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Wells5: I need to blow the whistle on one theory of intelligence that you pooh-poohed.
"Multiple intelligences" do exist. Spatial, verbal, emotional and mechanical intelligence are all distinct and observable if not quantifiable.
I tend to score high on tests of "general intelligence" (the last time I took an IQ test, I scored 135). I am able to "read" houses by looking at photos of the rooms and noting where elements in other rooms are located, and once I've driven around an area, its roads and features usually imprint themselves in my brain to the point where I don't need GPS to navigate it the next time (I was and am a good map reader as well).
But while I can assemble IKEA furniture and a simple stereo setup, the surround-sound stereo I recently acquired has defeated me when it comes to either getting it to output sound to my two stereo speakers or getting its remote to work with it properly. And I think I read the owner's manual. Put me under the hood of a car and I'd be hard-pressed to tell you where the connections among the various systems are. So I have to conclude that my mechanical intelligence is not as strong as my verbal and spatial intelligences are.
And it's something of a truism that people who score highly on IQ tests lack many of the social graces, are outright socially awkward, or can be placed somewhere along the autism spectrum.
Can some of these deficits be fixed with education? Yes. But we need to know what the deficits are before we can fix them, and "multiple intelligence" helps us learn what they are.
Location: The Flagship City and Vacation in the Paris of Appalachia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessie Mitchell
Hardly anyone wants to go into teaching anymore and those that do rarely last 5 years. School districts are begging for teachers. Let's make sure they don't get a competitive salary. That will help.
Your point is spot on here and Pennsylvania currently has a critical teacher shortage. There seems to also be a perception by some in Pennsylvania that teachers are overpaid. I was shocked when I went to Aldi recently and I saw a local teacher I know working there and I asked if she was working a second job. She told me no and that she had quit her previous teaching job as she is making more money with less stress working at Aldi. I have included some snippets of an article I read recently about this issue that add to the conversation here and I wonder how the increase in emergency teaching permits may influence the quality of education in Pennsylvania.
Teachers had once been an export of the Keystone State. That's no longer the case.
New teacher certificates fell 64% in the past decade, dropping from 21,045 issued in 2010-11 to 7,695 in 2020-21, according to data from the Pennsylvania Department of Education. When isolating certifications from in-state programs, the decline within that same period is just as steep: from 15,031 to 5,440.
In 2020-21, the first full year of school during the COVID-19 pandemic, the number of emergency certifications issued for long-term substitutes totaled 5,958. The figure doesn't include day-to-day substitutes.
"I was shocked by that. That one data point really tells you that school districts are having a very difficult time finding enough teachers," said Ed Fuller of Penn State University, who included the data in a fresh analysis of the ongoing teacher shortage in Pennsylvania.
Emergency permits were most common for English as a second language, computer science, career and technical education and special education. Candidates must have a bachelor's degree from a state-approved institution — there are exceptions for career and technical instruction, school nurses and dental hygienists — but it doesn't have to be in education.
Those working under an emergency permit, according to Fuller, were most likely to be employed in schools in poor districts, rural districts and those with high enrollment of Black students.
Are you seriously against a common sense measure for professional development?
So a teacher should just earn a degree, and that's it for 50 years? In a world with constantly changing information and better methods for teaching? Please explain how that makes any sense.
It sounds like you have quite a fundamental misunderstanding of the teaching profession. Most of those who vilify teachers unions have literally no clue what it's actually like to be a teacher.
Your criticism of the "salary scale" also defies understanding of market forces. Like every other human being, teachers will go where they're valued and appreciated. If the market demands that the salary should increase to attract and retain the best and the brightest, then that's exactly what should be prioritized. That's the "free market" that's so widely acclaimed by conservatives.
At its core, your fundamental concern about "saving money" and "easing regulations" are pound-wise and penny-foolish if they come at the expense of school and teacher quality, but that rarely factors into the economic equation for school budget critics.
I agree with all of this. There are SO many opportunities to cut out pork and unnecessary spending that do not involve reducing salaries or ongoing development. The profession has changed so much since I was a kid (I went to K-12 school in the mid 90s thru 2010). I hope the good people of Pennsylvania do not want our public school quality to match that of so many of those Deep South states.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BPP1999
I can agree with this. While we’re at it, can we tame the belligerent trades unions as well, that cause places like Philadelphia to have “New York level construction costs and Baltimore-level rents”? I have seen neither party in PA work to change the stranglehold that unions have on this state. Mastriano might, but with his election-denying and Christian Nationalism crap plus his abortion stance, he is a non-starter for me.
More importantly, though, is that a transition from personal property taxes will likely lead to an increase in the state income tax, which pushes the burden of funding further towards workers, as retirees here already pay no state income tax on Social Security, pensions, IRA’s, 401(k)’s, etc.
It's interesting, because my mom was a teacher for decades before becoming an administrator. She had HUGE problems with the union at her school, but still believed in their importance. Why? Teachers are already so fundamentally misunderstood and undervalued in American culture (relative to so much of the 'developed' world) that she knew their existence is one of the key pieces that makes the profession at all an appealing pursuit. She wanted change with the union in her district, but not absolute dissolution.
I work at a public charter in Philadelphia. I have no union. My school has a great community, and I like my administrators, so I haven't felt the *need* for a union, but I probably really would not mind one, especially if the union leader were sensible.
My first year teaching here was near-nightmare level. It is almost always that hard learning how to become an effective teacher, especially when learning to be so in an underfunded public school. Now I am basically a veteran, at least by SPD standards where teachers are put through the ringer and so few make it past five years. I love my profession and I love my students, but it took me a few years of hard work to really hone in my craft. Now I am wondering: where is my reward for laboring so hard for years? Where is my reward for being a curricular expert and a master classroom manager? We need to treat teachers more like those in professions in the top of the medical field: learning to become an effective one takes years, so the salary needs to exponentially grow with experience as to make those initial years worthwhile. We need to reward experienced and expert teachers.
I plan to one day leave Philadelphia. I *love* this city, but to teach here, I have to put all myself into my craft, and then some. I in fact enjoy having a job in which I put in all of myself. But, what I really don't enjoy is that I am rewarded by being paid *significantly* less than both my tech bro friend and pharmacist friend, both of whom will be the first to admit that when we compare our work days, I hauled a** way harder than them -- especially my tech bro friend, lol. When I leave, I plan to go to a cushier school district with a union. Not because I can't keep up in Philadelphia. Not at all. I love my students. But, it is because I know I am not rewarded enough for my expertise and the hard work I put in every day teaching 27 wonderful but challenging students.
The unfortunate truth about so many Americans (not necessarily most, and I certainly hope not most), is that they have the egotistical belief that because they grew up in the classroom, they know exactly how hard or easy it is to be a teacher. Like almost everything in life, there is a *lot* more to it than a layman can see. And it's odd, because I don't think many people who go to the hospital feel that way about doctors or nurses, etc.
Please don't lament about my summers. I have worked service jobs nearly every summer for supplemental income. The few summers I have chosen to travel or help my mom with her house, ofc I was struggling even more with money. I'd easily choose to work twelve months per year to make a salary worthy of the demands of the job.
Also, please don't tell me if it's so bad, then I should leave. If that's what you got from that, you misunderstood. I enjoy teaching, but will leave the profession if it gets much worse. I could easily get a comfy yet boring job at a curriculum company. I'd be much more bored, but maybe one day it will be worth it. I don't need to be told if I should leave or not. I am just explaining why the country is bleeding teachers, for those who care.
So, I don't think the teachers unions are by far our biggest obstacle in Pennsylvania. Actually, I'd be in favor of union reform, because from stories I understand from my mom, they absolutely can be corrupt. But like so many things, it is not a black/white issue. Teachers unions are also one of the few remaining things that make the profession appealing. In sum, teacher working conditions are student learning conditions.
Also, yes, for the record, I am a gay man working in a public school in Pennsylvania. Wells5, if Mastriano is elected governor, PLEASE call him up to report me. I'll be first in line to square up.
Also, yes, for the record, I am a gay man working in a public school in Pennsylvania. Wells5, if Mastriano is elected governor, PLEASE call him up to report me. I'll be first in line to square up.
Can't +1 you for your story, so I'll do so via this post.
And frankly, Mastriano also represents a trend within the GOP these days that's growing rather than shrinking. Something tells me that the Log Cabin Republicans have been, um, emasculated on the subject.
Can't +1 you for your story, so I'll do so via this post.
And frankly, Mastriano also represents a trend within the GOP these days that's growing rather than shrinking. Something tells me that the Log Cabin Republicans have been, um, emasculated on the subject.
Yeah, but I don't think most of them go as far as openly admitting they want to overturn Obergefell and outlaw same-sex marriage as does Mastriano. But I think a growing contingency, probably a majority of them, would think that if I had a framed photo of my partner and me in my classroom, that would count as "grooming."
I can agree with this. While we’re at it, can we tame the belligerent trades unions as well, that cause places like Philadelphia to have “New York level construction costs and Baltimore-level rents”? I have seen neither party in PA work to change the stranglehold that unions have on this state. Mastriano might, but with his election-denying and Christian Nationalism crap plus his abortion stance, he is a non-starter for me.
Unions are imperfect and could be improved in a number of ways (I say this as an individual who's been in a public sector union). But that doesn't mean they're useless and should necessarily be "squashed." There should always be a reasonable give-and-take.
Mastriano's ilk are also pushing to turn schools into "big brother" by attempting to monitor every single thing a teacher says by banishing all references to the existence of homosexuality, or prohibiting acknowledgement of the existence of racism, because that's "liberal wokeness." And pushing for book bans that are completely counter to freedom of thought.
He literally wants a real life version of the "The Handmaid's Tale." Yeah, that's great for the attraction and retention of teachers.
And frankly, Mastriano also represents a trend within the GOP these days that's growing rather than shrinking. Something tells me that the Log Cabin Republicans have been, um, emasculated on the subject.
The Log Cabin Republicans' website only has 4 endorsements for Senate candidates. I'm not sure what their purpose is, if they can only manage 4 endorsements out of 34 candidates. And they endorsed Sarah Palin in her unsuccessful House run this time around, so riddle me that.
And I disagree that the GOP is getting "less gay-friendly". I was watching the RNC convention in 2016 when the Orange Lord said something positive about gays and got a rousing ovation. He openly marveled at that kind of ovation specifically at a GOP convention. I can't find video of that, but here's video of Peter Thiel getting a standing U!S!A! ovation at the same convention. I didn't know Thiel was gay -- he's not introduced as a Gay Billionaire when interviewed on business news shows -- and probably most people at the convention didn't know either.
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