HOA Community standards (for sale, renter, insurance)

[AnthemBaron]

Valle Venado HOA just enacted a rule requiring Landlords to "register" their tenants. Required is: a $50.00 non refundable fee; Tenant registration form, including a signature acknowledging receipt of the Community Standards and Rules; a copy of the lease between landlord and tenant; copy of the Certificate of Insurance by the tenant insuring their furnishings. I feel this is a violation of tenants right of privacy (lease info) and establishes a mandate to purchase renters insurance (like the Obamacare mandate now before the US Supreme Ct.
I know of NO other HOA requiring this 'registration' Anyone else in AZ know of this?
AnthemBaron

[observer53]

I'm not sure it's any of the HOA's business whether the renter has insurance on their "stuff" inside the home, or how much it's insured for. Do they regulate whether/how the contents are insured when the home is not rented, but owner occupied? Making sure the tenants know the rules makes sense, and basic "registration" so the HOA knows who's living in the house is one thing, but some of this does seem a bit much.

[Zippyman]

It's pretty common for hoas to step over the line of reasonableness, the only way to keep them in check is to file suit, and they know how much that costs, so they certainly aren't afraid of overstepping.

That said, as a landlord I require renters to have their own coverage & to add me to that policy as a named insured. It isn't socialism, or "Obama gone wild", it's for the protection of both parties- if the tenants dog bites someone, and the tenant isn't insured, I'm the deep pockets the victim is going to sue. And in the event of a theft of the tenant's property, my standard rental policy only covers $1,000 of *my stuff* ( not the tenant's stuff!), less a $1,000 deductible.

Tenant policies are cheap, it isn't worth arguing about, which is probably why the hoa feels they can get away with it.

The tenant doesn't have a right to privacy, the landlord signed that away when they signed the cc&rs.

Hoas aren't "the government", and they are exempt from laws that hold the government in check. They can do whatever the law doesn't specifically prohibit, and right now, about the only things the law keeps them from doing are banning flags and for sale signs, and hanging a satellite dish. Other than that, the sky's the limit, until someone sues & wins, they can do whatever they want to do.

[Jkgourmet]

We just rented property in NC where it is standard practice to require tenants to show proof of insurance -but it was LIABILITY insurance they required. They don't care if I insure my stuff. So our liability umbrella policy will satisfy this requirement as soon as I add the new address to my insurance policy.

I'm betting that is what the HOA is looking for -renters liability coverage, not renters contents coverage.

[MotleyCrew]

Originally Posted by AnthemBaron

Valle Venado HOA just enacted a rule requiring Landlords to "register" their tenants. Required is: a $50.00 non refundable fee; Tenant registration form, including a signature acknowledging receipt of the Community Standards and Rules; a copy of the lease between landlord and tenant; copy of the Certificate of Insurance by the tenant insuring their furnishings. I feel this is a violation of tenants right of privacy (lease info) and establishes a mandate to purchase renters insurance (like the Obamacare mandate now before the US Supreme Ct.
I know of NO other HOA requiring this 'registration' Anyone else in AZ know of this?
AnthemBaron

We paid $100 in Vistancia to register our tenants. The HOA has the right to know who is living in the home and how many are living there. We also provide a copy of the lease agreement. Insuring their stuff is their business and that is a bit odd.

[Zippyman]

Originally Posted by MotleyCrew

We paid $100 in Vistancia to register our tenants. The HOA has the right to know who is living in the home and how many are living there. We also provide a copy of the lease agreement. Insuring their stuff is their business and that is a bit odd.

I suspect the issue is liability, as mentioned above- I. E., community park and a tenant's dog bites someone. If the tenant is insured, no big deal, if not, everyone in the association could be on the hook, "jointly and severally", as owners of that park.

[Captain Bill]

Originally Posted by AnthemBaron

Valle Venado HOA just enacted a rule requiring Landlords to "register" their tenants. Required is: a $50.00 non refundable fee; Tenant registration form, including a signature acknowledging receipt of the Community Standards and Rules; a copy of the lease between landlord and tenant; copy of the Certificate of Insurance by the tenant insuring their furnishings. I feel this is a violation of tenants right of privacy (lease info) and establishes a mandate to purchase renters insurance (like the Obamacare mandate now before the US Supreme Ct.
I know of NO other HOA requiring this 'registration' Anyone else in AZ know of this?
AnthemBaron

Our HOA require owners to register their tenants, and charge a $75 fee.
The owner has to sign over their rights to the clubhouse amenities to the tenant, and that is what the fee is for; cost of transferring the docs. The HOA CC&R's require the owner to register any tenants.

The owner is responsible for any violations the tenant causes, therefore, the owner is responsible for getting the documents to the tenant.

Any landlord should require the tenant to have renters insurance and provide the landlord with the proof of insurance.

Whether the HOA has the right to require that is questionable.

However, all tenants should have renters insurance because the landlord policy is not going to cover the tenants property. It will only cover the landlords property.

[Steve Pickering]

Originally Posted by MotleyCrew

We paid $100 in Vistancia to register our tenants. The HOA has the right to know who is living in the home and how many are living there. We also provide a copy of the lease agreement. Insuring their stuff is their business and that is a bit odd.

Why? It's your home. How it looks is one thing, but who can live in your home is your business. Sounds like a way to do racial profiling to me. Call the DOJ and tell the HOA to pack sand.

[jimj]

Originally Posted by Captain Bill

Our HOA require owners to register their tenants, and charge a $75 fee.
The owner has to sign over their rights to the clubhouse amenities to the tenant, and that is what the fee is for; cost of transferring the docs. The HOA CC&R's require the owner to register any tenants.

The owner is responsible for any violations the tenant causes, therefore, the owner is responsible for getting the documents to the tenant.

Any landlord should require the tenant to have renters insurance and provide the landlord with the proof of insurance.

Whether the HOA has the right to require that is questionable.

However, all tenants should have renters insurance because the landlord policy is not going to cover the tenants property. It will only cover the landlords property.

This kind of sets off alarms in my head and brings up a couple of questions. I can understand having new tenants signal that they've received the rules and that they understand they'll be held to them but that's about as far as I go. Insurance? Well, unless you have a loan on your house there's nothing requiring you to have insurance. Now a landlord requiring liability coverage makes sense but it's truly none of the HOA's business as their recourse is only with the "owner". They can't fine the tenants and the tenants have no vote in the HOA right?
Unless the HOA can decline to allow a particular tenant to occupy a house then what the lease says and any personal information on said lease is really none of their business.
So, here's the questions that hit my mind.
1. Can the HOA tell a landlord who they may or may not rent to? Let's say they get a copy of the lease and decide to run a back ground check on the tenant and don't like what they see?
2.On most leases I've seen there's at least one SSI number given is that redacted?
3.Cities and County's have occupancy laws as in how many bodies may reside in a SFR, again this falls to the owner as the responsible party for violations. Does this mean the HOA will be motivated to sit outside and do a head count if they don't like the tenant and adjust their numbers however they wish?

To me, the HOA authority "should" stop at the outside of the house, the minute you let 'em inside you're violating all sorts of privacy.

[Zippyman]

Originally Posted by jimj

This kind of sets off alarms in my head and brings up a couple of questions. I can understand having new tenants signal that they've received the rules and that they understand they'll be held to them but that's about as far as I go. Insurance? Well, unless you have a loan on your house there's nothing requiring you to have insurance. Now a landlord requiring liability coverage makes sense but it's truly none of the HOA's business as their recourse is only with the "owner". They can't fine the tenants and the tenants have no vote in the HOA right?
Unless the HOA can decline to allow a particular tenant to occupy a house then what the lease says and any personal information on said lease is really none of their business.
So, here's the questions that hit my mind.
1. Can the HOA tell a landlord who they may or may not rent to? Let's say they get a copy of the lease and decide to run a back ground check on the tenant and don't like what they see?
2.On most leases I've seen there's at least one SSI number given is that redacted?
3.Cities and County's have occupancy laws as in how many bodies may reside in a SFR, again this falls to the owner as the responsible party for violations. Does this mean the HOA will be motivated to sit outside and do a head count if they don't like the tenant and adjust their numbers however they wish?

To me, the HOA authority "should" stop at the outside of the house, the minute you let 'em inside you're violating all sorts of privacy.

Again, the hoa isn't the government, then can crawl as far into your business as the cc&rs the owners sign allow. Can they count your tenants? Yes. Can they require everyone in the development to wear speedos to the hoa meetings? Yes, if it's in the cc&rs. There is no legal limit to how intrusive they can be, except in case law, and those cc&rs. Don't like it, don't sign. Those are your choices.