses what are we to think? We have a first to patent system rather then a first to invent. Also experience in the public sector is open especially to other parts of government.

Then you had that IT lawsuits over poaching

Apple Settles Suit for
Elon Musk Has Raided 150 People From Apple For Tesla - Forbes

Companies start looking like the government during the cold war with this stuff. Sometimes I'm glad I'm in a industry where I don't have "enemies".

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by ormari

Right, it's nothing like that. It's worse. The public employee systems are rife with abuse:

Results of Pension Fraud Investigations, February 2012

Coventry fire chief under new scrutiny over pension benefits from North Providence - News - providencejournal.com - Providence, RI

Former North Smithfield police officer on disability pension arrested on fraud charges - News - providencejournal.com - Providence, RI

SAVANNAH, Ga.: Convicted Georgia police chief to collect pension in prison | National | News Democrat

There are lots more examples. So called reform hasn't gone nearly far enough.

Fraud is a crime and nothing with what we're discussing. And someone that is at chief level came in, more likely than not, a long time ago under old rules.