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I was at Westgate last night. That makes it the 3rd time this month. If Westgate was in Gilbert or Chandler, I would never go there. So as others have pointed out, proximity is paramount. I am not a fan of government subsidizing stadiums. But the city of Glendale wanted to attract revenue to the area versus an exclusive bedroom community. It took me 10 minutes to find a parking spot. Even single spot was filled including the outreaching restaurants like Gordon Biersch. I luckily found a spot 1/4 mile away. I didn't go to the game. I went there because I love the Westgate look and feel.
The key to making their business model work is to get people there for venues other than hockey. It seems they are attracting more quality concerts, and shows. That's what will pull them in the black.
As the West Valley grows, more and more business will be attracted to the area and more people will go to Glendale. The reality is I'm not driving to Gilbert and visa versa. I realize there is more $$'s on the east side. But something big was needed on the westside and I am intentionally supporting that area. I'll be there again in a couple of weeks.
I was at Westgate last night. That makes it the 3rd time this month. If Westgate was in Gilbert or Chandler, I would never go there. So as others have pointed out, proximity is paramount. I am not a fan of government subsidizing stadiums. But the city of Glendale wanted to attract revenue to the area versus an exclusive bedroom community. It took me 10 minutes to find a parking spot. Even single spot was filled including the outreaching restaurants like Gordon Biersch. I luckily found a spot 1/4 mile away. I didn't go to the game. I went there because I love the Westgate look and feel.
The key to making their business model work is to get people there for venues other than hockey. It seems they are attracting more quality concerts, and shows. That's what will pull them in the black.
As the West Valley grows, more and more business will be attracted to the area and more people will go to Glendale. The reality is I'm not driving to Gilbert and visa versa. I realize there is more $$'s on the east side. But something big was needed on the westside and I am intentionally supporting that area. I'll be there again in a couple of weeks.
I couldn't agree more. We've seen two sold-out concerts at Westgage that were spectacular and we enjoy the close proximity (We live in Litchfield Park) to a group of restaurants and the vibe of Westgage as a whole. Anytime friends or family come to visit, we make a trip there to see it and they have their pick of restaurants. If it was located in the East Valley, I would never go. Not supporting the hockey is one thing as I really don't care about hockey, but not supporting the businesses in that area if you live in the west valley is pretty ridiculous. We don't need more abandoned buildings over here in what my east valley friends call, "Ghetto Westside."
I couldn't agree more. We've seen two sold-out concerts at Westgage that were spectacular and we enjoy the close proximity (We live in Litchfield Park) to a group of restaurants and the vibe of Westgage as a whole. Anytime friends or family come to visit, we make a trip there to see it and they have their pick of restaurants. If it was located in the East Valley, I would never go. Not supporting the hockey is one thing as I really don't care about hockey, but not supporting the businesses in that area if you live in the west valley is pretty ridiculous. We don't need more abandoned buildings over here in what my east valley friends call, "Ghetto Westside."
^^^ +1
We go every time we are in town, often to see the Coyotes play, but sometimes just for dinner. I think they have done a fantastic job with Westgate - we have taken friends from Calgary with us and they love it. They all say the same thing "why don't we have something like this in Calgary?"
I have never been a supporter of tax payer money funding millionaires (both owners and players) - but what's done is done and as someone who lives "just inside" the boundaries of Glendale I intend to support the area to the best of my ability. I fully agree that if it was on the "east side" we wouldn't go either... so I guess it works both ways.
We go every time we are in town, often to see the Coyotes play, but sometimes just for dinner. I think they have done a fantastic job with Westgate - we have taken friends from Calgary with us and they love it. They all say the same thing "why don't we have something like this in Calgary?"
I have never been a supporter of tax payer money funding millionaires (both owners and players) - but what's done is done and as someone who lives "just inside" the boundaries of Glendale I intend to support the area to the best of my ability. I fully agree that if it was on the "east side" we wouldn't go either... so I guess it works both ways.
+2. We go to Westgate frequently and not for hockey. I love the look of the place with the huge LED signs, the fountains, and the bars and restaurants all grouped together. It is one of the best places in the metro to take visitors. They are always impressed. In my book it is a much better destination than downtown or "Mill". A winning hockey team and a first class casino nearby would do wonders for the area.
+2. We go to Westgate frequently and not for hockey. I love the look of the place with the huge LED signs, the fountains, and the bars and restaurants all grouped together. It is one of the best places in the metro to take visitors. They are always impressed. In my book it is a much better destination than downtown or "Mill". A winning hockey team and a first class casino nearby would do wonders for the area.
Everyone has their own individual preferences, but Mill Ave is one of the few authentic urban retail districts in all of metro Phoenix. Westgate is a generic chain store development that looks like hundreds of others springing up across the US. What's worse is that it will likely be largely abandoned in 20 years in favor of the next new thing.
+2. We go to Westgate frequently and not for hockey. I love the look of the place with the huge LED signs, the fountains, and the bars and restaurants all grouped together. It is one of the best places in the metro to take visitors. They are always impressed. In my book it is a much better destination than downtown or "Mill". A winning hockey team and a first class casino nearby would do wonders for the area.
Agreed. Something like the caliber of Wild Horse Pass in Chandler off of the 10. I'm not a gambler but I was extremely impressed. They need some synergistic businesses that make it even more of destination drive.
Because the Suns are drawing so well in their downtown venue . Look at the attendance numbers and stop making stuff up. The Coyotes are not drawing bigger crowds in Tempe, Scottsdale, or Downtown Phoenix. Phoenix people simply do not support Hockey. Right now Phoenix fans minimally support the Suns and they have a "prime" location.
The NFL is a different beast so the Cardinals draw well (still near the bottom for NFL teams).
Most concerts at Jobing.com sell out. I'm sure Justin Timberlake and Katy Perry sell out their dates at Jobing.com.
The Suns may not have the best attendance record in the NBA, but their location is centrally located like it should be with established infrastructure already in place. Most of all, the Suns didn't need to have taxpayers subsidize their team & arena. So as far as Glendale is concerned, what we're dealing with is a city that is forcing taxpayers to finance what amounts to a hockey team with poor attendance in a bad location in the middle of cotton fields, and the city still ends up in the red. Makes a lot of sense.
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If the location of Jobing.com isn't that much of an issue, perhaps you can explain why all the development surrounding Westgate never materialized. That area should have been fully developed at least five years ago ... but look around: vacant land full of empty promises still dot the landscape. There again, if the location isn't the issue, then Glendale wouldn't need to use taxpayer money to keep Jobing.com and the Coyotes there because they would be self supporting so that revenue from all the ticket sales & Westgate business would be enough to keep them afloat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised
I was at Westgate last night. That makes it the 3rd time this month. If Westgate was in Gilbert or Chandler, I would never go there.
If Westgate was in Chandler or Gilbert, I wouldn't go there either ... and the reason is (just like the Glendale location) it's too far away, and not centrally located. The last time I was at Jobing.com was nearly four years ago when I went to see Paul McCartney. I have had no need to return since then ... but I will be attending some Suns games, and the Billy Joel concert in June at U.S. Airways Center downtown & taking the light rail. That's something else Westgate doesn't have: adequate forms of transportation except getting there by car. There again, U.S. Airways & Chase Field have established infrastructure, Westgate does not.
If the location of Jobing.com isn't that much of an issue, perhaps you can explain why all the development surrounding Westgate never materialized. That area should have been fully developed at least five years ago ... but look around: vacant land full of empty promises still dot the landscape. There again, if the location isn't the issue, then Glendale wouldn't need to use taxpayer money to keep Jobing.com and the Coyotes there because they would be self supporting so that revenue from all the ticket sales & Westgate business would be enough to keep them afloat.
Things have changed a little since 2003. A massive Phoenix area recession comes to mind. There has been a ton of development that has been shelved in just about every town. Their timing was terrible (as well as their management skills). But it is tough to maintain your vision when you are on the brink of bankruptcy. I'm not surprised what happened because it was a new development. But you asked why the vision wasn't realized that there you have it.
It's completely obvious to me that one day those cotton fields will be business and homes. The only question remaining is when. Builders are buying land beyond the white tanks and the Valley is projected to grow beyond 6.5M. It's hypothesized that there will be mini built-up city centers and I agree. Glendale is trying to grow up to that future city.
Also the Glendale city council seem to politicking and people need to vote them out and start fresh. For instance a casino would help draw people to that area but the east side Gilariver tribe is trying the buy their influence to stop it. See http://www.yourwestvalley.com/glenda...9bb2963f4.html The mayor took their money for an advertising campaign to stop them from coming.
Someone is going to make money at that venture. It just may not be the city of Glendale. But with a couple of smarter moves and a healthier economy, they should be in the black.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valley Native
If Westgate was in Chandler or Gilbert, I wouldn't go there either ... and the reason is (just like the Glendale location) it's too far away, and not centrally located. The last time I was at Jobing.com was nearly four years ago when I went to see Paul McCartney. I have had no need to return since then ... but I will be attending some Suns games, and the Billy Joel concert in June at U.S. Airways Center downtown & taking the light rail. That's something else Westgate doesn't have: adequate forms of transportation except getting there by car. There again, U.S. Airways & Chase Field have established infrastructure, Westgate does not.
The reality is "centrally located" is too far away for me to go unless there is a concert that I really need to see. Billy Joel comes to mind and that would be tempting. Since early 2011, I've been downtown once by accident. I have no desire to go that far. But I do see what you are saying. My point is mini downtown areas will develop in the coming decades. I predict those cotton fields will be where it occurs in the future.
This has been rehashed over and over. Moving the Coyotes to Glendale was always going to be problematic. Glendale got the team to play there, but what's played out with the city having to subsidize the situation was always a likely outcome. Going from a central metro location to a far west location basically cuts off a sizable chunk of the team's fanbase. I went to a few Coyotes games when they are in the downtown area, but haven't been to one yet in Glendale. It's just a really long drive from where I live in the east valley.
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. Look at the attendance numbers and stop making stuff up. The Coyotes are not drawing bigger crowds in Tempe, Scottsdale, or Downtown Phoenix. Phoenix people simply do not support Hockey. Right now Phoenix fans minimally support the Suns and they have a "prime" location. 
There has been a ton of development that has been shelved in just about every town. Their timing was terrible (as well as their management skills). But it is tough to maintain your vision when you are on the brink of bankruptcy. I'm not surprised what happened because it was a new development. But you asked why the vision wasn't realized that there you have it. 
