04-28-2010, 11:53 PM
29 posts, read
243,453 times
Reputation: 22
So, I'm moving to Michigan with my wife. Neither one of us have ever driven or lived in the snow before. I have a 4Runner with rear wheel drive. She has a lexus IS250 with 2WD. ARE WE IN TROUBLE???
We went apt hunting last week, and the people we meet pretty much scared the crap out of us. They talked about how we wont have a chance with 2WD in the Michigan winter.
Is this true?
Can't I just get snow tires?
Do I really have to trade in my car and get something with 4WD?
Does everyone have 4WD up there?
We will be in Michigan for 4 yrs per our contract...
Thank you!
04-29-2010, 12:22 AM
Location: Macao
16,257 posts, read
43,168,834 times
Reputation: 10257
Michigan is VERY FLAT....and the roads are heavily salted when it does snow.
I've driven just about every kind of junk car in MI weather...but never had winter tires, chains, or 4WD...and was absolutely fine.
04-29-2010, 02:49 AM
Location: Sparta, TN
864 posts, read
1,719,920 times
Reputation: 1012
Michigan is not FLAT everywhere -- NW lower and the western UP (the snowiest parts) are hilly. Nobody needs a 4WD unless you're off-roading. You do need a front-wheel drive vehicle with good tires for winter weather driving if you want to be safe. Or just don't go out when the weather is bad and you can drive anything...
And the roads are only heavily salted downstate. You're lucky to get them plowed in the more rural parts of the state and you're much more likely to see sanded roads rather than salted. Some places even have a no-plow on weekends policy to save money. Its kind of funny that the places which get the most snow/worst weather have the least amount of money to take care of the roads.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tiger Beer
Michigan is VERY FLAT....and the roads are heavily salted when it does snow.
I've driven just about every kind of junk car in MI weather...but never had winter tires, chains, or 4WD...and was absolutely fine.
04-29-2010, 04:39 AM
Location: West Michigan
3,119 posts, read
6,600,730 times
Reputation: 4544
Having 4 wheel drive is NOT necessary. It's OK to have a 2-wheel drive vehicle... as long as it is
front wheel drive. Unfortunately, both of your vehicles are rear wheel drive!
I hate to tell you this, but vehicles that are rear-drive are very difficult to drive in slippery conditions. Of any type of vehicle, they are by far the worst. You almost have to buy bags of sand or salt and put them in the back or trunk of the vehicle to provide added traction. If you want to keep your cars, that would be an option. But I think you will be miserable driving those vehicles. And I am NOT a winter weather alarmist. I actually don't find winter driving to be very stressful at all, and sort of enjoy it, actually. I just have a lot of experience with all three -- 4x4, front, and rear-drive vehicles.
Front wheel drive is ideal because the weight of the engine is directly over the tires. This gives you the traction and control that you need to get around 95% of the time during the winter up here. I actually prefer a front wheel drive car to driving a 4x4 pickup or SUV (usually). 4x4 is only an advantage when the snow gets really deep.
The vast majority of cars, other than sports cars, SUVs, and some luxury cars, are front wheel drive. Unfortunately, you happen to have a luxury car AND and SUV! In many cases, I think people over-dramatize the effects of winter driving. But in the case of your specific vehicles, those people really were just being realistic and honest.
Quote:
Michigan is VERY FLAT....and the roads are heavily salted when it does snow.
Some parts are flat as a board, but it's more common to see gently rolling hills.
04-29-2010, 06:03 AM
Location: West Michigan
12,083 posts, read
38,840,284 times
Reputation: 17006
Drivers went for decades with rear wheel drive vehicles in the snow. Get a GOOD set of snow tires and take it easy and you will be fine. While my vehicle is 4X4 it is very very unusual for me to actually use it during the winter. I use it much more in the summer out poking through the woods. I never turned in the hubs once this last winter. Decent tires and common sense is all it takes to be able to drive safe on snow, no matter the vehicle. I used to drive a 2 wheel drive 4Runner in Northern Maine and never had a problem in the winter.
Short answer, no you do NOT need to change vehicles to live in Michigan.
Firestone Winterforce are a great tire
Bridgestone Blizzak WS60 for the car
Bridgestone Blizzak w965 for the truck
Michelin makes a decent snow tire
Put them on all 4 corners and you will do just fine.
04-29-2010, 06:24 AM
24,832 posts, read
37,329,809 times
Reputation: 11538
We have many cars and trucks of all kinds because of our business.
My choice most days. A front wheel drive car. On slippery roads, IMO front wheel drive is better than 4 wheel drive.
BTW, Bydand is 100% correct.
04-29-2010, 06:38 AM
Location: S-E Michigan
4,276 posts, read
5,931,553 times
Reputation: 10864
Just get snow tires for all four corners
We have front wheel dirve cars and I run snows on my car during the winter months due to my long commute. My wife works for the local schools so she has no need to drive on the rally crappy days, which are truthfully only crappy for a half-day or less.
We have lots of snow plows and salt trucks here in the snow belt!
Regardless, I recently equipped her car with Vredestein Quatrac 3 tires. One of the two all season tire types available with the "Snowflake within a Mountain" symbol making them suitable for use on ice and snow. (Regular all season tires are not suitable for ice and snow, their All Season label merely means their tread area has 25% or more of voids)
Most BMW's are rear-wheel drive, until recently at least, and you see lots of them on the roads wearing snow tires during the winter months.
Snow tires during the winter months
All Weather tires (offered by Nokian & Vredestein) all year long
Work from home on the really bad days
Any of these choices will work fine
04-29-2010, 07:54 AM
Location: State of Superior
8,733 posts, read
15,933,713 times
Reputation: 2869
First off , it depends a lot on where in Michigan you will be living. Its a big state , and DOES have " snow belts" both downstate and up north. As a rule places like Detroit never get enough snow to worry about a 4 x 4. However places like South Haven and along the sun coast can get lots of snow.
The problem with front wheel drive these little cars get stuck very easy in a snow bank. I will take real wheel drive any day over these put-put wonders...in heavy snow. besides, front wheel drive only makes people feel they can go where they really can not. You must keep moving forward ( they do poorly going in reverse).... Give me a big old RWD Lincoln some sand bags in the trunk , real snow tires, and you can survive most places in Michigan. It depends more on where you are in Michigan as to what will be best for winter driving. Whatever you do , do get winter tires, they are a safty factor on ice , and that is everywhere in MI.. The rubber in these tires is soft , so they should be retired in the summer. Buy an extra set of wheels and store them in the garage for next winter. Studded tires are not legal in most counties on main roads, ( hard surface) so for all but the real diehard off road guys, forget them.
Here in the UP , most people still do have cars, many Subarus with AWD are the popular choice. It is surprising how few p/u trucks w/ 4 x 4 you see around Marquette considering we get 300 inches or more most winters. having ground clearance is whats needed with deep snow. Again , that considered , our roads are plowed every day, including weekends, not like the Lower Michigan secondary roads that only get service during the week.
04-29-2010, 08:43 AM
29 posts, read
243,453 times
Reputation: 22
Thank you all the replies. Your inputs are greatly appreciated
To clarify my situation, I will be living/working in the CANTON/Livonia area. A bit away from Detroit, but not too far.
I really don't want to trade in my cars unless I have to. So after reading this post, I think this is my solution.
1. Get snow tires for both cars and put them on during the winter. By which month should I already have them on? I heard the winter is 8 months long? geezzz... Why am I leaving Miami?
2. Put sand bags in the trunks of both cars. Exactly how many bags? One or two? four?
3. Anything special I must do to my car? I got a new battery, that's about it. I'm planning on changing the fluids and adding antifreeze to the car. Can't think of much more.
Yep, i'm clueless with Michigan and its snow. But i'm looking forward to living there tho.
Thank you.
04-29-2010, 10:15 AM
4,861 posts, read
9,304,433 times
Reputation: 7762
We live half an hour from Canton. Our son drives through the Canton area to commute to school 2/3 days/week. He drives a Ford Taurus (front wheel drive) and has never had the slightest problem except for slow going on I-94 on the very few days that we got enough snow to even slow down traffic this past winter. My husband commuted to Detroit and then Toledo, OH this past winter in a rear wheel drive Chevy Silverado pickup. The only problem he had all winter was getting up our slightly sloped driveway when he got home. I drive a front wheel drive Dodge Caravan and had zero problems this past winter, and I commute up US23 to Ann Arbor.
You will probably be surprised at how relatively little snow the Metro Detroit area gets in the winter. We are on the "right" end of Lake Erie, meaning that the lake effect snow hits the cities like Cleveland and Buffalo that lie on the eastern end of the lake. I think we only got enough snow to actually shovel twice this past winter, about 4-6" each time. Also, whoever told you that winter here lasts eight months is exaggerating a LOT! To give you an example, this past year, we experienced light jacket weather well into late October/early November, with highs in the high 50s and low 60s. December, January and February were cold, March was in the low 40s most days, and April has been in the 50s and up for the most part. It hasn't snowed since very early March. It will be hotter than heck by mid- to late June and stay that way well into September. Actual cold, snowy "winter" in SE Michigan really only lasts about four months. The rest of the year is either kind of chilly but with no snow or beautiful (May, September) or just plain hot and humid.
It sounds like you will be surprised at what the weather here in Michigan is really like. A lot of people have a stereotype of Michigan as being a months long blizzard. Not even remotely factual. Oh, and autumn here is absolutely to die for. It is the most gorgeous time of the year, just wait until late Sept. and early Oct. Oh, and welcome to our great state!!!
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Most Common Occupations - Farming, fishing, and forestry occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Construction and extraction occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Installation, maintenance, and repair occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Production, transportation, and material moving occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Production occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Transportation occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Material moving occupations (%)
People in Group quarters - Institutionalized population (%)
People in Group quarters - Correctional institutions (%)
People in Group quarters - Federal prisons and detention centers (%)
People in Group quarters - Halfway houses (%)
People in Group quarters - Local jails and other confinement facilities (including police lockups) (%)
People in Group quarters - Military disciplinary barracks (%)
People in Group quarters - State prisons (%)
People in Group quarters - Other types of correctional institutions (%)
People in Group quarters - Nursing homes (%)
People in Group quarters - Hospitals/wards, hospices, and schools for the handicapped (%)
People in Group quarters - Hospitals/wards and hospices for chronically ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Hospices or homes for chronically ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Military hospitals or wards for chronically ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Other hospitals or wards for chronically ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Hospitals or wards for drug/alcohol abuse (%)
People in Group quarters - Mental (Psychiatric) hospitals or wards (%)
People in Group quarters - Schools, hospitals, or wards for the mentally retarded (%)
People in Group quarters - Schools, hospitals, or wards for the physically handicapped (%)
People in Group quarters - Institutions for the deaf (%)
People in Group quarters - Institutions for the blind (%)
People in Group quarters - Orthopedic wards and institutions for the physically handicapped (%)
People in Group quarters - Wards in general hospitals for patients who have no usual home elsewhere (%)
People in Group quarters - Wards in military hospitals for patients who have no usual home elsewhere (%)
People in Group quarters - Juvenile institutions (%)
People in Group quarters - Long-term care (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes for abused, dependent, and neglected children (%)
People in Group quarters - Residential treatment centers for emotionally disturbed children (%)
People in Group quarters - Training schools for juvenile delinquents (%)
People in Group quarters - Short-term care, detention or diagnostic centers for delinquent children (%)
People in Group quarters - Type of juvenile institution unknown (%)
People in Group quarters - Noninstitutionalized population (%)
People in Group quarters - College dormitories (includes college quarters off campus) (%)
People in Group quarters - Military quarters (%)
People in Group quarters - On base (%)
People in Group quarters - Barracks, unaccompanied personnel housing (UPH), (Enlisted/Officer), ;and similar group living quarters for military personnel (%)
People in Group quarters - Transient quarters for temporary residents (%)
People in Group quarters - Military ships (%)
People in Group quarters - Group homes (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes or halfway houses for drug/alcohol abuse (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes for the mentally ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes for the mentally retarded (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes for the physically handicapped (%)
People in Group quarters - Other group homes (%)
People in Group quarters - Religious group quarters (%)
People in Group quarters - Dormitories (%)
People in Group quarters - Agriculture workers' dormitories on farms (%)
People in Group quarters - Job Corps and vocational training facilities (%)
People in Group quarters - Other workers' dormitories (%)
People in Group quarters - Crews of maritime vessels (%)
People in Group quarters - Other nonhousehold living situations (%)
People in Group quarters - Other noninstitutional group quarters (%)
Residents speaking English at home (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Foreign born (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Foreign born (%)
Residents speaking other language at home (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Foreign born (%)
Class of Workers - Employee of private company (%)
Class of Workers - Self-employed in own incorporated business (%)
Class of Workers - Private not-for-profit wage and salary workers (%)
Class of Workers - Local government workers (%)
Class of Workers - State government workers (%)
Class of Workers - Federal government workers (%)
Class of Workers - Self-employed workers in own not incorporated business and Unpaid family workers (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Utility gas (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Bottled, tank, or LP gas (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Electricity (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Fuel oil, kerosene, etc. (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Coal or coke (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Wood (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Solar energy (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Other fuel (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - No fuel used (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Utility gas (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Bottled, tank, or LP gas (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Electricity (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Fuel oil, kerosene, etc. (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Coal or coke (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Wood (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Solar energy (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Other fuel (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - No fuel used (%)
Armed forces status - In Armed Forces (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian - Veteran (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian - Nonveteran (%)
Fatal accidents locations in years 2005-2021
Fatal accidents locations in 2005
Fatal accidents locations in 2006
Fatal accidents locations in 2007
Fatal accidents locations in 2008
Fatal accidents locations in 2009
Fatal accidents locations in 2010
Fatal accidents locations in 2011
Fatal accidents locations in 2012
Fatal accidents locations in 2013
Fatal accidents locations in 2014
Fatal accidents locations in 2015
Fatal accidents locations in 2016
Fatal accidents locations in 2017
Fatal accidents locations in 2018
Fatal accidents locations in 2019
Fatal accidents locations in 2020
Fatal accidents locations in 2021
Alcohol use - People drinking some alcohol every month (%)
Alcohol use - People not drinking at all (%)
Alcohol use - Average days/month drinking alcohol
Alcohol use - Average drinks/week
Alcohol use - Average days/year people drink much
Audiometry - Average condition of hearing (%)
Audiometry - People that can hear a whisper from across a quiet room (%)
Audiometry - People that can hear normal voice from across a quiet room (%)
Audiometry - Ears ringing, roaring, buzzing (%)
Audiometry - Had a job exposure to loud noise (%)
Audiometry - Had off-work exposure to loud noise (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Has high blood pressure (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Checking blood pressure at home (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Frequently checking blood cholesterol (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Has high cholesterol level (%)
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on food at supermarket/grocery store
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on food at other stores
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on eating out
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on carryout/delivered foods
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on food at supermarket/grocery store (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on food at other stores (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on eating out (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on carryout/delivered foods (%)
Current Health Status - General health condition (%)
Current Health Status - Blood donors (%)
Current Health Status - Has blood ever tested for HIV virus (%)
Current Health Status - Left-handed people (%)
Dermatology - People using sunscreen (%)
Diabetes - Diabetics (%)
Diabetes - Had a blood test for high blood sugar (%)
Diabetes - People taking insulin (%)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Diet health (%)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Milk product consumption (# of products/month)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Meals not home prepared (#/week)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Meals from fast food or pizza place (#/week)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Ready-to-eat foods (#/month)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Frozen meals/pizza (#/month)
Drug Use - People that ever used marijuana or hashish (%)
Drug Use - Ever used hard drugs (%)
Drug Use - Ever used any form of cocaine (%)
Drug Use - Ever used heroin (%)
Drug Use - Ever used methamphetamine (%)
Health Insurance - People covered by health insurance (%)
Kidney Conditions-Urology - Avg. # of times urinating at night
Medical Conditions - People with asthma (%)
Medical Conditions - People with anemia (%)
Medical Conditions - People with psoriasis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with overweight (%)
Medical Conditions - Elderly people having difficulties in thinking or remembering (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever received blood transfusion (%)
Medical Conditions - People having trouble seeing even with glass/contacts (%)
Medical Conditions - People with arthritis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with gout (%)
Medical Conditions - People with congestive heart failure (%)
Medical Conditions - People with coronary heart disease (%)
Medical Conditions - People with angina pectoris (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had heart attack (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had stroke (%)
Medical Conditions - People with emphysema (%)
Medical Conditions - People with thyroid problem (%)
Medical Conditions - People with chronic bronchitis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with any liver condition (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had cancer or malignancy (%)
Mental Health - People who have little interest in doing things (%)
Mental Health - People feeling down, depressed, or hopeless (%)
Mental Health - People who have trouble sleeping or sleeping too much (%)
Mental Health - People feeling tired or having little energy (%)
Mental Health - People with poor appetite or overeating (%)
Mental Health - People feeling bad about themself (%)
Mental Health - People who have trouble concentrating on things (%)
Mental Health - People moving or speaking slowly or too fast (%)
Mental Health - People having thoughts they would be better off dead (%)
Oral Health - Average years since last visit a dentist
Oral Health - People embarrassed because of mouth (%)
Oral Health - People with gum disease (%)
Oral Health - General health of teeth and gums (%)
Oral Health - Average days a week using dental floss/device
Oral Health - Average days a week using mouthwash for dental problem
Oral Health - Average number of teeth
Pesticide Use - Households using pesticides to control insects (%)
Pesticide Use - Households using pesticides to kill weeds (%)
Physical Activity - People doing vigorous-intensity work activities (%)
Physical Activity - People doing moderate-intensity work activities (%)
Physical Activity - People walking or bicycling (%)
Physical Activity - People doing vigorous-intensity recreational activities (%)
Physical Activity - People doing moderate-intensity recreational activities (%)
Physical Activity - Average hours a day doing sedentary activities
Physical Activity - Average hours a day watching TV or videos
Physical Activity - Average hours a day using computer
Physical Functioning - People having limitations keeping them from working (%)
Physical Functioning - People limited in amount of work they can do (%)
Physical Functioning - People that need special equipment to walk (%)
Physical Functioning - People experiencing confusion/memory problems (%)
Physical Functioning - People requiring special healthcare equipment (%)
Prescription Medications - Average number of prescription medicines taking
Preventive Aspirin Use - Adults 40+ taking low-dose aspirin (%)
Reproductive Health - Vaginal deliveries (%)
Reproductive Health - Cesarean deliveries (%)
Reproductive Health - Deliveries resulted in a live birth (%)
Reproductive Health - Pregnancies resulted in a delivery (%)
Reproductive Health - Women breastfeeding newborns (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that had a hysterectomy (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that had both ovaries removed (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever taken birth control pills (%)
Reproductive Health - Women taking birth control pills (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever used Depo-Provera or injectables (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever used female hormones (%)
Sexual Behavior - People 18+ that ever had sex (vaginal, anal, or oral) (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had vaginal sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever performed oral sex on a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had anal sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had any sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had vaginal sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever performed oral sex on a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had anal sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had any kind of sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first had sex
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female vaginal sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first performed oral sex on a woman (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of woman performed oral sex on in lifetime (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male anal sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first performed oral sex on a man (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male oral sex partners in lifetime (18+)
Sexual Behavior - People using protection when performing oral sex (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of times people have vaginal or anal sex a year
Sexual Behavior - People having sex without condom (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male vaginal sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Circumcised males 18+ (%)
Sleep Disorders - Average hours sleeping at night
Sleep Disorders - People that has trouble sleeping (%)
Smoking-Cigarette Use - People smoking cigarettes (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ having problems with smell (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ having problems with taste (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had wisdom teeth removed (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had tonsils teeth removed (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had a loss of consciousness because of a head injury (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had a broken nose or other serious injury to face or skull (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had two or more sinus infections (%)
Weight - Average height (inches)
Weight - Average weight (pounds)
Weight - Average BMI
Weight - People that are obese (%)
Weight - People that ever were obese (%)
Weight - People trying to lose weight (%)