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I'm up for promotion and will possibly be relocating from Northern VA to Phoenix. Of course I'm putting in extensive research before I make a decision and I see lots of stuff about the area that appeals to me. However one theme stands out to me. Gangs and racist groups seem prevelant in the area. I'm black, my wife is white and we have two boys 6 and 3 years old. I know racism exists everywhere and I am politically fairly conservative and not thin skinned or hypersensitive but some of the stuff I have seen is a bit disturbing. I don't want to move my family to a place to be a target of violence or hatred. I grew up in the deep south but the issues I've seen on the net make me wary of Arizona in general so I figured I'd ask the experts who actually live there. Is it really that prevelant or am I falling victim to google exaggeration. Any help would be appreciated.
My wife and I and three kids will be moving from Northern VA to Phoenix as well, in mid August. We have visited three times and love it. I think you will find people in the West so much more friendly than the East. I grew up in the West and have waited years to return. Finally grew tired of the winters, and the terrible pace of NoVa, and the self-centeredness of the people in this area.
Most of NoVa is rather affluent, the likes of which only parts of Phoenix can seem to compare. Certainly you will want to avoid the higher crime areas, if possible.
We live in Front Royal, but I commute and work all over NoVa, in Manassas, Woodbridge, Fairfax, etc.
I would say there is a lot more racist, or racially bent, people in this area than I have ever encountered out West. More of a 'live and let live' attitude out there, which i personally think still stems from some of the pioneering spirit of the original groups of Americans that started to venture out west.
Do a little more digging. At its best the east coast in general is a factor of 3 or 4 tmes as bad. Yes they exist. They can be a problem in local areas particularly of poor Hispanics. You planning on living in a poor Hispanic area?
Otherwise you never come across one anymore have a problem with it.
The only thing a mixed couple need to fear is conservatives...and they are much more prevalent in Phoenix than gangbangers. There is however a special out for Black conservatives.
What? Are you saying that conservatives are by definition racist? Wow. Maybe you should look up the definition for "bigotry" yourself. That is a really ugly thing to say. Accusing someone of racism is a pretty serious thing. To accuse a group of people of it when you have not met the individuals is purely hateful and ignorant.
I am a left-leaning moderate, btw. Your implication grosses me out. Mindless namecalling and division are wrecking this country. Intellectually lazy people looking to make themselves feel superior to others make statements like this.
To the point, why would you put that idea in the OP's head? That he should "fear" conservatives as a mixed-race couple?
TBH, I have never met anyone, here in MT (which is also pretty conservative and even more predominantly white than Phoenix) or in our many visits to Phoenix and now as a part-timer there who would bat an eye at a mixed-race couple. Maybe a few old-timers, but even they would acknowledge that "times have changed." It IS predominantly white out west--that's just the way the demographic ball bounced. But it's changing from all directions, obviously, and I don't know anyone who is unhappy about that unless you get people talking about immigration as a policy issue, not a racial issue. THEN you'll hear some opinions!
Most of Phoenix is really suburban in feel and attitude. People are friendly but not nosy and generally accepting of others.
As for "conservatives"--first of all, it's not like people go around talking politics all the time, and not like everyone in Arizona is of the same political persuasion. Newsflash: There are liberals and moderates living happily in AZ!! And "conservative" doesn't mean they are all headed to the open-carry rally in their pickups.
Edited to remove the name I called someone.
To the OP--I would be more concerned about whether the weather suits you than I would about gangs, violence, or racism in Phoenix. It's a very welcoming place. It's clean. The cost of living is great compared to other metro areas. It's "happy," I think. But from the threads on C-D, I've come to realize that the weather I love isn't for everyone!
Do a little more digging. At its best the east coast in general is a factor of 3 or 4 tmes as bad. Yes they exist. They can be a problem in local areas particularly of poor Hispanics. You planning on living in a poor Hispanic area?
Otherwise you never come across one anymore have a problem with it.
The only thing a mixed couple need to fear is conservatives...and they are much more prevalent in Phoenix than gangbangers. There is however a special out for Black conservatives.
What a idiotic statement. Ones political leanings have nothing to do with racism though one side likes to pretend it does.
As can be seen in this thread, there is little/no issue with racism in the state and since the state leans conservative this proves just the opposite of what you're trying to imply. Matter of fact, people are saying the liberal bastions of the east coast are much more racist then you'll find out here.
Lets stick to the facts and refrain from inflammatory political rhetoric.
I second Goodyear (of course!) if it's within an acceptable drive to your workplace. A range of home prices, nice subdivisions, and plenty of rentals as well. Overall a very clean, inviting place with a low crime rate. From what I've read there are good schools as well, though we're not there full time to use them so I can't say first hand.
I do think there are cultural differences a person would have to get used to when moving from the east coast to a western state--I've heard many transplants say that life/attitudes/pace are different out west, and I think there are threads here on C-D on that very topic. I suppose it's not for everyone. But during our home search a few months ago, we met MANY transplants from the east coast who love Phoenix and "would never go back." In Verrado in particular (Buckeye) it seemed like most of the people we chatted with were from the eastern U.S. Whether they love Phoenix in general or Verrado specifically I don't know. I can see where Verrado with its treelined streets and green lawns would appeal to those who aren't crazy about the desert landscaping in the area.
Truly I think the biggest consideration is the difference in weather as I and others mentioned. Plenty of threads on that topic as well, of course! In general I think the City Data forums are a great place to get your reality check.
Getting down to serious issues, and speaking from experience, just don't let anyone tell you they've NEVER seen a cockroach in Phoenix. Or kissing bugs. Or gigantic Palo Verde beetles what FLY. Lies. All lies.
And you should probably review a few of the scorpion threads before you make any hasty decisions. These are the things truly reasonable people lay awake worrying about!
Last edited by Montanama; 07-14-2014 at 11:09 AM..
What? Are you saying that conservatives are by definition racist? Wow. Maybe you should look up the definition for "bigotry" yourself. That is a really ugly thing to say. Accusing someone of racism is a pretty serious thing. To accuse a group of people of it when you have not met the individuals is purely hateful and ignorant.
I am a left-leaning moderate, btw. Your implication grosses me out. Mindless namecalling and division are wrecking this country. Intellectually lazy people looking to make themselves feel superior to others make statements like this.
To the point, why would you put that idea in the OP's head? That he should "fear" conservatives as a mixed-race couple?
TBH, I have never met anyone, here in MT (which is also pretty conservative and even more predominantly white than Phoenix) or in our many visits to Phoenix and now as a part-timer there who would bat an eye at a mixed-race couple. Maybe a few old-timers, but even they would acknowledge that "times have changed." It IS predominantly white out west--that's just the way the demographic ball bounced. But it's changing from all directions, obviously, and I don't know anyone who is unhappy about that unless you get people talking about immigration as a policy issue, not a racial issue. THEN you'll hear some opinions!
Most of Phoenix is really suburban in feel and attitude. People are friendly but not nosy and generally accepting of others.
As for "conservatives"--first of all, it's not like people go around talking politics all the time, and not like everyone in Arizona is of the same political persuasion. Newsflash: There are liberals and moderates living happily in AZ!! And "conservative" doesn't mean they are all headed to the open-carry rally in their pickups.
Edited to remove the name I called someone.
To the OP--I would be more concerned about whether the weather suits you than I would about gangs, violence, or racism in Phoenix. It's a very welcoming place. It's clean. The cost of living is great compared to other metro areas. It's "happy," I think. But from the threads on C-D, I've come to realize that the weather I love isn't for everyone!
Why don't you let the conservatives defend their own bastions? And yes the conservative do sometimes have a difficult time with racial matters.
None of this would be expected to bother our OP who clearly stated...
Quote:
I'm black, my wife is white and we have two boys 6 and 3 years old. I know racism exists everywhere and I am politically fairly conservative and not thin skinned or hypersensitive but some of the stuff I have seen is a bit disturbing.
Why don't you let the conservatives defend their own bastions? And yes the conservative do sometimes have a difficult time with racial matters.
None of this would be expected to bother our OP who clearly stated...
Because I'm sick and tired of mindless stereotypes OF ALL KINDS being thrown about without anyone challenging them. My nature is to ignore such drivel and mind my business. But I see more of it every day, and it's paralyzing our nation. I'm not going to sit back and let it slide anymore; if you say something stupid, harmful, and wrong I am going to challenge it no matter at whom it's directed.
Because Phoenix seems to me a very nice, welcoming place and you are giving someone the impression that he has something to fear in Phoenix specifically that is simply NOT the case, and I just don't know why anyone would do that.
And if you were certain it wouldn't bother the OP, there was no reason to bring it up. Except to be hateful.
Come on over to the sunny side, where we look for the best in people and don't go around spreading ugly nonsense about people we don't even know. It's lovely here, and we can build great things together when we act like adults and work/live/play with people of all philosophical, political, racial, cultural stripes.
SOME conservatives are racist. Not all or even most. Some liberals are racist. Not all or even most. Some City-Data posters are morons. Not all or even most.
Last edited by Montanama; 07-14-2014 at 11:43 AM..
Because I'm sick and tired of mindless stereotypes OF ALL KINDS being thrown about without anyone challenging them. My nature is to ignore such drivel and mind my business. But I see more of it every day, and it's paralyzing our nation. I'm not going to sit back and let it slide anymore; if you say something stupid, harmful, and wrong I am going to challenge it no matter at whom it's directed.
And if you were certain it wouldn't bother the OP, there was no reason to bring it up. Except to be hateful.
Come on over to the sunny side, where we look for the best in people and don't go around spreading ugly nonsense about people we don't even know. It's lovely here, and we can build great things together when we act like adults and work/live/play with people of all philosophical, political, racial, cultural stripes.
SOME conservatives are racist. Not all or even most. Some liberals are racist. Not all or even most. Some City-Data posters are morons. Not all or even most.
Let me be blunt as you will accept nothing less. There is a large and mostly conservative majority in Maricopa County that has obvious and enforced hatred for Hispanics. You decide if it is racial or ethnic but it is real. All rolled up in Joe Arpaio.
Now having pulled this way off the OP's subject I suggest we quit.
I'm from Pennsylvania, and I've been in Mesa for 35 years. I've worked in home construction for most of that time, and I've seen the whole area. Where your work is located is a vast industrial area. I don't know what you want in housing, but the older, more run down housing is directly east and north of your work area. If you want to live in a nice area, I would look to the west; along the north and south of I-10. But the commute going east on I-10 in the mornings, and west in the evenings can be a drudgery if you work normal daytime. My in-laws live in a develpment called Garden Lakes, near 107th Ave. and Thomas. It's a nice area and prices are in the mid 200's and up right now I believe. Schools also seem to be better, the further you live to the west, north, or east of downtown Phoenix, but you'll find that the north valley and east valley are a prohibitive commute to Lower Buckeye. Goodyear, Litchfield Park, Verrado, parts of Avondale, all have nice homes, and are 10 to 20 miles from your work.
If you don't mind 5-6 months of dry heat, (definitely different than Virginia), you'll fall in love with late October through April. And the 'critters' aren't a problem usually either. There are some areas that have a particular pest, like scorpions near orange orchards, or rattlesnakes in the open desert areas, but in most of the developed areas, normal pest control takes care of them. It's not like you are going to see a rattlesnake wandering around. I've only had to deal with 5 rattlers in 35 years, and it was because I was in an area that was being developed from open desert, and the snakes were getting dislodged from their natural habitat.
The other posters here are correct on bigotry and racism. It's less than back east. Of course, there are a few here and there, but for the most part, it is negligable. And interacial couples are everywhere here. It's nothing unusual. Most of the gang stuff that I have seen is in the more run down communities, and every city in the area has some of it, but it's not a huge problem for most people. Drugs and gun violence are here also, but you are probably more likely to be struck by lightning than to encounter those things first hand, as long as you don't look for that kind of trouble. I would keep everything locked though, after all, this isn't rural countryside in the '50's.
Hopefully, you are fully aware of the wage differences here, and know exactly what you are going to be receiving. Depending on your job type, it could be considerably lower than Virginia, but the cost of living is also a bit cheaper.
If you haven't visited, I'd do that before you make a decision, if you can. -Good Luck!
The only thing a mixed couple need to fear is conservatives...
The only thing I fear is a statement such as this that in my view is the definition of blatant stereotyping. Good grief.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvoc
There is a large and mostly conservative majority in Maricopa County that has obvious and enforced hatred for Hispanics.
Again with the stereotyping.....wow. Have you considered maybe it's a response by a majority of people in AZ getting sick of people sneaking across our border illegally, no matter their race/ethnicity, feeling it's unfair to people who play by the rules and come here legally?
Anyways, back to topic.....OP.....as many have said already, and in my experience living here in AZ for many years now, it's a pretty much live and let live place. I wish you the best if you make your way out here and if you do, I hope you enjoy living in the Phoenix metro as much as we do.
Let me be blunt as you will accept nothing less. There is a large and mostly conservative majority in Maricopa County that has obvious and enforced hatred for Hispanics. You decide if it is racial or ethnic but it is real. All rolled up in Joe Arpaio.
Now having pulled this way off the OP's subject I suggest we quit.
I think you mean a "hatred" for illegal immigration. Their race or ethnicity has nothing to do with it. I enjoy the Hispanic culture of the southwest and the LEGAL Hispanic people that have resided here long before I got here. I bet most of the "large and mostly conservative majority in Maricopa County" feel the same way.
I would feel the same way about illegal immigration if it was Germans, Swedes, Chinese, etc. illegally crossing the border.
It makes a better talking point for the left to turn it into a racial issue though.
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These are the things truly reasonable people lay awake worrying about!
