Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
This exemplifies the point that with a student body as the current CUNY has, CUNY reputation will remain to be recognized as adult day care center at the best.
Were it not for TAP, Pell and other financial aid most of those students would not bother going to CUNY. The do so to get that check and of course not to be left or miss out of saying (or their parents) that they are "going to college". When they have exhausted their TAP and Pell awards and or are suspended for academic reasons most simply drop out and never complete their degree. Others manage to get off academic probation but find themselves relying upon student loans. They will graduate five, six or whatever years it takes to get a four or even two year degree deep in debt. Worse they are going to try and enter one of the most competitive employment markets in the USA.
New York City businesses complain all the time about quality of CUNY graduates. That or the same wonder why they cannot often find employment in their majors and or are passed over for those from other schools including out of state/City. This of course soon comes down to a "race" thing because god forbid anyone deals with the real deal.
If you mean the exam for NYC's elite high schools, there is nothing "wrong" with the exam per se. Just that large numbers of black and or Hispanic/Latino middle school students cannot score high enough. So now the usual suspects are playing the disparate impact card just as they did with the FDNY. In short because large numbers of AA or Latino students cannot pass the exam there *must* be something wrong with it otherwise they would, right? *shm*
I'll say it again one of the worst things to come out of this Civil Rights Act is this forced lowering of the bar just because some preset ratio of a population is not represented in housing, employment, education, etc...
I had an an opportunity to take the exam for Stuyvesant....I didn't because I got tired of traveling to the city daily for school (I was already going to junior high school in Manhattan and continued for 9th and 10th grade). I was going to private school. Wonder how I would have did if I had taken it, I'm pretty sure I would have gotten a good grade.
__________________
"The man who sleeps on the floor, can never fall out of bed." -Martin Lawrence
I had an an opportunity to take the exam for Stuyvesant....I didn't because I got tired of traveling to the city daily for school (I was already going to junior high school in Manhattan and continued for 9th and 10th grade). I was going to private school. Wonder how I would have did if I had taken it, I'm pretty sure I would have gotten a good grade.
Friends of mine took the exam mostly guys. They reported back it was much harder than they taught but still managed. IIRC two made the cut, not sure of the rest. None bothered with City high schools and went to private instead.
Boy, this topic is almost like a bad sandwich...it just keeps repeating on you. Wasn't there a similar topic last month?
I'm not for quotas at all. I'd like to think that I achieved well in school due to merit, not because they needed some more brown faces in the classroom. But tell me OP. You pose the "problem", so what do you think should be the solution? Don't worry, I'm not waiting for a response from you because I know I will get none. And that's fine, really...
How about improving the quality of the K-12 education so that you aren't graduating a bunch of kids who don't know the difference between "too" "two" and "to"? I want someone to explain to me why teachers are giving away 65s like candy? Oh I get it, you want to get the n'er do wells out of your classroom to make room for the next bunch, but at the end game look what happens? I applaud the teachers who aren't afraid to demand accountability and will not give a second thought to throwing out disruptive students or flunking them. My aunt is a retired high school teacher and she took ZERO crap. She now teaches high school equivalency in the prison system. Close underperforming schools much faster than twenty years.
When I was in school, there was this program called "mentoring". How about more people try and reach out to at risk young kids so they're not ending up like the "graduates" people here are complaining about? While I wasn't at risk, my mentor (a senior executive/publisher at Crain Communications) was very instrumental in my teen years. Everyone can use a helping hand..not in the form of handouts, but in other ways. If these kids are obviously not getting time and parental guidance at home, what's so wrong with mentoring an hour or two a week? One of the mentors in the program was a mailroom supervisor at the Federal Reserve Bank, so you don't have to be a big wig. Just an older person interested in helping others. Maybe if more minorities mentored, it could help? But no, it's much easier to comment about the problems. But to care, that's another thing, isn't it. (BTW, judging by internet speak, many people don't seem to know the difference between "two" "to" and "too", or "you're" and "your" for that matter. I guess a big F for them, huh?)
At least I'm trying to do the right thing by being a parent to my kids, help them to see the value of education, and demand accountability from them, so that they won't need to deal with quotas. Also, we have exactly two (2) kids, not twenty.
BTW, the specialized schools aren't the end all be all. It's a shame that many of the other schools are shytty.
Were it not for TAP, Pell and other financial aid most of those students would not bother going to CUNY. The do so to get that check and of course not to be left or miss out of saying (or their parents) that they are "going to college". When they have exhausted their TAP and Pell awards and or are suspended for academic reasons most simply drop out and never complete their degree. Others manage to get off academic probation but find themselves relying upon student loans. They will graduate five, six or whatever years it takes to get a four or even two year degree deep in debt. Worse they are going to try and enter one of the most competitive employment markets in the USA.
New York City businesses complain all the time about quality of CUNY graduates. That or the same wonder why they cannot often find employment in their majors and or are passed over for those from other schools including out of state/City. This of course soon comes down to a "race" thing because god forbid anyone deals with the real deal.
Much of this is bull****. Yes, many CUNY graduates don't graduate because they are working class, trying to work and to go to school. And let's face it some people are just not meant to be college students.
With that said, there are plenty of CUNY graduates who have solid careers and I met my share of CUNY graduates who went to Ivy Leagues for graduate school.
You seems to hate on these students because they are poor!
THE US was and still is recognized by its powerful education system, but I doubt that this reputation will last long judging by the ongoing changes in the system. Once all the foreign rich families figure out that the quality of US college system is a ponzi and stop sending their children to the US for schooling, the education bubble will burst which will give another blow on the entire nation similar to what the subprime crisis did a few years ago.
Harvard, Stanford, Cornell, etc are not running scared even if there is a crash in the educational sector. Places like Pace and other third tier private universities might be screwed!
Others have noted that the Orthodox/Hasidic do not send their children to public grammar or high schools and are not taking the exam.
Quote:
Originally Posted by riaelise
My brother, Latino, attends a magnet high school in Florida that is 90% Black and Latino and the test scores are off the charts.
Is the school admitting under a quota, or a qualification system?
No one should be saying that NYC's black & latino children are stupid. The problem is that the environment for many is so poor, from infancy, that they fall behind early & remain there. Even Head Start appears to be too late. Absent or disinterested parents are the problem. Read to your kids. Expand their vocabulary.
Quote:
Originally Posted by queensgrl
They're not planning to dumb down -- just increase the qualifications to ... a resume
Most of us would like to believe that this is true, but the real world has discouraged us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude
Even NYC was nearly all white it had a massive, uneducated lower class
While people may have griped, no one sued about ethnic disparities in elite high schools. I wouldn't be surprised if the student bodies were heavily Jewish decades ago. Everyone else realized that these kids were being pushed to excel by their immigrant parents, which is much the same now with Asians.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal
open admissions onto CUNY was one of the worse things done to that system.
Actually, it isn't. NYC public high school students generally are not qualified for college. That's not the fault of CUNY, it's the fault of the NYC BOE, and can be traced back even further, to parents.
Quote:
there are plenty of CUNY graduates who have solid careers and I met my share of CUNY graduates who went to Ivy Leagues for graduate school.
That's great, but they are the minority (no pun intended!).
Last edited by bigjake54; 07-22-2014 at 09:19 PM..
I had an an opportunity to take the exam for Stuyvesant....I didn't because I got tired of traveling to the city daily for school (I was already going to junior high school in Manhattan and continued for 9th and 10th grade). I was going to private school. Wonder how I would have did if I had taken it, I'm pretty sure I would have gotten a good grade.
I, too, never bothered. For several reasons. One, I enjoyed creative things (like writing) not math or science. Two, after hearing from so many people how incredibly hard it was, I decided to save myself the trouble. I am glad that I attended the school that I did, though...met some incredibly good teachers who really shaped my life....
Others have noted that the Orthodox/Hasidic do not send their children to public grammar or high schools and are not taking the exam.
Is the school admitting under a quota, or a qualification system?
No one should be saying that NYC's black & latino children are stupid. The problem is that the environment for many is so poor, from infancy, that they fall behind early & remain there. Even Head Start appears to be too late. Absent or disinterested parents are the problem. Read to your kids. Expand their vocabulary.
Most of us would like to believe that this is true, but the real world has discouraged us.
Bigjake, I wholeheartedly agree. I also want to add, in the absence of quality parenting, I wish that more people in the Black and Latino community would participate in such things as mentoring and big brother/big sister. You read about so many success stories...
I wish that more people ... would participate in ... big brother/big sister. You read about so many success stories ...
You also read about pedophiles infiltrating the system, unfortunately.
Parents need to have a respect for education, and need to infuse that respect into their children. My mother had a fifth-grade education in another country, but managed to teach me to read before I ever went to school. That jumpstart helped me all through life. I was always ahead.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
