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NEVER! Never been denied restroom access in my entire life. In fact, most retail establishments offer me restroom usage. Do you think its cause I'm the other white meat?
Do you think what happened at Starbucks had to do with their appearance? Meaning their clothes? I have people confide in me and they've mentioned corn rolls and sweat pants have negative connotations and it makes them feel uncomfortable. Maybe the 2 guys said something to the manager that made him/her feel uncomfortable? We'll just never know.
Yes, what happened to them had to do with the appearance of their skin. Let’s not try to explain this away as anything else than what it is: discrimination/racism. Once you start saying “but they were...” you’re looking for ways to excuse the racist behavior.
The men were in the store waiting for someone and one of them wanted to use the bathroom while he was waiting. They were (literally) arrested for waiting in a store. This is a classic case of implicit bias. If you don’t find this problematic, you’re part of the problem. Keep in mind, plenty of (white) people were in the store witnessing this and found it problematic enough to film it and post it online.
Yes, what happened to them had to do with the appearance of their skin. Let’s not try to explain this away as anything else than what it is: discrimination/racism. Once you start saying “but they were...” you’re looking for ways to excuse the racist behavior.
The men were in the store waiting for someone and one of them wanted to use the bathroom while he was waiting. They were (literally) arrested for waiting in a store. This is a classic case of implicit bias. If you don’t find this problematic, you’re part of the problem. Keep in mind, plenty of (white) people were in the store witnessing this and found it problematic enough to film it and post it online.
This - amazing looking at the "lets explain this away" crap I see posted on here.
The video shows what it wants to show. We are not sure if they had a verbal altercation of some kind with the manager when asking to use the restroom. Just try to keep an open mind that not everything was shown in the news, nor would we ever know unless we witnessed the entire thing.
The video shows what it wants to show. We are not sure if they had a verbal altercation of some kind with the manager when asking to use the restroom. Just try to keep an open mind that not everything was shown in the news, nor would we ever know unless we witnessed the entire thing.
It seems like you're determined to cast blame on the victims.
Witness accounts all said the men did nothing wrong. And the video of their arrests show them being polite and silent. So I'm not sure why you need to make up your own narrative, but I'm guessing it's because you're suffering from the same bias the manager and the police were suffering from.
a retail employee CANNOT discriminate on customers based on appearance.
Retail stores can say anyone who uses the bathroom has to be a customer or they can say they don't have a public bathroom. But they can't treat customers differently for any reason, PERIOD.
Yes, stores absolutely can discriminate based on dress, which is not a protected class. Restaurants that require suit and tie. No gang colors or wife beaters at clubs. Retail banks let high value clients use their non-public bathrooms. See how they treat you at Tourneau if you go in wearing a fast food uniform vs a Patek Phillipe.
Yeah, they do this bullsh it (especially at Starbucks) where you gotta purchase somethin to get the code for the bathroom, or u will be denied access. The one on 14th & 8th lets you go with not a problem. Before they went easy on minute quality of life issues such as peeing in public, it’s like u are caught between a rock and a hard place. Try and use the bathroom indoors, or go out in public, do what u need to do, the 12 roll up and pop u with a ticket
Some McDonald locations require a purchase as well.
I was asking NYWriterDude to be opened minded, but he declined. As I wrote before, we'll never know if something as a verbal exchange happened prior to them sitting down where the manager felt threaten in some way. We'll just never know. It is also ludicrous to say everyone saw what transpired from point a to z. Not true. How could a patron sitting down, drinking coffee, ever see what verbal exchange happened at the register?
No one is asking anyone to come dressed in a suit to have coffee. But people need to cognizant of their own appearance because it's the first thing anyone sees. If someone sees that individual dressed a certain way, that person may immediately make negative assumptions of that person in a particular way. Same thing when Obama said: "Pull your pants up!"
No reason why certain people have their pants hanging half off. I understand they want to come off hardcore and have street cred, but that equals getting treated a certain way. Just like no one would ever show up to job interview in grey sweatpants, but believe it or not...it happens.
I received a call for a potential candidate the other day and the person greeted me on the phone with: YO! I answered and she replied: I'm looking for any part time positions open. OMG!!! If I knew you were a live person I wouldn't have greeted you on the phone with YO! I politely accepted her resume, but as soon as the hiring manager heard what happened....the resume got thrown in the garbage. People have to be really aware of their presentation and how it can make someone feel.
Obviously in the Trayvon Martin case, the alleged cop felt a certain way by seeing sweatpants and a hoody. Negative connotations.
I agree with what you're saying to a point. Having watched the video and read numerous reports about the incident in Philadelphia, I think what happened was these two men came in dressed a certain way (I have to be frank in saying that they were dressed like crap considering that they were supposed to be real estate agents (I mean really who dresses like that for a business meeting?)), went and asked to use the bathroom and were told that they needed to buy something to do so or they were trespassing.
I believe that the way they were dressed definitely played a role in how they were treated. If they had just come in and waited for their friend and not have asked to use the bathroom, I think that perhaps we wouldn't have heard about this because let's face it, LOTS of people go into Starbucks and sit there for hours and don't order anything, but these two pressed the issue by asking to use the bathroom but refused to buy anything, so yes, technically they were trespassing, but I think they were also prejudged and likely viewed as a threat and that's a problem that happens in a lot of establishments. I see it all of the time as a young person.
Sometimes I go to places and the assumption is that I must be broke because I'm young or you can't afford that because you're young, and when you can, the person may become angry as a result out of envy. Starbucks is saying that they're going to retrain their employees, but people are people. You can re-train them all you want. If they have biases, no amount of training can change that.
Last edited by pierrepont7731; 04-17-2018 at 12:02 PM..
No, but it may depend on your appearance and attitude. If I'm dressed decently and politely ask, it's fine. If I looked like a bag lady and appeared to be drunk, the reaction might be different.
Don't feel one way or another about Starbucks, their coffee tastes burnt to me. All I can say is if I go into ANY coffee shop, buy something and find there is not place to sit because it's populated by non-paying customers, I'll never shop there again.
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