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Not saying adopt their programs, just saying that something needs to change in regards to what is going on here.
Yeah, but there are a lot of people saying, "Look at them. We need to do things more like them!"
No one will deny that having an educated population is important, but what people consider educated varies wildly.
Personally, if a kid in high school is absolutely horrible with maths, then I see no point continuing to force him to learn and test for advanced mathematical concepts he doesn't understand, and will never use in life beyond the classroom, just because it's required for standardized metrics. Give ALL students a class to learn how to balance a checkbook, manage their bank account, calculate tips and tax percentages, figure out and convert measurements, understand credit and debt and how it affects their income and lives.
I know all those things can be taught at home, and should be, but let's face it, many don't and won't. There there would be room in a school curriculum to teach life skills if the system wasn't so wrapped up in making sure students pass the countless standardized tests required, and leaving them dubiously "educated" upon graduation. A lot of traditional school subjects like the arts and social sciences are already being shoved to the side to make time for more teaching to the test.
Not saying adopt their programs, just saying that something needs to change in regards to what is going on here.
Adopt the Mandarin Chinese number system and train all kids to use it for mathematics.
I know that might sound weird, but my ex husband's first language was Mandarin and he swears it's easier to do math in Chinese (and he moved to the US in elementary school as a very young kid).
Of course, he also told me that they received corporal punishment if they didn't answer correctly while completing oral math problems in front of the class. Perhaps that improves kids' scores, too.
Go figure that one out.
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Yeah, but there are a lot of people saying, "Look at them. We need to do things more like them!"
No one will deny that having an educated population is important, but what people consider educated varies wildly.
Personally, if a kid in high school is absolutely horrible with maths, then I see no point continuing to force him to learn and test for advanced mathematical concepts he doesn't understand, and will never use in life beyond the classroom, just because it's required for standardized metrics. Give ALL students a class to learn how to balance a checkbook, manage their bank account, calculate tips and tax percentages, figure out and convert measurements, understand credit and debt and how it affects their income and lives.
I know all those things can be taught at home, and should be, but let's face it, many don't and won't. There there would be room in a school curriculum to teach life skills if the system wasn't so wrapped up in making sure students pass the countless standardized tests required, and leaving them dubiously "educated" upon graduation. A lot of traditional school subjects like the arts and social sciences are already being shoved to the side to make time for more teaching to the test.
This is a very fine post. I agree completely. I have never required the use of Calculus or even Advanced Algebra since I graduated with my BA. I daresay that this is the case for many people who are not mathematicians or engineers.
Finance math is something EVERYONE can use.
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When in doubt, check it out: FAQ
Yeah, but there are a lot of people saying, "Look at them. We need to do things more like them!"
No one will deny that having an educated population is important, but what people consider educated varies wildly.
Personally, if a kid in high school is absolutely horrible with maths, then I see no point continuing to force him to learn and test for advanced mathematical concepts he doesn't understand, and will never use in life beyond the classroom, just because it's required for standardized metrics. Give ALL students a class to learn how to balance a checkbook, manage their bank account, calculate tips and tax percentages, figure out and convert measurements, understand credit and debt and how it affects their income and lives.
I know all those things can be taught at home, and should be, but let's face it, many don't and won't. There there would be room in a school curriculum to teach life skills if the system wasn't so wrapped up in making sure students pass the countless standardized tests required, and leaving them dubiously "educated" upon graduation. A lot of traditional school subjects like the arts and social sciences are already being shoved to the side to make time for more teaching to the test.
My perspective is not to say hey lets do things like them, more so of we need to do things differently because they are not working.I will also like to add that there are other factors in regards to the state of education then no child left behind, race to the top, common core, etc. I agree with everything you have stated, when I went to school not every student was required to take the same courses. There were three different course pathways: College/University, Tech/Trade, and Workforce. Depending on which pathway you were on was the deciding factor of what courses you had to take.
I think another factor which ties into what you stated about understanding credit and debt, Is the growing debt issue in this country and how it will affects us and how we all(government, big business, and the people) had a hand in it. For years kids are told go to college, and you will get that big job, and now we have adults with 20K to over 100K worth of debt(Mortgage before having a mortgage) and a growing percentage of that generation are no longer seeing the value in education after either being unemployed or underemployed.
With the increase of financial aid comes the increase of debt, because often these loans if not student would be illegal or should be to give way more than what is actually needed, knowing that individual has no way of paying back that amount. You have students that don't understand the the fact that, that refund check if not a grant, is not your money, and is not something to go spending willy nilly. And the fact that the more and more students equals the less valuable that individuals degree is when there are millions with the same degree, and that they will need something else to set them apart. Many are no longer seeing the value of education, and statistically in areas where people do not, students perform poorer.
My perspective is not to say hey lets do things like them, more so of we need to do things differently because they are not working.I will also like to add that there are other factors in regards to the state of education then no child left behind, race to the top, common core, etc. I agree with everything you have stated, when I went to school not every student was required to take the same courses. There were three different course pathways: College/University, Tech/Trade, and Workforce. Depending on which pathway you were on was the deciding factor of what courses you had to take.
I think another factor which ties into what you stated about understanding credit and debt, Is the growing debt issue in this country and how it will affects us and how we all(government, big business, and the people) had a hand in it. For years kids are told go to college, and you will get that big job, and now we have adults with 20K to over 100K worth of debt(Mortgage before having a mortgage) and a growing percentage of that generation are no longer seeing the value in education after either being unemployed or underemployed.
With the increase of financial aid comes the increase of debt, because often these loans if not student would be illegal or should be to give way more than what is actually needed, knowing that individual has no way of paying back that amount. You have students that don't understand the the fact that, that refund check if not a grant, is not your money, and is not something to go spending willy nilly. And the fact that the more and more students equals the less valuable that individuals degree is when there are millions with the same degree, and that they will need something else to set them apart. Many are no longer seeing the value of education, and statistically in areas where people do not, students perform poorer.
Exactly! Not to mention that a lot of employers will tell you that a degree isn't worth anything if the person holding it is incapable of putting that knowledge to practical use in the workplace, or even how to function in a workplace, period. You hear ludicrous tales of kids bringing their parents to job interviews and other assorted nonsense. I have a friend who works as an academic administrator for a very prestigious university and some of the stories she has about admissions applications to their graduate program are both hilarious and also horrifyingly sad.
One thing that stands out to ME, from the list of better performers...
EVERY SINGLE nation that scores above us is highly homogeneous.
We, certainly, are not. Others may pussyfoot around the issue, but I won't. If we dumped minorities from our testing pool I'd bet our scores would be right up at the top.
Also keep in mind many countries "track" their kids in different ways from early. If you're German and not so good at math, you may be tracked into a trade school to learn a different skill set. Are you then going to take a math competency test in 12th grade? Probably not.
I don't think these graphs and stats tell the whole story.
Also, if you count post-high school, do we still spend less? In many developed countries college isn't a private cost to be borne by individuals... I notice the article you linked conveniently stops at high school.
One thing that stands out to ME, from the list of better performers...
EVERY SINGLE nation that scores above us is highly homogeneous.
We, certainly, are not. Others may pussyfoot around the issue, but I won't. If we dumped minorities from our testing pool I'd bet our scores would be right up at the top.
Also keep in mind many countries "track" their kids in different ways from early. If you're German and not so good at math, you may be tracked into a trade school to learn a different skill set. Are you then going to take a math competency test in 12th grade? Probably not.
I don't think these graphs and stats tell the whole story.
Also, if you count post-high school, do we still spend less? In many developed countries college isn't a private cost to be borne by individuals... I notice the article you linked conveniently stops at high school.
It's poverty that makes the biggest impact (which many minority groups fall into).
... if we only count the US schools with a student poverty rate of less than 10 percent, our students outperform the kids in China, Singapore, and yes, even Finland on the Programme for International Achievement tests in reading, the very benchmark tests that have caused corporate education reformers to shriek, "The Chinese are beating us!"
One thing that stands out to ME, from the list of better performers...
EVERY SINGLE nation that scores above us is highly homogeneous.
We, certainly, are not. Others may pussyfoot around the issue, but I won't. If we dumped minorities from our testing pool I'd bet our scores would be right up at the top.
LOL, you know I am a minority(Black and have always scored highly from the day I stepped in the classroom) and went to school where the demographics actually had a majority minority population(maybe 35% white, 35% black, 15% Hispanic, 15% Asian). I am pretty sure if they were to dump minorities from the testing pool the scores would drop not rise, not just at the school I attended but at schools across the country.
Further more being the largest group in the United States it is white children who make up the biggest percentage of our countries poor: NCCP | Poverty by the Numbers.
There are a lot of factors that come into play when you put poverty in to the mix: One of the biggest factors is when you have children living in a community that does not value education. This is why the drop out rates tend to be higher in areas where there is poverty.
At the same time, poverty or no poverty, when a child is growing up in a community where education is valued, they tend to perform well. For example, Nigeria has a poverty rate of 61%(BBC News - Nigerians living in poverty rise to nearly 61%). At the same time they are a people who value education and are able to come here and out perform their counterparts.
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