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I'm a professional black female in my late 20's. I have been trying to buy a condo/coop in an area queens that is close to Manhattan. Diversity, safety, lots of young professionals, lots of cafes/ restaurants, entertainment are important to me. I received a lot of recommendations, forest hills, rego park, kew gardens, but I think i like Astoria the most.
I have been to the Ditmars area and like it. But, I see a lot more old people and teens in that area. When I went to the Broadway area, is not as nice as the Ditmars area, but had more mixture of young and old people.
I would like opinions in the best of the two areas to buy of the two areas, or other areas in astoria?
I live off of the 30th Ave stop (1 away from Broadway and just a 5 min walk apart). Comparing the 2, I like Broadway far better...Ditmars is nice but also kind of boring?...there is stuff around there, but just not as much...I think there is a lot more going on around 30th Ave, Broadway and Steinway, all within easy walking distance. I find 30th/Broadway to be maybe not AS clean, but still pretty nice, definitely safe, and a good energy overall. Good diversity, too.
oh, and I should add, I'm in my mid 30s (no kids)....
More than that, how many coops did you see in Ditmars?
There are far more in the area roughly bordering Steinway, 30th Ave, Broadway and 21st Street.
But I would advise caution for two reasons:
One, if you buy, I'd look first to the older established successful cooperative buildings. The newer buildings, virtually all completed within less than 5 years, are yet to be fully successful. Having only partially sold; or, having not sold at all! So, be very careful.
Second, while Astoria is ethnically diverse, regarding blacks, it is quite limited. Though, over the last 3 years or so, the number I gaged has tripled. I've distinctly noted an increase in young black post-college women walking around unknowingly. Addtionally, while Astoria is not hostile in any way towards blacks, it is not the most conducive environment either. There are better alternative neighborhoods.
Third, given the nature of coops, the older buildings with older residents may be less than open.
Fourth, again, while Astoria is diversified, and while there is a growing Transplant population, Astoria is in no way 'Gentrified'; and the Transplant population is rather transient.
Astoria has been called for gentrification for the last 20, 25, years or so. What you see is the most significant progress the neighborhood has made in that respect. Do a seach and find some of the posts I've done on life in Astoria.
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I don't know what your budget is, but if you can financially swing it, I think Hunter's Point is a better environment for a black person to invest in this area of Queens. There you will find the only truly gentrified neighborhood in Queens. IMO, the housing quality is better. Astoria has a lot of newly shodily built properties. Also, Astoria is still and for sometime will be a neighborhood of (foreign) immigrants. Though the 21st St/Broadway and 35th Ave/Steinway surrounds have the best chance to reach a tipping point.
Again, be careful, as the market, presently, is overbuilt and building continues. For example, along Vernon Blvd with water views, there is only one succesful building. Two major projects have failed. One, a loft development has been taken off the market, for some time now. The other, a tower development, the largest project in Astoria, is failing and has had two 'auctions' recently, which to my knowledge failed.
There are also, quite a number of buildings, which sit, only partially occupied, or fully empty. Some have been in this state for 2 or 3 years or so.
Anyway, Ditmars is a quiet residential area primarily of homes. It also, as you have discovered, is a neighborhood of families and older people. Many homes contain multiple generations. It is an immigrant area. While I wouldn't call the area insular, as in all of Astoria, people tend to keep to their own kind. Frankly, while if you found something to buy and did, you could live there with little to no issue; though, it is not the place for you, nor I.
I have lived in intergrated communities all my life. I've lived in Florida where seeing another black person, generally, and seeing another black person similar to myself was a major event. I've gone to intergrated schools, been the only black in numerous circumstances. I can flip the switch effortlessly, if you get my drift. Yet, Astoria is the least comfortable place I have spent time in.
I live in Astoria now off of 21st st in a new rental building and there are quite a few professional middle-class blacks in my building. There are plenty of Blacks around 21st st but most appear to be of lower income predominantly from the projects. Very few are middle class like us.
As said above, people don't go out their way to make you feel uncomfortable but the fact is that it doesn't primarily appeal to many blacks(and transplant Whites besides cheaper rent and convenience to the city) socially. If you're immigrant like Eastern European, Greek, Hispanic, Lebonese, or of Middle-Eastern descent then Astoria is ground zero socially.
Astoria has great food and transportation but I don't know you and can't tell if you'll really fit in. Of course not all of us are alike. To answer your question, Broadway would be a much better investment than Ditmars...unless you want to buy an entire house with a yard.
Thanks Latikeriii. I think what you said it about what I have noticed. I have not seen alot of blacks in both areas. The few I saw were actually around the ditmars area. Broadway was mostly Hispanics, middle-eastern, and whites. What attracted me to the areas is that they have a lot of cafes, bakeries, restaurants, and things to do within walking distance. Since I work from home mostly, I want to buy in an area that has a lot to do, so that I dont always have to go into Manhattan for fun like I do now. I'm currently in the northeast part of the bronx. My other concern is the parking situation.
Very sorry to hear your experience in Astoria. I live near 36th Ave where the mix is Brasilian, White, Irish, Bangladeshi, Greek a little Middle Eastern and Central American. Astoria is incredibly diverse with many sub-neighborhoods. In fact the area below Broadway I would say has some potential for finding a good rental - but the housing stock quality varies as this area is closer to Northern Blvd.
This area is safe and has quite a few amenities.With Studio Square nearby, there is a good night life spot as well as a smaller club called Sapony on 37th Ave and ample bars and cafes. This same area has the new 3 floor Museum of Moving Image, a 14 theatre megaplex, and several dining option.
I will say Coltrane is right about the new condos - about 10 years ago some of the realtors and people who lived in the area who got into developing got greedy and cashed into the housing bubble. The city officals of course did not help - they supported this behaviour. The one condo development that looks very nice and one the water is Shore Blvd, another one is Pistilli Plaza near Astoria Park. Not sure if they are condos both or have become rentals. I heard from a good friend who has worked with the developers in Astoria they are finally realizing they cannot built these behemoths hoping to turn them into luxury condos - the area does not have enough upscale amenitiesto support this demographic. Personally I am relieved because I hated many of the buildings - they looked like the bland condos they would throw up in parts of Manhattan or areas around downtown Brooklyn. In Queens Plaza several were allowed to be built next to each other - and I know they are half empty. However, the city is finally put real investment into fixing the grounds by turning the underused parking lots into green areas. The next challenge is reduce the noise from the traffic coming off the Queensborough bridge and subway.
What is also intesting is there are many hotels being built for longer term residence - business execs looking to save money and European and Australian tourists staying at the hotels for cheaper rates. One of them, Ravel, sits at the foot of the bridge and blocks from the Queensbridge Projects.
Now as to the African American population there is a significant population - most in Ravenswood which is near to the water ... but also around my area btw Broadway and 36th. I know one life long African American raised in Astoria and he has had a good experiuence growing up here. What makes this area more attractive to new African Americans is the presence of Bangladeshi and Brasilians to this area. In Brasil there are many very dark skinned people so there is chance of being treated unfairly. The Bangladeshi suffer some of the prejudice as the African Americans - especially those with darker complexions. Of course these groups can be very closed ... my friend Tyrone, the African American Astorian seems more at home with the 2nd and 3rd generation Slavs, Irish , Greek and italians raised in Astoria -- possibly because Astoria itself is its own "ethnicity" if you will. You are welcomed here but to thopse who stay, build a family or really integrate into the community over the long haul you become an "Astorian". Just go to Seaburn Books on Broadway and talk to Sam and his wife, a Nigerian couple who lived in Greece left because they felt some discrimination there and came to the US to raise a family and publish Greek and English authors
Let me add too what many people consider encompasses a few distinct neighoborhoods. Many know Ditmars as the area around the Ditmars stop. One poster mentioned 21st, that area rom Astoria blv down to the Bridge is called Ravenswood/Queensbridg and had been similar to Astoria - and had quite a few mansion until the early 20th century, until the depression and the rise of industires. For exampls there is a condo with a large clock and is a handsome building which used to be only until 10 years ago a furniture factory and earlier a piano factory (Steinway's competitor). Anyway Ravenswood (21st to the East River, or Crescent St according to some borders) got his with 4 mediumto large housing projects - Queensbridge, Ravenswood, Hallets Cove and Astoria Houses. This may answer why Astoria remains slow to gentrification, the concentration of public housing on prime waterfront (plus add one a few industrial areas) present challenges. Hunts Point does not face that problem. So for the poster, the reason why you may have a large lower income group is because you may be not far from those areas. The areas around them are safe and the projects with the exception of Queensbridge an some areas of Astoria Houses are safe at even late at night. Granted I'd advise hanging around in these places after 10 pm unless you know someone there to visit.
As for cleanliness - Ditmars is the cleanest as well as those aves with little or modest commercial development (28th Ave, 31st Ave, 34th Ave, 23rd and 24th Ave).
Steinway is a mixed bag where it has lost some of its old mom and pop stores which offered quality goods. If you want to check an example of the fading mom and pop stores go to Fantasy bedding and linens on Steinway below 30th Ave. Prices are a little high but the service is very good and the quality high.
Last edited by astroia 34567; 08-25-2011 at 06:55 PM..
I'm a professional black female in my late 20's. I have been trying to buy a condo/coop in an area queens that is close to Manhattan. Diversity, safety, lots of young professionals, lots of cafes/ restaurants, entertainment are important to me. I received a lot of recommendations, forest hills, rego park, kew gardens, but I think i like Astoria the most.
I have been to the Ditmars area and like it. But, I see a lot more old people and teens in that area. When I went to the Broadway area, is not as nice as the Ditmars area, but had more mixture of young and old people.
I would like opinions in the best of the two areas to buy of the two areas, or other areas in astoria?
If I were unsure of a neighborhood, I would rent first for a year before buying and really get to know a neighborhood. If the neighborhood suited me , then I might look to buy at my leisure. If not, then a rental somewhere else might be wise.
Although the move to a rental can be a hassle, quickly reselling becasue of buying wrong is far more trying, both financially and emotionally.
The old saw, "Look before you leap," makes sense to me.
Astoria is a great neighborhood. You won't have any problems living there.
That said, the old-timers that live/own property in the area are known for being racist, especially towards blacks, but it's that quiet form of racism--they won't do anything to your person or yell at you, but you might find it difficult to rent an apartment. For example: I was looking to sublet my Astoria apartment a couple of years ago and my landlord actually told me "no black people."
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