Broad Street Subway Extension

[cpomp]

Originally Posted by BPP1999

I support this as well. What I think will happen, though, is that it will go nowhere, like many other legitimate transit expansions in this region (West Chester, Pottstown, Quakertown, MFL in the Northeast, etc.). When it fails, will we, as a region, collectively call out our state and local political and business leaders (or SEPTA) for their lack of action or interest on this? I doubt it. But we'll watch with our thumbs up our you-know-what's while similar projects are advanced in other parts of the country.

This may actually happen in our lifetimes and King of Prussia.


All, Wouldn't light rail make sense for the Navy Yard, a heck of a lot cheaper and quicker to build.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by cpomp

This may actually happen in our lifetimes and King of Prussia.


All, Wouldn't light rail make sense for the Navy Yard, a heck of a lot cheaper and quicker to build.

You actually want a light rail only going 1.5 miles?

None of it will happen in MY lifetime.

[MikeNigh]

Originally Posted by cpomp

This may actually happen in our lifetimes and King of Prussia.


All, Wouldn't light rail make sense for the Navy Yard, a heck of a lot cheaper and quicker to build.

Imo we need to quit all these switches. The trolleys to 13th instead of just to 30th and the MFL between 30th and 15th wasn't just a colossal mistake but more like a game over mistake. Too many of those and the norris town high speed line not having track that the MFL could have used are game over mistakes in the long run for the city. It's not going to pay off to be cheap.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by MikeNigh

Imo we need to quit all these switches. The trolleys to 13th instead of just to 30th and the MFL between 30th and 15th wasn't just a colossal mistake but more like a game over mistake. Too many of those and the norris town high speed line not having track that the MFL could have used are game over mistakes in the long run for the city. It's not going to pay off to be cheap.

Maybe before your time or your time in Phila. but before Septa got the current Rt 100 cars, in the 90s, they wore running modified M3 Budd(almond joy) single cars from the EL fleet to Norristown. So the track must be the same gage between the two.

Also surely you know that before Septa existed all transit in the area was run by private companies. PTC. Red Arrow. P&W. Separate fares between the El and P&W when I was a kid. No transfers available. So many of things that look so obviously wrong now were maybe not workable in those days.

[southbound_295]

Originally Posted by kyb01

Maybe before your time or your time in Phila. but before Septa got the current Rt 100 cars, in the 90s, they wore running modified M3 Budd(almond joy) single cars from the EL fleet to Norristown. So the track must be the same gage between the two.

Also surely you know that before Septa existed all transit in the area was run by private companies. PTC. Red Arrow. P&W. Separate fares between the El and P&W when I was a kid. No transfers available. So many of things that look so obviously wrong now were maybe not workable in those days.

Red Arrow also provided the bus service in South Jersey.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by southbound_295

Red Arrow also provided the bus service in South Jersey.

I didn't know that. Interesting.

[southbound_295]

Originally Posted by kyb01

I didn't know that. Interesting.

The "statewide" bus service in NJ did not exist in South Jersey until Red Arrow folded. All tax money that was appropriate for public transportation was diverted to North Jersey to build their system. That is part of the reason for the rancor that I'm sure that you are aware of between north & south. You also probably remember when South Jersey tried to secede from NJ.

I saw a thread on a similar website of pictures of Philadelphia. It included maps of the pre-SEPTA system. Those maps showed a "high speed" line into Camden that was obviously what is now the PATCO high speed line.

[PhillyPhan95]

I'm not surprised this proposal is coming shortly after the recent discussion about expanding the Port down at the Navy Yard as well. Philly mayoral candidates debate port expansion - philly-archives

IMO the Navy Yard could be VERY successful if both projects are undertaken. Then all of the sudden in one place, you have thousands (think 40,000) of Blue and White Collar jobs located in one place that is accessible to the city's main transit line. It's the perfect place for suburban companies who may eventually want to relocate back into the city in order to stay competitive in attracting well-educated young people, but don't want to make the leap to being in hustle and bustle of Center City. Broad Street then is going to be a much more attractive place to live. The economic benefits could be huge. It may seem like a small thing, but this is exactly the sort of project that needs to be undertaken for Philadelphia to be take seriously as a world class city.

[rotodome]

Originally Posted by PhillyPhan95

I'm not surprised this proposal is coming shortly after the recent discussion about expanding the Port down at the Navy Yard as well. Philly mayoral candidates debate port expansion - philly-archives

IMO the Navy Yard could be VERY successful if both projects are undertaken. Then all of the sudden in one place, you have thousands (think 40,000) of Blue and White Collar jobs located in one place that is accessible to the city's main transit line. It's the perfect place for suburban companies who may eventually want to relocate back into the city in order to stay competitive in attracting well-educated young people, but don't want to make the leap to being in hustle and bustle of Center City. Broad Street then is going to be a much more attractive place to live. The economic benefits could be huge. It may seem like a small thing, but this is exactly the sort of project that needs to be undertaken for Philadelphia to be take seriously as a world class city.

The reason companies don't locate in Center City is not because of an aversion to hustle and bustle, it's because they don't want to pay business taxes.
The Navy Yard (along with most recent large scale commercial developments in and around Center City), comes with lots of tax breaks and incentives.
In many cases, such as the aforementioned GSK, companies have moved from other locations in the City to the new incentivized locations just to pay less taxes. If companies actually move into the city from the burbs, then this would be a win.

[PhillyPhan95]

I agree that companies don't want to move to the city because of the business tax. I know that there is a group of city politicians and business leaders that are working to change the tax structure to tax commercial real estate rather than the business on said real estate. These sorts of things don't happen overnight of course, but I believe sometime in the next 5 years it will implemented.

Report: Philly could gain jobs with tax restructuring - philly-archives

Also, speaking of the port, this recent report by CBRE said that Philadelphia is poised to become a "global logistics hub." If we build it, they will come... I agree though, we do need to make the tax change first. Philadelphia really does have all the tools to reclaim its spot as one of the premier destinations in the U.S.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-next...ubs-1447969941