Who is OH voting for? (Cleveland, Clyde: student loans, rating, business)

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Summation of your post: there are levels of racists and you rationalize racist statements like ''the suitcase'' example. Well despite the revisionist history of the 2008 campaign, blacks abandoned the Clintons for the inexperienced Obama. So, Hillary is a latent racist since her language is tempered? Got it.

The Obama bandwagon really took off when Oprah endorsed him and he won Iowa. Iowa, adjacent to Illinois, deemed to be vanilla white yet gave Obama his first primary victory. Pretty much thereafter what Angela Merkel has called the ''Obama phenomana'' took off because white middle America farmers may not be as racist as we stereotyped because they voted for a black (well 1/2 black) man.

As far as white supremacist tweets by Trump, Obama has Black Lives Matter sitting at the table in the White House. Not surprised though given Obama's socialist south side Chicago roots.

Umm, Trump has been married to two foreign born immigrants to America...xenophobia?

With you and PerryMason fighting the good fight, I'm sure AAs will surely come around to Trump.

[PerryMason614]

Originally Posted by Kamms

white middle America farmers may not be as racist as we stereotyped because they voted for a black (well 1/2 black) man.

As far as white supremacist tweets by Trump, Obama has Black Lives Matter sitting at the table in the White House. Not surprised though given Obama's socialist south side Chicago roots.

Umm, Trump has been married to two foreign born immigrants to America...xenophobia?

And to show how stupid people are, most black Americans hail from Western Africa. Barack Hussein Obama hails from Eastern Africa. Kenyans look different, have a different color, have different religious and cultural traditions. Their neighbors the Ethiopians adopted Christianity before most of Europe did.

To say a Kenyan has anything to do with somebody from Western African is as silly as saying that Russians and Spaniards are the same people because they're both from Europe. Or that an Eskimo is the same as a Mexican since they are both North Americans.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by PerryMason614

And to show how stupid people are, most black Americans hail from Western Africa. Barack Hussein Obama hails from Eastern Africa. Kenyans look different, have a different color, have different religious and cultural traditions. Their neighbors the Ethiopians adopted Christianity before most of Europe did.

To say a Kenyan has anything to do with somebody from Western African is as silly as saying that Russians and Spaniards are the same people because they're both from Europe. Or that an Eskimo is the same as a Mexican since they are both North Americans.

So you're a birther too, huh.

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Summation of your post: there are levels of racists and you rationalize racist statements like ''the suitcase'' example. Well despite the revisionist history of the 2008 campaign, blacks abandoned the Clintons for the inexperienced Obama. So, Hillary is a latent racist since her language is tempered? Got it.

The Obama bandwagon really took off when Oprah endorsed him and he won Iowa. Iowa, adjacent to Illinois, deemed to be vanilla white yet gave Obama his first primary victory. Pretty much thereafter what Angela Merkel has called the ''Obama phenomana'' took off because white middle America farmers may not be as racist as we stereotyped because they voted for a black (well 1/2 black) man.

As far as white supremacist tweets by Trump, Obama has Black Lives Matter sitting at the table in the White House. Not surprised though given Obama's socialist south side Chicago roots.

Umm, Trump has been married to two foreign born immigrants to America...xenophobia?

Quick amend: ''married to two foreign born legal immigrants to America...''

To add: I love the media left pundits posing the question: ''so you anti-illegal immigration?'' As if there is a pro- and anti- position on illegal immigration. ''So, are you for breaking the immigration laws?''

The winner of yesterday's media pundit dunce cap award is Tamron Hall, of NBC/MSNCS.

Trying to dig into Scott Baio by making a comparison that those complaining about Obama Phones (they've even tagged free phones as Obama Phones) should give up their Social Security and Medicare benefits. This from a college graduate.

New levels of idiocy in the media yet unleashed on the public believing this comparison. The dumbing down of America continues at the hands of the ''media''.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Quick amend: ''married to two foreign born legal immigrants to America...''

To add: I love the media left pundits posing the question: ''so you anti-illegal immigration?'' As if there is a pro- and anti- position on illegal immigration. ''So, are you for breaking the immigration laws?''

The winner of yesterday's media pundit dunce cap award is Tamron Hall, of NBC/MSNCS.

Trying to dig into Scott Baio by making a comparison that those complaining about Obama Phones (they've even tagged free phones as Obama Phones) should give up their Social Security and Medicare benefits. This from a college graduate.

New levels of idiocy in the media yet unleashed on the public believing this comparison. The dumbing down of America continues at the hands of the ''media''.

I am pro immigration. It is objectively beneficial to the US economy. In terms of illegal immigration, I am pro path to citizenship (with some sort of consequences) and policy based in reason and empathy. Republicans support neither reason nor empathy on this issue. It's all about spite and revenge, and I know we can do better. I am not touching the rest of your stream-of-consciousness post.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

I am pro immigration. It is objectively beneficial to the US economy. In terms of illegal immigration, I am pro path to citizenship (with some sort of consequences) and policy based in reason and empathy. Republicans support neither reason nor empathy on this issue. It's all about spite and revenge, and I know we can do better. I am not touching the rest of your stream-of-consciousness post.

You and I actually do agree here!

Although I'd prefer to have more or less open immigration accompanied by a complete obliteration of any welfare or benefits (much like how your and my grandparents came to the USA), I feel this is a good starting off point. In my last job, I dealt extensively with immigrants, more than a few illegal ones. Among the illegals: an eye doctor from Russia working under the table as a model, an engineer from Brazil working under the table as a cleaner, an engineer from Thailand working under the table as a waitress, and a construction worker from Guatemala who came here illegally twice, the second time trying to get his 17 year old daughter in (both of them were arrested and sent to detention in Texas apart from each other for a month).

My point is, the Republicans only focus on, say, Mexican drug dealers and possible ISIS sympathizers. You can share those concerns without assigning blame to all immigrants. A lot of them come to this country and find it objectively better than where they are from and will endure some very tough circumstances to be able to stay and hopefully one day be a citizen.

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

You and I actually do agree here!

Although I'd prefer to have more or less open immigration accompanied by a complete obliteration of any welfare or benefits (much like how your and my grandparents came to the USA), I feel this is a good starting off point. In my last job, I dealt extensively with immigrants, more than a few illegal ones. Among the illegals: an eye doctor from Russia working under the table as a model, an engineer from Brazil working under the table as a cleaner, an engineer from Thailand working under the table as a waitress, and a construction worker from Guatemala who came here illegally twice, the second time trying to get his 17 year old daughter in (both of them were arrested and sent to detention in Texas apart from each other for a month).

My point is, the Republicans only focus on, say, Mexican drug dealers and possible ISIS sympathizers. You can share those concerns without assigning blame to all immigrants. A lot of them come to this country and find it objectively better than where they are from and will endure some very tough circumstances to be able to stay and hopefully one day be a citizen.

That's the whole point of the legal immigrant process: a lot of them come to this country and endure tough circumstances to be, hopefully, a legal citizen.

What's the point of the legal process when you can come in illegally or over stay your legal stay when all will be forgiven in the end and you'll be a citizen anyway?

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

You and I actually do agree here!

Although I'd prefer to have more or less open immigration accompanied by a complete obliteration of any welfare or benefits (much like how your and my grandparents came to the USA), I feel this is a good starting off point. In my last job, I dealt extensively with immigrants, more than a few illegal ones. Among the illegals: an eye doctor from Russia working under the table as a model, an engineer from Brazil working under the table as a cleaner, an engineer from Thailand working under the table as a waitress, and a construction worker from Guatemala who came here illegally twice, the second time trying to get his 17 year old daughter in (both of them were arrested and sent to detention in Texas apart from each other for a month).

My point is, the Republicans only focus on, say, Mexican drug dealers and possible ISIS sympathizers. You can share those concerns without assigning blame to all immigrants. A lot of them come to this country and find it objectively better than where they are from and will endure some very tough circumstances to be able to stay and hopefully one day be a citizen.

I would like to see a path to citizenship for illegals that has some sort of civic assignment to the process. They could be given several options, like community service, military service, etc. It represents both a consequence, but also a chance to improve their new local communities and serve their new country (this should probably be applied to natural-born citizens as well, frankly). Immigrants in general are already largely just decent people trying to make it, so I have never really understood the strong motivations to punish them when they could instead be valuable, contributing members to American society.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Kamms

That's the whole point of the legal immigrant process: a lot of them come to this country and endure tough circumstances to be, hopefully, a legal citizen.

What's the point of the legal process when you can come in illegally or over stay your legal stay when all will be forgiven in the end and you'll be a citizen anyway?

There isn't that much difference between someone staying legally and going through the system vs. someone staying illegally except a lot of paperwork. If an immigrant is in the US, stays out of trouble and works hard, I see no reason to punish them for making a very difficult decision like being an illegal. A little common sense goes a long way on this issue, yet people seem to prefer to fly into blind rages over it and propose ridiculous things like giant, expensive border walls that have no chance of working. I'm pretty cynical, but that's way above my pay grade.

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

There isn't that much difference between someone staying legally and going through the system vs. someone staying illegally except a lot of paperwork. If an immigrant is in the US, stays out of trouble and works hard, I see no reason to punish them for making a very difficult decision like being an illegal. A little common sense goes a long way on this issue, yet people seem to prefer to fly into blind rages over it and propose ridiculous things like giant, expensive border walls that have no chance of working. I'm pretty cynical, but that's way above my pay grade.

Conveniently not mentioning that staying in or entering the country illegally is breaking the law. We're supposed to be a country of laws; how can violating the entry laws be a basis for citizenship? Why have laws?