Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
We're going to be in the market soon for an antique house. I know all the drawbacks to buying an old house, but that's what we like and their availability is one of the things I love about NH. However, we live in a very new area right now, so I don't have anyone I can ask the following questions about shopping for an antique house:
- Is there a reason to update radiator heating to more modern heat? (besides the looks of the radiators.) The realtors keep insisting that they're great and add moisture to the air, and I grew up with them, but I wonder. Do radiators work with timed thermostats (the kind that lower the heat at night and raise it at a set time)? How much would it cost to replace them with a modern central air system with a/c?
- We don't want to get in over our heads budget-wise. How can you tell whether the pipes and plumbing are in good shape? Or whether the pipes are lead? (We have young kids and although I grew up with plenty of lead in my system, I'm hoping they won't!
- Is it common to ask a contractor to give you an estimate on updating the things you'd want updated BEFORE placing a bid? Is that something the realtor would allow or that the contractor would be willing to do? (updating kitchen/bath etc)
- Is there a reason to update radiator heating to more modern heat? (besides the looks of the radiators.) The realtors keep insisting that they're great and add moisture to the air, and I grew up with them, but I wonder. Do radiators work with timed thermostats (the kind that lower the heat at night and raise it at a set time)? How much would it cost to replace them with a modern central air system with a/c?
The rads *might* be ok, but modern baseboard radiators are more efficient at heating a room but otherwise work the same way. All heating dries out the air, but forced air is worse. Rads don't ADD moisture to the air unless they are leaking. If you see condensation on a window outside of a bathroom - that is a possible problem - not a feature.
A heating system is made up of a fuel source, a furnace, a hot water tank and piping and rads/baseboards for hot water heating or a blower and ducting for forced air. Converting a hot water heated house to a forced air house is very expensive, and in an antique home very very expensive. Why? Because ducting needs to be run through walls, floors and ceilings to get to each room. Ducts are big and wide. Unless you absolutely want A/C, forget about converting - better to upgrade your furnace, replace bad piping, and refurbish your rads or replace with modern baseboard types. If you are made of money, also consider underfloor heating, which I understand is very efficient (and nice on the feet).
Quote:
Originally Posted by NH2008
- We don't want to get in over our heads budget-wise. How can you tell whether the pipes and plumbing are in good shape? Or whether the pipes are lead? (We have young kids and although I grew up with plenty of lead in my system, I'm hoping they won't!
Copper pipes look like copper and will have green oxidization at joints. Steel pipes gray and will be rusty at some joints. Lead pipes will be darker gray and will have (I think) no oxidization, but perhaps some white mineral deposits where bad joints are. Best to find the furnace and look at the pipe leading away from there. You can't just look under the sink because what's in the walls is important.
Only a professional can tell you this for sure. Your home inspector can make a basic assessment, but will caution you to bring in a heating engineer or plumber unless it is clear the plumbing is new. Consider any plumbing more than 15 yrs old to be suspect and worth a professional opinion.
GET WATER TESTS DONE AS A CONDITION OF SALE. (a simple lead test from a faucet, and a full spectrum test from the well). Other tests should be for Radon in air and water.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NH2008
- Is it common to ask a contractor to give you an estimate on updating the things you'd want updated BEFORE placing a bid? Is that something the realtor would allow or that the contractor would be willing to do? (updating kitchen/bath etc)
Thanks!
In this market, you can ask the seller to hop up and down on one foot.
In terms of budget, a cheap antique house is probably going to be a money pit. Some things can be incredibly expensive to fix (bad foundation for instance). Unless you are pretty darn handy, for an antique house that has not been updated at all, you will want around 50% of the purchase price to update everything necessary. Full restorations will exceed the cost of the house.
(i've been in your boat. My wife wanted a 1700s farmhouse. I wanted a new house that LOOKED like a 1700s farmhouse. After seeing three semi-flooded basements in the middle of a dry spell, we went with the reproduction).
eek, eek, eek. We are considering an 1850 house that is not cheap at all - had had new additions put on and looks in good shape, but does have the radiators, doesn't have a/c, and does use well water. There is also a pipe leading from the first floor to the second right through the dining room which I thought was weird - but it's otherwise a beautiful house that's clearly been well-kept. When you say "very expensive" do you have a rough figure - are you talking 10,000, 20k, or...? Is this something you can take out of the offer price?
Also, is it true that radon is an issue in older houses with dirt floor basements?
eek, eek, eek. We are considering an 1850 house that is not cheap at all - had had new additions put on and looks in good shape, but does have the radiators, doesn't have a/c, and does use well water. There is also a pipe leading from the first floor to the second right through the dining room which I thought was weird - but it's otherwise a beautiful house that's clearly been well-kept. When you say "very expensive" do you have a rough figure - are you talking 10,000, 20k, or...? Is this something you can take out of the offer price?
Also, is it true that radon is an issue in older houses with dirt floor basements?
My husband would kill for a "new old" house!
Thank you for your input!
Your home inspector will tell you the good and the bad. A good Realtor recommends multiple inspectors with credentials. Remember, your offer is contingent upon many many things, including that the house checks out, that the owners did not withhold important facts (leaking plumbing and the like), and that your bank appraises it for the price you're paying.
The pipe leading to the 2nd floor is common in homes that were originally heated by fireplace. It can be tricky run pipes inside old walls. You can put a soffit around it if you like.
If the house looks well kept it probably is. But do dig further than the surface. Get in the attic, in the basement, walk around the home and check out window sills, etc. The better kept and updated, the less capital you need to improve it.
Expensive... you mean for a forced air and cental A/C conversion. I dunno. A typical 4 up 4-down colonial with - say - a one story, two-room extension is going to be more than 20K - that's my ballpark - I'm not a contractor but I've done a lot of home remodeling. The furnace, blower, condenser, etc. are going to be about 10K+ installed. The ducting - it all depends on how much wall work needs to be done. But the simple fact is that old house walls, floors and the design in general do not lend themselves to ducting. If you were doing a whole-house remodel, moving walls, replacing all drywall etc. then it's only a small incremental cost.
But hey, people don't have A/C in NH. Its not very common at all even in new construction. There just are not that many hot days. So unless it is a health issue you might want to reconsider that on your wish list.
RADON: can be an issue in any house (i think the number is 43% of homes are above the EPA limit), but actually new homes have the worst problems because they are much more air-tight (heat efficient). The radon cannot escape so there is more chance that particle ends up in you. However, a whole-house radon mitigation system costs no more than $1500 and if your house tests positive, just have the seller pay for it. Our new-old home had 5x the EPA limit, but after mitigation the next test came back at just barely detectable radon - well below.
I remember our old radiator-heated houses. Radiators build character IMO.
Radiators probably do add a small amount of humidity to the air via the blowoff valve on each unit. I remember the one in my bedroom making noises like a flight of banshees, knocking and rattling and whooshing and wheezing and otherwise doing everything but warming the room.
Some new aftermarket AC systems use minipipes, I believe the diameter is under 2", to ship the cold air around the house. Much easier to work these in than the standard ducts.
Well said, rmcewan. You covered many good points concerning an older home. An older home can be a source of pride to the owner, as well as having the possibility of being expensive to maintain or renovate. It much like an act of love.
Additional problems that can occur with an older building can be lack of insulation and an over abundance of air infiltration into and out of the building causing higher energy bills. Window and door areas a prime example due to single glazing and poor or worn out weather stripping.
And, remember that air infiltration isn't such a bad thing. The whole idea is to slow down the air traveling through the home to save energy yet, have enough air exchange to prevent the build-up of any unhealthy air borne contaminations.
Have any home your interested in inspected prior to your purchase. It's your best way of learning the individual "character" of your new "Old Home" and what it may require in the future.
One thing can be said for an older home. You shouldn't be bored or have lack of things to do around the house for there is usually always something to do or maintain.
NH2008,
although it sounds like you've already picked your town and possibly the house you're interested in, if it falls through... might I suggest checking out the Isaac Appleton House in New Ipswich? It was built in 1758/9 and has been rehabbed. It's also been on the market for over a year and a half so I suspect you can get a good price for it.
It's a 3 or 4 bdrm house (depending on how you count my nursery - it's pretty small) with a full walkup attic, a basement and an ell. The kitchen is pretty small since they seemed to have put in a wall we didn't have. I'm really sure there's at least no lead paint, because my mother spent months scraping all the paint off (and she remembers the lead paint she removed) - and it's been repainted since. The outside does need painting, it's got a bad case of peel. But it's on 4 acres. couldn't tell you what the heating system - we had forced air (I think), but the big grate in our dining room is gone, so it must have changed. don't recall seeing radiators when I did a walk through last spring.
Couldn't hurt to look? and the taxes are low in New Ipswich.
(mods: no relation to the sale of this house, just personal interest as I was born to it)
Remember also that all home inspectors are NOT created equally. Since home inspectors in New Hampshire are not mandated or licensed by the state, you might want to seek an inspector who has taken the time to be certified by either NACHI (National Association of Certified Home Inspectors) or ASHI (American Society of Home Inspectors).
We're going to be in the market soon for an antique house. I know all the drawbacks to buying an old house, but that's what we like and their availability is one of the things I love about NH. However, we live in a very new area right now, so I don't have anyone I can ask the following questions about shopping for an antique house:
- Is there a reason to update radiator heating to more modern heat? (besides the looks of the radiators.) The realtors keep insisting that they're great and add moisture to the air, and I grew up with them, but I wonder. Do radiators work with timed thermostats (the kind that lower the heat at night and raise it at a set time)? How much would it cost to replace them with a modern central air system with a/c?
- We don't want to get in over our heads budget-wise. How can you tell whether the pipes and plumbing are in good shape? Or whether the pipes are lead? (We have young kids and although I grew up with plenty of lead in my system, I'm hoping they won't!
- Is it common to ask a contractor to give you an estimate on updating the things you'd want updated BEFORE placing a bid? Is that something the realtor would allow or that the contractor would be willing to do? (updating kitchen/bath etc)
Thanks!
If you have not bought your home yet I would advise looking closely at the basement during the thaw usually March or April to make certain you have no seepage. Also during summer months you may want to ask if the previous owner needed to use a dehumidifier, as some basements get an awful lot of moisture. Keep your radiant heating system and no need to upgrade right away if it all works well but eventually when you can afford it you may want to upgrade to copper. Good luck with your purchase. I feel older homes do offer so much more than new construction! By the way, if you buy 10+ acres in some areas of NH you also get a significant property tax discount per acre.
I think 10 acres is out of our league! I think we are pretty settled on area. As for house, we'll have to see what's still available when we start shopping. This all sounds really daunting as neither my husband nor I are handy at all, but I guess we will learn. We are renting a run-down 1950 house right now and I am sick of poor water pressure, lousy heat, drafty walls, etc - my dream is a beautiful old house with like-new systems, but maybe I am kidding myself.
I am so glad to have the advice of what to look for in a home inspector. It sounds like I can pretty much put it all in their hands and they will tell me everything about the plumbing and so forth?
Is it common to take a contractor through a house to get estimates on remodeling before making a bid?
Also, is old wiring generally pretty safe and efficient?
Thanks again!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
